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New to World Class?


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#1 Jeff Ream

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Posted 16 February 2012 - 12:07 AM

So with all of the talk that dominated the last few months about who should be moved out of World Class with some folks views on what constitutes World Class, given how DCI currently defines the WC, who do you think is next to move up?

Obviously Oregon Crusaders generate a lot of talk. Music City as well.


Anyone else?

thoughts?

Jeff Ream
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#2 stevedb1975

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Posted 16 February 2012 - 03:26 AM

I'm not really sure who should be next but I do feel very strongly that now that we are back to a combined class prelims and semifinals, I do NOT think that any corps who is not making the top 25 (combined class semifinals) should be eligable for World Class. Pioneer, sorry guys....but you need to move down to Open Class. World Class is just not your play ground at the moment. As for moving up, Blue Devils B charged all the way to 19th last year with the new combined system. They would be very deserving of World Class Membership at this point. It would be neat to see the Blue Devil Organization with two World Class Corps.



#3 3rd Glasgow BB

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Posted 16 February 2012 - 06:00 AM

How about a promotion/demotion system much like we have for the tour of champions.

Every year the top two OC corps move up to WC and the bottom two WC corps move down to OC?

I think this would involve DCI changing their criteria about what exactly an OC corps would need in place to move up to WC i.e. be a little less strict on their WC entry criteria.

just a thought.


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#4 Stu

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Posted 16 February 2012 - 09:10 AM

How about a promotion/demotion system much like we have for the tour of champions.

Every year the top two OC corps move up to WC and the bottom two WC corps move down to OC?

I think this would involve DCI changing their criteria about what exactly an OC corps would need in place to move up to WC i.e. be a little less strict on their WC entry criteria.

just a thought.

I'm not really sure who should be next but I do feel very strongly that now that we are back to a combined class prelims and semifinals, I do NOT think that any corps who is not making the top 25 (combined class semifinals) should be eligable for World Class. Pioneer, sorry guys....but you need to move down to Open Class. World Class is just not your play ground at the moment. As for moving up, Blue Devils B charged all the way to 19th last year with the new combined system. They would be very deserving of World Class Membership at this point. It would be neat to see the Blue Devil Organization with two World Class Corps.

I strongly agree with both of these postings; a corps which places 25th or higher on Friday should be automatically required to compete in the WC division the next season. However, the BD and SCV organizations would never allow this to occur even if the BDB and SCV Cadets were to make the Saturday Finals. And to me the unwillingness of DCI to move any corps up in classification when that corps is clearly WC caliber is grossly unfair to the rest of the OC corps who can only fund themselves as lower division corps; and the allowance for WC caliber corps to compete for the OC title goes completely against the idea to have an OC comprised of non-WC caliber corps.

#5 actucker

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Posted 16 February 2012 - 10:34 AM

I think this is one of the ways that WGI has things way more figured out than DCI.

For those of you who aren't familiar with the system, the classifications in WGI are A, Open, and World (there is more to it on guard side, but for simplicity, we'll just use those three). The classes are determined not by ensemble size, but by what the ensemble is being asked to do. The more complicated the performer's responsibilities, the higher the class. Groups can choose to compete in a higher class if they wish, but must take responsibility for poor results if their group is not ready. If a group is determined to be ready for the next class by WGI, they are moved up. End of discussion. There is an appeals process, but I don't know of many groups that have appealed a promotion and won.

There can be plenty of arguments about how the classifications are working in WGI. I actually had a long conversation with a friend just the other day about how percussion side could use a fourth classification, as A class has become enormous with large disparities from the top to the bottom. But the idea is sound, and makes total sense.

#6 lastknight

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Posted 16 February 2012 - 11:47 AM

I thought I had somehow stumbled out of DCP for a minute. So many positive points made and with reasonable defense....wow!

That being said, let's not forget that one of the great differences between WC and OC is touring expectation. While BDB may qualify up in 19, I doubt that a WC tour model is in the cards for them anytime soon.

ALSO....(dinosaur alert) I might add that early on (under the old Open Class/Class A/All-Girl scenario) there were many more "Open Class" corps than there were Semi Finals Slots (25). Thats too arbitrary a number to be a "cut off" in my humble opinion.


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#7 corpsband

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Posted 16 February 2012 - 12:22 PM

I strongly agree with both of these postings; a corps which places 25th or higher on Friday should be automatically required to compete in the WC division the next season. However, the BD and SCV organizations would never allow this to occur even if the BDB and SCV Cadets were to make the Saturday Finals. And to me the unwillingness of DCI to move any corps up in classification when that corps is clearly WC caliber is grossly unfair to the rest of the OC corps who can only fund themselves as lower division corps; and the allowance for WC caliber corps to compete for the OC title goes completely against the idea to have an OC comprised of non-WC caliber corps.

I agree with you from the "fair-play" point of view.

OTOH I don't think DCI should be forcing a corps to tour beyond their financial means. Granted there *are* WC corps with a limited tour so I suppose that's an option.

Not sure what the answer is. But if I were an open-class corps competing with corps who are clearly and consistently beating world class units, I'd be upset too.

Edited by corpsband, 16 February 2012 - 12:23 PM.

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#8 Stu

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Posted 16 February 2012 - 01:53 PM

I agree with you from the "fair-play" point of view.

OTOH I don't think DCI should be forcing a corps to tour beyond their financial means. Granted there *are* WC corps with a limited tour so I suppose that's an option.

Not sure what the answer is. But if I were an open-class corps competing with corps who are clearly and consistently beating world class units, I'd be upset too.

Even in the WC it is the corps choice concerning limiting financial matters not DCI. Here are two examples: 1) Jersey Surf, who run their operations on very limited funds and tour the minimum; and 2) The Academy, who arguably sacrificed a 12th place Finals slot in 2011 to take more than a week off of tour in the middle of the season to stay in the Black.

#9 corpsband

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Posted 16 February 2012 - 02:02 PM

Even in the WC it is the corps choice concerning limiting financial matters not DCI. Here are two examples: 1) Jersey Surf, who run their operations on very limited funds and tour the minimum; and 2) The Academy, who arguably sacrificed a 12th place Finals slot in 2011 to take more than a week off of tour in the middle of the season to stay in the Black.

Right -- but both of those corps *requested* the bump to WC. Obviously BDB has not and (it appears) will not.

The parallel argument is Pioneer who --competitively at least -- is clearly an open class corps but continues to 'compete' in WC.

Do you think Pioneer should be *forced* into Open?

Fantasy, abandoned by reason, produces impossible monsters; united with it, she is the mother of the arts and the origin of marvels.

 

--Francisco de Goya


#10 actucker

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Posted 16 February 2012 - 02:06 PM

Right -- but both of those corps *requested* the bump to WC. Obviously BDB has not and (it appears) will not.

The parallel argument is Pioneer who --competitively at least -- is clearly an open class corps but continues to 'compete' in WC.

Do you think Pioneer should be *forced* into Open?



No. I don't think any group should be forced to compete down a class. To some corps, competing within their class is not the priority. Pioneer has made it clear that its priority is introducing students to a world class tour who might not get the opportunity otherwise. They train less experienced players, and often times, those players go on to other corps. If they are forced to move down and lessen their tour schedule, the corps may lose its membership numbers, thus its viability. Clearly, what they are doing is working for them, as you never hear rumors of Pioneer folding, and the administration seems happy with the role they play in the field. Why force them out of that role?




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