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Showing content with the highest reputation on 04/24/2017 in all areas

  1. Hey, I never thought of this to add credibility! Great idea! OK if I use it, too? This from a poster who is currently, and has been for over a decade, directly involved with hosting a DCI WC show... Potential show host: "We'd like to run a WC show." DCI: "How much do you have to spend to get corps to your stadium?" PSH: "We think we can cover a contract of $xxx." DCI: "Here's the list of 6 corps for your show and the total cost is below your contract limit." PSH: "But there's not a single top-12 corps in our show! Our highest placement was 12th! We can't sell tickets to that show." DCI: (literally) "That's your lineup if you want it. Take it or leave it." PSH: "Can I trade these two for just one top-12 corps?" DCI: "Contracts are not negotiable, but you can change your date to earlier in the season to lower the cost." PSH: "But the football team is in the stadium..." DCI: "Umm......." What corps are paid per performance is a function of their placement in the prior year and at what point in the tour your show is taking place. There are, essentially, four tiers of prior year placement in the pricing, and early-season shows are less expensive than late-season shows. As an example, we generally have 3 or 4 top-12 and 2 or 3 from 13 on down. This year we are especially pleased to have Pacific Crest and Seattle Cascades in our show, along with Bluecoats, Crossmen, and several others. Our show is July 31st, so we pay a premium to have a show. It's been fairly common that a similar show has cost us $28,000 plus or minus, in the past. Again, show hosts are not permitted to negotiate with corps on either schedule or cost. And there's no "guarantee". As DCI has said to us many times, "You're paying for a lineup" and, if the host doesn't pay the contract prior to the show, the show is cancelled and the corps don't perform but the host still owes the contract price. The only way a show can be cancelled is if the DCI administrator at the show declares the weather so bad that not even a stand-up on the track by one corps cannot be performed. If that standup is done in a drizzle to a nearly empty stadium, the full contract price is due. EDIT: As one might imagine, this incongruity of show host has been a point of contention in the past, specifically as part of the G7 plan which did away entirely with the local TEP hosting scheme. Of the about 106 or 107 shows, 55 to 60 are run by either DCI or the corps. The other 50 or so shows are run by shows whose profit does not, necessarily, help drum corps. Those profits help the, typically, schools that take the risk and pay the contract, then get their music programs involved to sell the event all over their community. The music program gets the profits from the show. Besides the contract payments, if the show does better and makes more money, the corps don't get any of that extra, the music programs do. Forty-five drum corps shows all across the country, and about that same number of drum corps mostly congested into general areas. Another very real issue is the incongruity of the message when DCI has 100 different "music games" going on each summer. But those are usually the actual, local touch that DCI has with the communities, 45 or so of them, that host drum corps shows as TEPs. Five, eight, ten bands all pre-sold by the local host band...that hundreds, maybe thousands, of direct contacts that drum corps has with schools that they get nowhere else. IMO, the notion that the existing corps would be able to replace TEP hosts is not feasible. And, while its true that George can sell them tickets to our show from Allentown, he loses the greatest proponent he has - the local band host looking to make a profit for his music program. I, frankly, have no idea where that spiel came from but, now that I've said it, I'll return to work.
    3 points
  2. I understand Brasso's point, but it's not exactly accurate. While DCI "is the corps", as he says, it is not true that the corps themselves run the competitions, except to the extent that some corps run their own shows. The corps' representatives vote to approve or disapprove (or do so by proxy of those they elect to represent them) just about every issue related to the activity each year so, in that vein, they do "run" things. To answer your specific questions, DCI, individual corps, and Tour Event Partners all produce a show. As part of that responsibility, each host is responsible for providing housing and rehearsal space, showers, and quiet, segregated classrooms for drivers to sleep. Corps directors meet early in the season, before auditions, to discuss, pound out, and sign up for shows on the tour. Each ED chooses his own tour schedule and tour route, then agree to participate at shows along their route. DCI creates the tour by coordinating its own shows with those of the corps and those that are TEP run. Each show host is charged a fee for each corps in its lineup, making up a contracted amount that must be paid prior to the show date. Each corps pays for its own expenses, although DCI does have a line-of-credit that it uses to "front" money to the corps prior to the season start, and is repaid as the season draws fans to the gates. Also, the major part of each corps' tour is decided long before their corps are filled out (WC/OC). While some changes happen during the tour, it's a rarity.
    3 points
  3. Other possible ideas to add interest in Indy: 1. <<insert corps>> meet-and-greet "Meetup" at a local restaurant...go meet fellow Cadets, Blue Coats, Vanguard etc. fans 2. Food trucks...there should be a unique Food Truck Row outside the stadium...the food at Lucas Oil is bad 3. T-shirt tosses (like they do at basketball games) into the crowd? 4. Contests and prizes (maybe shown over the stadium's video monitor in between performances)...like they do at sporting events...Drum Corps questions like, "Tell me when Star of Indiana won the championship?" or whatever...and the fan guesses the answer...win a free whatever. 5. Mini-mini- standing brass line to give unannounced performances inside the stadium...near booths...like they do at Disneyland when all of a sudden a brass line comes out and tears it up 6. Backstage tours? 7. Tours of the Indy Zoo! ; )
    2 points
  4. Exactly correct. Design is meaningless without execution. Despite all the whining about adult-designed programs (which AFAIK has always been the case) sloppy execution is perfectly capable of killing brilliant design. What's grinding some gears here is that there's a certain tolerance level for execution that can be "overcome" by the confluence of design and performance. It's an interesting question (with no defined answer). What's the minimum level of execution at which design becomes effective? How much "error" is tolerable before it begins to affect the number you're about to write down? Of course for some the answer is any error should impact design. This is exactly what you had in the "tic" system (which simply shifted the semantics to "what is a tic"). And this tolerance (which has always existed and always been subjective) will vary from judge to judge, show to show, and design to design. You hope and pray that you get consistency. Of course that's the goal of the judges as well -- to agree on the values used to define a performance. Some moments only work when they're perfectly clean. For other moments clean is so irrelevant (or impossible to define) that in practice they always work. Most moments are somewhere in between those two extremes. To say "it's all about design" is just plain ignorant. Design is a precondition. You must have design to place a value on the execution. But in the end performers must realize the design, bring it to life, and make it their own.
    2 points
  5. I probably shouldn't have opened with the "was brainstorming a new business model" part. I just really have no clue what the role the corps and DCI play is, and had no clue how my ideas differed from what was actually out there.
    2 points
  6. Hmmm..... Picking one....2014 Blue Devils. That might be the best performed, designed, and written show I have ever seen. I saw them at Rutgers later in the season. I know a 2.3 spread from 1st to 2nd is huge at that level, but even at that it seemed artificially small.
    2 points
  7. 2003 Phantom at finals in Orlando. So much crowd energy during that ending. 2014 Bluecoats. Saw it in San Antonio, but for better or worse, Drum Corps design changed that day.
    2 points
  8. Stanford University Marching Band ? Is this the progressive, avard garde university MB that is anything but traditional, conservative in its style... but which non MB regular folks seem to like and get a kick out of their irreverence? This Fancy Pants Liberal University's MB has a history of drugs, alcohol, and sexual harrassment issues however. Here's hoping that Gavin can clean up this University's deplorable MB culture there.
    2 points
  9. Glad I saw Bluecoats last year in Nashville. It's a show you almost had to see live to appreciate.
    2 points
  10. Their brass line was good, it wasn't great, definitely not better than anyone above them, or even The Cadets, but I expect their success from last season to carry on to this one. But man....it's going to be competitive....Bluecoats won, you'd have to expect them to at least medal again, Blue Devils are in the running EVERY YEAR for a Gold - to think they are going to NOT medal is unthinkable - Crown is also very good and could/should medal again, and they are hungry for another gold - SCV has been beating on the door for the last 5 years - one would think they are going to medal again at some point - could it be this year??? Cavaliers, of course we just mentioned them, looks like they're ready to compete - and then there's the Cadets - still a #### good corps - could medal at any point - and if you want to throw in Blue Knights who stay competitive, I don't really think they could medal, but crazy things have happened - so realistically we got 6 corps who should win a medal. Lol. Whoever DOESN'T medal, it's going to be a disappointment. What I really hope happens is that judges score them closer together. We see Blue Knights who scored just over 90 points last season for 7th - realistically I think that show deserved at least 92, perhaps 93. And then score the corps above them from that point. Cadets didn't deserve a 92.x, that was a 95 point show. I want to see 6 corps score above 95 - that's what they should end up deserving, quit scoring them on a curve. I hate that crap.
    2 points
  11. I'm gonna stick to ones I saw live. I got to watch Carolina Crown rehearse the day before their first show in Arizona (or was it New Mexico...) in 2013. Hadn't heard or seen any of the show. I knew they were gonna win as soon as they did their full run through, that was pretty dang special.
    2 points
  12. Spirit of Atlanta 1980 at Finals which also included: 27th Lancers 1980 Bridgemen 1980 Blue Devils 1980
    2 points
  13. '91 Star! There have been a ton of good ones since but still haven't watched a show quite as special as that one.
    2 points
  14. I may have to change mr original answer. I forgot 27th's "Once More in 94" on a murky August night at DCI Finals in Foxboro. WHAT A NIGHT!
    2 points
  15. I know Cadets 07 gets hyped a ton (and rightfully so) but I've always really liked Winged Victory.
    2 points
  16. 2007 Blue Devils at finals. i had only seen it on stream before then, and it was like a completely different show live.
    2 points
  17. 2 points
  18. 1987 Garfield Cadets at Finals.. that show was truly special.
    2 points
  19. BK 2014. Big Loud and Live that year was my first run-in as a fan and I had no idea what I was getting myself into. Wish I could have been better prepared for a show as beautiful as that one.
    1 point
  20. I was brainstorming a revised business model for DCI over the weekend, and realized that I actually don't know what the current relationship is between DCI and the individual corps. Can anyone shed some light on this? Does DCI just host shows, and tell each corps "alright, you're booked, see you in Iowa tomorrow night!" or do they help arrange anything else? Is gas on the individual corps? Is housing? I'm actually not completely sure what role each organization plays in making the summer tour come together. Would love to start a discussion on what everyone knows and/or what people think the relationship actually should be.
    1 point
  21. I think there was a period earlier that summer where I got to see that show twice in three days, and by the second time (at some small podunk high school) when they got to the end of their ballad I was sure it was one for the ages. Had to physically hold myself back from standing up right then. I couldn't believe what I was witnessing.
    1 point
  22. More great info about stuff I wondered about. Appreciate you taking the time to share your expertise. Thanks.
    1 point
  23. Wow, this is getting more heated than a Madison Scouts thread in the middle of July!
    1 point
  24. Hey, right in my neck of the woods! (I live 15 minutes south of Amarillo). Lubbock Cooper is an exploding program, their improvement from 2015 to 2016 was pretty incredible. I don't know any of their staff personally, but have only heard the best and it shows in their schools program.
    1 point
  25. Oh, OK. You haven't picked a fight, you never reply in an incendiary way. If you say so. Your comments or responses often read that way though, imo. And your explanation comes across in a manner of "you doth protest too much".
    1 point
  26. a trip to see animals in a zoo and spectators viewing last minute tweeks, changes, and "surprises" by panicking faculty and techs might not be too different. Do not feed either.
    1 point
  27. Great thread. Learning a lot here!!!
    1 point
  28. Fair criticism.. did not intentionally choose to talk " BAC " here, xandandl...( haha!)
    1 point
  29. I've heard some small clips, they sound better than when I marched. So there's that.
    1 point
  30. Maybe because Aungst left and the Battery will only dance. I KID. I KID.
    1 point
  31. I am not going to argue with your predictions, heck I don't even go out on the limb to make them (other than each year predicting the Blue Devils to win). I will say the Blue Stars have been finalists 7 of the past 8 years, so hard to say they have been up and down. I do understand they are typically in the first quarter of the Saturday show, but they are there.
    1 point
  32. Dumb question here, perhaps... and an indication of how far out of the loop I am in general... LOL... What is the "pay scale" for DCI corps? Is it a revenue-sharing "everyone's paid the same" model, or a weighted "tier" model? I'm asking about World Class here. I understand Open Class is a different situation, at least in Open Class-only shows.
    1 point
  33. This is the reformation of a more formally recognized unit coming from the ashes of the previously suspended "progressive, avard garde university MB."
    1 point
  34. Armada, a new junior corps in Boise, ID, is getting off the ground this year.
    1 point
  35. You know......I hate not being able to dig through shows from all years as a new fan, discovering show after show after show that I'd never heard or seen before. I REALLY miss that, I feel like I've finally at least listened to a large majority of shows. No more hidden gems or discarded shows because of placement to find hiding under a rock somewhere. Only the future shows to look forward to now.
    1 point
  36. I don't think there will be a lot of resistance to that, I thought it was a bust overall but there were some fantastic moments that probably weren't given merit because of the overall product. I thought Pines of Rome was fantastic, Turning was pretty chilling IMO, one of the few moments where I felt like the theme was being hammered home. Closer just fell apart design wise, I think they had 2/3rds of a fantastic show that woulda easily competed with Santa Clara Vangaurd and Cavaliers in the final days of the season. It's a bizarre weird show that will definitely be a hidden gem to some young fan like I was a few years ago digging my way through forgotten and lower placing shows (relatively for Cadets in this case of course) years from now.
    1 point
  37. My kid is kinda used to that scenario. He marched Atlanta CV in DCA for the last two years. They finished 5th in DCA Finals in 2015 and 6th in 2016 when the top 3 were clearly defined and 4-8 were fighting for placement. I agree with all of your assessments above. Great organizations with great musicians. I do think from my up-close experience with auditions this year that you will find that Cavies have upgraded their brass line at audition, and I know from in-home experience that they are working like crazy on individual improvement week over week. I kinda see Drum Corps like golf. Go put up the best score you have in the bag. And if someone is better...kudos to them. :-)
    1 point
  38. Get out of town and go hiking at a state park: McCormick's Creek in Spencer, Brown County in Nashville, or Turkey Run near Marshall. Trail 6 at Turkey Run is a favorite. Wear old sneakers as some of the trail wanders through an active creek.
    1 point
  39. Here's one not listed yet: Academy 2016 I saw that show really early season and knew it was gonna be great. Just a great fan favorite show that I think will be talked about among many young drum corps fans for years to come.
    1 point
  40. For me, it was BK DATR 2012. I had never been to a drum corps show before in my life. It was raining off and on. All the corps did standstills...until it was BK's turn. They came out and did their WHOLE show. I don't know a lot about music, especially classical music, but I love to listen to most anything. I'm a big Sci-Fi fan. Their show...the bird race...the comet...their journey to a new home...the metamorphosis...the Firebird Suite...WOW.
    1 point
  41. BD 1988 - "Happy Days" opener... I'm really not a big BD fan, but that's one of my favorite openers of all times. Slow build. Classy. Emotional. Loved it, and would love to see it live again.
    1 point
  42. 1 point
  43. A good way to rejuvenate Indy is to sign on FloMarching to produce DCI live streams, which due to their quality will force people to attend shows in person again.
    1 point
  44. Hornline member dancing with guard member. Dancing Drumline, Dancing Hornline, Prancing guard, hip thrusts, bug squash, anything to do with synthesizers..... I could go on for days.
    1 point
  45. It wasn't so very long that Spartans were the dominant O.C. corps, beating BDB and SCVC many times in the mid 2000s.
    1 point
  46. Probably the reason that SCVC and BDB (not to mention BDC and Colt Cadets) don't apply for World Class status is that their parent organizations are perfectly happy having corps with different missions operating at different levels.
    1 point
  47. Unpopular yes, illogical no.
    1 point
  48. Your last statement to me shows why they do not go too far, actually. LOVED their show this summer, electronics and all.
    1 point
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