[BRASSO]

musclebud, on 19 April 2012 - 10:39 PM, said:

Warning.... Warning... Never get into a disagreement with someone that has a particular corps as their avatar. Otherwise if don't predict their corps from moving from 10th to top six you will feel never hear the end of it.

Most Miss Cleo's learn early in their crystal ball reading careers to always say more good things seen in the crystal ball on the person's future than bad things. The tips are WAY, WAY bigger that way they're told by the pros.

[blazek]

jjeffeory, on 20 April 2012 - 03:50 PM, said:

Eh, Just because they're playing Lady Gaga music means nothing. They won with James Bond music and people were criticizing that music at the beginning of the season on here.

I'm sure there will be several strong corps out there and Crown and BD will be strong corps for sure!

But, it's probably not fair to compare pop music to extremely iconic (and orchestral) cinematic music (007 is actually one of my favorite shows). However, I feel like the pop music and the overall show concept might lend itself to the kind of "cheese" that prevents a show from going all the way, like Crown '11 and Cavies '07. Pretty much all of the winning shows of the past couple decades have had largely serious/emotional undertones, which makes me doubt whether a show with much "cheese" can be very successful competitively.

However, it's very possible that Cavies will avoid this trap; if any design team can, it's them. Cadets are also in a similar situation with their Christmas concept, but I hope that they avoid the "Cheese" as well. BD and Crown however, have much more serious concepts that might be more conducive of a championship, IMO.

In any event, this is gonna be a #### good year for the activity.

[CQuinn]

MisterA, on 19 April 2012 - 07:46 PM, said:

Interesting, most interesting. While it is usually true that BD, Cavies and Cadets usually do win because they are the best, there are times when it actually does work against them. For example in 2008, they should have been well over 2 points ahead of Phantom or Carolina Crown, and yet they ended up 2nd and 3rd. And as for Phantom not placing top 12, they have always deserved to be in the top 12, but did receive some extra boosts from the judges in 2008, where it was more than obvious on a total performance level they should have been neck and neck with Crown for 3rd and 4th place. But the fans got what they wanted that year, and DCI probably saw a huge boost in ticket sales and merchandising over the next couple of years because of it. Was it a refreshing change seeing a new champion, of course, but was it honestly deserved, no.
Boston probably ends up averaging out to where they should be usually. A couple of years they have probably been overscored, and a couple of years they have probably been underscored. But overall 3 of the last 6 years, things have been kind of wacky with the judging. I think in 2006, DCI started listening to everyone moan about how things never change during finals week in placements. So between semis and finals that year, 9 or 10 of the corps ended up changing positions, which if I am not mistaken set the all time record for most changes between semis and finals.

I think I just figured out what the "A" stands for in your Handle...

[jjeffeory]

Here's the thing.... Lots of the James Bond music has been "pop" music through out the ages... Check out some of the Bond music and notice how much of that were "pop" hits...

Also, understand that VK performed a James Bond show in the 80s ( you can see it on FN under 1986 James Bond - James Bond Theme * From Russia With Love * Goldfinger * Live and Let Die * For Your Eyes Only * Ending ) - People were freaking out and wondering how Cavies' 2004 007 should could NOT be cheesy with that music (007 - Selections from Goldeneye * Hovercraft (from Die Another Day) * Welcome To Cuba * Paris and Bond (from Tomorrow Never Dies) ) just like some people have hinted out a little right now. They were wondering Cavies could that kind of show different enough not from the other drum corps version NOT to come off as cheesy... Well, they pulled it off then.... Also, remember that for 2/3rd of the season, Cavies ended with "For Your Eyes Only" and it STILL wasn't cheesy... I actually missed that tune...

Anyway, I am 100% positive that Cavies will not be cheesy with any of this music and will make good use of the Germanotta and Fusari piece....

blazek, on 20 April 2012 - 07:25 PM, said:

But, it's probably not fair to compare pop music to extremely iconic (and orchestral) cinematic music (007 is actually one of my favorite shows). However, I feel like the pop music and the overall show concept might lend itself to the kind of "cheese" that prevents a show from going all the way, like Crown '11 and Cavies '07. Pretty much all of the winning shows of the past couple decades have had largely serious/emotional undertones, which makes me doubt whether a show with much "cheese" can be very successful competitively.

However, it's very possible that Cavies will avoid this trap; if any design team can, it's them. Cadets are also in a similar situation with their Christmas concept, but I hope that they avoid the "Cheese" as well. BD and Crown however, have much more serious concepts that might be more conducive of a championship, IMO.

In any event, this is gonna be a #### good year for the activity.

[GREENBLUE]

blazek, on 20 April 2012 - 07:25 PM, said:

But, it's probably not fair to compare pop music to extremely iconic (and orchestral) cinematic music (007 is actually one of my favorite shows). However, I feel like the pop music and the overall show concept might lend itself to the kind of "cheese" that prevents a show from going all the way, like Crown '11 and Cavies '07. Pretty much all of the winning shows of the past couple decades have had largely serious/emotional undertones, which makes me doubt whether a show with much "cheese" can be very successful competitively.

However, it's very possible that Cavies will avoid this trap; if any design team can, it's them. Cadets are also in a similar situation with their Christmas concept, but I hope that they avoid the "Cheese" as well. BD and Crown however, have much more serious concepts that might be more conducive of a championship, IMO.

In any event, this is gonna be a #### good year for the activity.

While I understand your point, I wouldnt be so quick to judge a show concept. Was "Mad World" cheesy? Was "Machine" Cheesy? Was "007" cheesy? Any of the those three concepts could of lent themselves to the cheese factor, but instead earned the Cavaliers two world championships and a silver medal.

My point is...wait until you see/hear the product before stating a show concept cant win a title because it isnt serious. If I remember correctly many on this board thought that Crown should of won the title in'09....but tinkerbell on a drum major stand isnt cheesy? On the other hand, I thought the Cadets '10 Toy Souldier sounded like a cool concept until I saw Little Jeffey and well,.....need I say more.

Don't forget the judges sheets are changing this summer as well, so I don't think it's a bad idea for the Cavies to play the crowd.

There are seven selections in the Cavies rep this summer, to the extent in which each is used, we shall soon find out. Who knows Paparazzi could be 30 seconds.

I do agree with one thing though...I think this is shaping up to be a great year for drum corps.

[GeneralTsoChicken]

jjeffeory, on 20 April 2012 - 03:50 PM, said:

Eh, Just because they're playing Lady Gaga music means nothing. They won with James Bond music and people were criticizing that music at the beginning of the season on here.

I'm sure there will be several strong corps out there and Crown and BD will be strong corps for sure!

PLUS, their last few shows have used the source music more for different motifs and directions to go in.

These aren't going to be like BD last year, if I had to guess (transcribed arrangements almost verse for verse).

These will probably be more like Cavaliers last year, just some hints of both major pieces of source music intertwining in their own directions.

Cavaliers can get away with cheesy way more than Cadets and Crown. I think they can get away with it, because they do it better than everyone else. They've been doing the cheesy antics for a long time---BUT--- when it is designed well, executed well, and has flair that no one else can do... it suddenly isn't cheesy any more.

I don't think they will do well because of visual design, but I definitely wouldn't dog on their source music. If anyone can pull off lady gaga, it is them.

[TheClutch]

GeneralTsoChicken, on 21 April 2012 - 09:13 AM, said:

PLUS, their last few shows have used the source music more for different motifs and directions to go in.

These aren't going to be like BD last year, if I had to guess (transcribed arrangements almost verse for verse).

These will probably be more like Cavaliers last year, just some hints of both major pieces of source music intertwining in their own directions.

Cavaliers can get away with cheesy way more than Cadets and Crown. I think they can get away with it, because they do it better than everyone else. They've been doing the cheesy antics for a long time---BUT--- when it is designed well, executed well, and has flair that no one else can do... it suddenly isn't cheesy any more.

I don't think they will do well because of visual design, but I definitely wouldn't dog on their source music. If anyone can pull off lady gaga, it is them.

I agree.

The only thing they can't do is "cute" cheese. Because theyre all guys..

[blazek]

GREENBLUE, on 21 April 2012 - 02:56 AM, said:

While I understand your point, I wouldnt be so quick to judge a show concept. Was "Mad World" cheesy? Was "Machine" Cheesy? Was "007" cheesy? Any of the those three concepts could of lent themselves to the cheese factor, but instead earned the Cavaliers two world championships and a silver medal.

My point is...wait until you see/hear the product before stating a show concept cant win a title because it isnt serious. If I remember correctly many on this board thought that Crown should of won the title in'09....but tinkerbell on a drum major stand isnt cheesy? On the other hand, I thought the Cadets '10 Toy Souldier sounded like a cool concept until I saw Little Jeffey and well,.....need I say more.

Don't forget the judges sheets are changing this summer as well, so I don't think it's a bad idea for the Cavies to play the crowd.

There are seven selections in the Cavies rep this summer, to the extent in which each is used, we shall soon find out. Who knows Paparazzi could be 30 seconds.

I do agree with one thing though...I think this is shaping up to be a great year for drum corps.

I personally didn't think Machine or 007 were cheesy, and Mad World had a lot of serious undertones that it was easy to forget the 30 seconds of extremely cheesy music in the middle of their ballad; this will probably be the same with this year's show, and the rest of it will be pretty awesome, consisering the rest of the rep. The Cavies definitely have a way with making unusual show designs work, and this year probably won't be much different.

Please don't think that I'm saying it will be a bad show, I think it will be extremely entertaining! I personally loved Rach Star and Toy Soldier, but I can understand from a design/conceptual perspective why they weren't more successful competitively; show design is EVERYTHING at that level. When I look back at past years though, usually there are only one or two shows with a "championship caliber" design. Will the Cavaliers be one of them this year? Will Cadets, SCV, Phantom, Crown, or BD have a winning concept? It remains to be seen. My money is still on Crown and BD. Still looking forward to the rest of the shows!

[Hook'emCavies]

blazek, on 20 April 2012 - 07:25 PM, said:

But, it's probably not fair to compare pop music to extremely iconic (and orchestral) cinematic music (007 is actually one of my favorite shows). However, I feel like the pop music and the overall show concept might lend itself to the kind of "cheese" that prevents a show from going all the way, like Crown '11 and Cavies '07. Pretty much all of the winning shows of the past couple decades have had largely serious/emotional undertones, which makes me doubt whether a show with much "cheese" can be very successful competitively.

However, it's very possible that Cavies will avoid this trap; if any design team can, it's them. Cadets are also in a similar situation with their Christmas concept, but I hope that they avoid the "Cheese" as well. BD and Crown however, have much more serious concepts that might be more conducive of a championship, IMO.

In any event, this is gonna be a #### good year for the activity.

I do agree with what you are saying... However, I think The Cadets are of a higher risk of the cheese factor than The Cavaliers right now. And honestly as soon as the The Cavaliers announced the 2012 program. I got a very good gut feeling about the show. And since I have been a fan of them... this is the first time they have accomplished this... I really don't think The Cavaliers are going to get stuck with the cheese factor either. Is it possible? Yes, but I think what they are going to do is morph 2010 and 2011 and make a killer show. But of course I could be wrong. Who knows really... Heck i'm just excited for this year to start!

[BRASSO]

Hook, on 21 April 2012 - 11:02 AM, said:

I do agree with what you are saying... However, I think The Cadets are of a higher risk of the cheese factor than The Cavaliers right now.

I hope so.

I want Cheese.... more cheese... EXTRA cheese, thank you very much.

"I want it all...

I want it all.....

I want it now !! " ( with apologies to Freddie Mercury, Queen. )

This post has been edited by BRASSO: 21 April 2012 - 11:11 AM