Who are the 5 WC Corps you think will benefit the most with new judgin

[glory]

Well, I believe that I've been to enough Drum Corps shows over the years, and talked to enough people during and after these shows to know how to differentiate between a " golf clap " reception and an enthusiastic reception from audiences of a Corps show...

Using BD 09 and 10 as the example, here's my observation from finals: The applause was enthusiastic.

True enough in my "gourmand" section where Friends of DCI congregate and share their rarified opinions, there were plenty of golf claps. However - and it's a big however - beyond our elite tastes the applause was loud and clear in appreciation. Fair to say that BD those years didn't get the biggest ovations. Still, it would be unfair to say those two champion corps didn't please a majority of the stadium.

Funny thing about the golf clap is it's often drowned out by the real thing.

HH

[Jeff Ream]

Using BD 09 and 10 as the example, here's my observation from finals: The applause was enthusiastic.

True enough in my "gourmand" section where Friends of DCI congregate and share their rarified opinions, there were plenty of golf claps. However - and it's a big however - beyond our elite tastes the applause was loud and clear in appreciation. Fair to say that BD those years didn't get the biggest ovations. Still, it would be unfair to say those two champion corps didn't please a majority of the stadium.

Funny thing about the golf clap is it's often drowned out by the real thing.

HH

funny. from my seat in 2010, it seemed very golf clappy

[BRASSO]

I want to clear up a misconception that seems to be an occasional undercurrent in this thread.

A majority of the fans like the shows.

Yes, and while we are at it, no casual read of the thread comments on this thread can allow one to draw the inference that the collective shows of the Corps was not well received in 2011. The " misconception " would be someone reading what the collective comments do NOT say on this thread. So lets clear up that " misconception " right now it would seem to me. No one has said on this thread that " the majority of fans did not like the shows ". That would be a total and complete misread of what has been said on this thread.No one has said that. So I'm glad we can at least clear up that " fact ", anyway.

Edited May 8, 2012 by BRASSO

[corpsband]

How can you say with certainty that DCP is not " what the majority of fans " think ?

I did not see Phantom Regiment Spartacus show at all. But DCP'ers told us the show was received enthusiastically at Finals. Were they unrepresentative of the audience ? Did they get it wrong ? Did Phantom get a golf clap at Finals, and the DCP'ers were a small group of people that were " hardly evidence " of the Phantom's Finals performance of Spartacus ? Just asking how the logic works here, thats all from those few here on DCP that apparently believe the majority of DCP'ers here are so apparently out of touch with what national audiences are thinking.

I agree Brasso.

I suspect MikeD is conflating DCP opinions and DCP reporting.

I don't think DCP opinion (on a variety of topics) necessarily aligns with audience opinion. I do think you hear the full breadth of opinion here but not necessarily in proportion to the actual distribution of opinions in the audience pool.

I do think DCP reporting is fairly accurate. I manage to get to a number of shows every season and I don't think DCP posters mis-report what's going on at shows. By and large what's reported here matches what I experience at the shows. Do I agree with every opinion posted by every reporter? Absolutely not. I may have thought XYZ was boring and the poster thought XYZ was exciting. OTOH if ABC corps got 5 standing O's during their performance, I would expect to see that reported and the report would match my experience.

Is gauging audience reaction subjective? Yes it is. But that doesn't mean people can't do it. In fact people are remarkably good at assessing dynamics in a crowd (and very often joining them). Just as a performer can notice if an audience is "flat" (without individually reading their minds), so too can an audience member notice if a performance is engaging the audience or not.

As for the BD golf clap -- I think that's just DCP short-hand for a markedly less enthusiastic crowd response in comparison to other programs. Does the entire audience literally golf clap? Of course not. But regardless of the "why", it happens (sometimes more dramatically, sometimes less). You can attribute it to the show design or claim that the audience is full of BD haters. Whatever your rationale, it seems everyone agrees the audience applause has been noticeably less enthusiastic in recent years.

Edited May 8, 2012 by corpsband

[BRASSO]

I agree Brasso.

I suspect Guardling is conflating DCP opinions and DCP reporting.

I don't think DCP opinion (on a variety of topics) necessarily aligns with audience opinion. I do think you hear the full breadth of opinion here but not necessarily in proportion to the actual distribution of opinions in the audience pool.

I do think DCP reporting is fairly accurate. I manage to get to a number of shows every season and I don't think DCP posters mis-report what's going on at shows. By and large what's reported here matches what I experience at the shows. Do I agree with every opinion posted by every reporter? Absolutely not. I have may thought XYZ was boring and the poster thought XYZ was exciting. OTOH if ABC corps got 5 standing O's during their performance, I would expect to see that reported and the report would match my experience.

Is gauging audience reaction subjective? Yes it is. But that doesn't mean people can't do it. In fact people are remarkably good at assessing dynamics in a crowd (and very often joining them). Just as a performer can notice if an audience is "flat" (without individually reading their minds), so too can an audience member notice if a performance is engaging the audience or not.

As for the BD golf clap -- I think that's just DCP short-hand for a markedly less enthusiastic crowd response in comparison to other programs. Does the entire audience literally golf clap? Of course not. But regardless of the "why", it happens (sometimes more dramatically, sometimes less). You can attribute it to the show design or claim that the audience is full of BD haters. Whatever your rationale, it seems everyone agrees the audience applause has been noticeably less enthusiastic in recent years.

Yup.

[lastknight]

Well I mean, just look at the fans reaction during BD's recent shows vs. say Madisons show last year. While I will not discredit BD for being where they are for a reason, and they are of course the cleanest, arent the new sheets suppose to juxtapose the audiences reactions more. My point is, BD shows dont pull at anyones heart strings, nor make you wanna throw any babys. No matter how good they have been, they arent exactly trying to connect with the audience.

Wow....call me a homer, but I have to respectfully disagree. I thought BD brought a total package to the field in '12. As a brass player I'll concede that Crown was cleaner and earned the Ott, but BD's demand on paper and related to movement was significantly higher. As far as heart strings it was a love story gone wrong where forgiveness ruled the day.

If I was a homer for anyone, BTW, it was Madison. It's a Dad thing.

[BRASSO]

As far as heart strings it was a love story gone wrong where forgiveness ruled the day.

I got BD's 2011 theme. It came through loud and clear. I " got it ". Just way too much brass line bullet playing, ie a bit too choppy in arrangements, albeit executed exceedingly well. But in the end, my " forgiveness ruled the day " on it all. But 2012 is a new year, with a new chance to fall in love with BD all over again. I havn't asked for a BD divorce. I believe that there are still some reconcilable differences that can be worked out between me and them.

Edited May 8, 2012 by BRASSO

[MikeD]

I agree Brasso.

I suspect MikeD is conflating DCP opinions and DCP reporting.

I don't think DCP opinion (on a variety of topics) necessarily aligns with audience opinion. I do think you hear the full breadth of opinion here but not necessarily in proportion to the actual distribution of opinions in the audience pool.

I do think DCP reporting is fairly accurate. I manage to get to a number of shows every season and I don't think DCP posters mis-report what's going on at shows. By and large what's reported here matches what I experience at the shows. Do I agree with every opinion posted by every reporter? Absolutely not. I may have thought XYZ was boring and the poster thought XYZ was exciting. OTOH if ABC corps got 5 standing O's during their performance, I would expect to see that reported and the report would match my experience.

Is gauging audience reaction subjective? Yes it is. But that doesn't mean people can't do it. In fact people are remarkably good at assessing dynamics in a crowd (and very often joining them). Just as a performer can notice if an audience is "flat" (without individually reading their minds), so too can an audience member notice if a performance is engaging the audience or not.

As for the BD golf clap -- I think that's just DCP short-hand for a markedly less enthusiastic crowd response in comparison to other programs. Does the entire audience literally golf clap? Of course not. But regardless of the "why", it happens (sometimes more dramatically, sometimes less). You can attribute it to the show design or claim that the audience is full of BD haters. Whatever your rationale, it seems everyone agrees the audience applause has been noticeably less enthusiastic in recent years.

Well, we disagree a bit on this topic. I have reported what I have heard at shows...and seen the opposite reported from others. In this very thread, Jeff mentions BD 2010 receiving a 'golf clap' to Glory's reporting that the overall response was "loud and clear in appreciation" at the very same show.

[BRASSO]

Well, we disagree a bit on this topic. I have reported what I have heard at shows...and seen the opposite reported from others. In this very thread, Jeff mentions BD 2010 receiving a 'golf clap' to Glory's reporting that the overall response was "loud and clear in appreciation" at the very same show.

BD got a polite golf clap from the audience at Allentown in 2010. That was my observation. If you were at this show and observed differently, well thats your take, but your take was a WHOLE lot different than what I observed. But thats fine, MikeD. I saw BD again live in 2011, ( and not in Allentown ) and the reception ( imo ) was a bit better for them, but not the level of " love " audiences have given BD in the past. That was my sense, and the sense I got from talking with quite a few fans after the shows too. I've also witnessed movie theatre reactions to all the Corps shows. BD was not all that well received there either. I 'm just calling it like I see it, MikeD. If you are telling me that BD has been well received by audiences for their shows of late,well then, this has not been my experience at all, and like you said, "we disagree a bit on this topic". As they say, we can agree to disagree.

Edited May 8, 2012 by BRASSO

[lastknight]

BD got a polite golf clap from the audience at Allentown in 2010. That was my observation. If you were at this show and observed differently, well thats your take, but your take was a WHOLE lot different than what I observed. But thats fine, MikeD. I saw BD again live in 2011, ( and not in Allentown ) and the reception ( imo ) was a bit better for them, but not the level of " love " audiences have given BD in the past.

Since the early 80's I can't remember anytime that BD could waltz into Allentown and receive more than a "polite" golf clap. I haven't been to J. Birney Crum in a while, but I would be tasked to think that the "local tenor" has changed considerably.