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Parent of a first year DCI MM this year. And just wondering if the whole notion of "If you don't have something nice to say, don't say anything at all" has ever been introduced to this community. I really don't mind at all reading constructive criticism of all the corps as long as that's what it is. But when it turns mean, rude, vitriolic, and just crusty, I have to wonder what joy people get out of trashing 17-22 year old kids who are busting their ### for 16 hours a day to make themselves better. My kid marched 2 years of DCA so I stayed mainly in the DCA section of Drum Corps Planet. And for the most part, that seems to be a fairly polite community that encourages all the corps in the activity. In one month of posting here, ( and now 4 days of shows rolling out), I've seen things posted about the shows, the corps, the staffs, etc. that simply make my heart hurt. Criticism? Sure... "I think XYZ Corps could improve by doing ABC"...for sure...bring it on. Nastiness? No..."This show is an absolute trainwreck. The whole staff should be fired and the kids sent home tomorrow." Nope. Not appropriate. Rant over.

So I came here prepared to be disappointed in the Scouts. Influenced by others comments so far. I loved the show, though, and thought they performed it well. Even liked the esoteric, designed for fancy music people music. Really entertaining. Plenty of things to work on. (Lots of dropped rifles.) But this is good Madison stuff. RE: Earlier comments about not selling it (mine included after seeing the video). They certainly were working hard to sell it tonight.

I'm sorry, I'm still stuck on BDCG during the ballad, can I just say one more thing? Any of the elite guards can give you fast, aggressive, complicated flag writing, and BD's work during the ballad isn't exactly slacking in that department, either. But I think what's most impressive is that they do it so delicately. Pulling off tricky work like that is it's own feat, especially with those difficult entries and the way everything builds. But they're performing it so elegantly, on top of that, and really matching the relaxed groove of the music—that's, like, next-level. That's so much more meaningful to me than just being excessively fast and difficult. It's what guard should be about. Okay I'm done. :)

One thing that MUST be discussed regarding BDCG this year: the flag writing during that ballad. It's phenomenal, and extremely hard to pull off as an ensemble, really full of the weird subtleties that distinguish Very Good colorguards from Great ones, but accordingly, you have to watch closely. (One thing YT show videos are really not helpful for: watching guards. Ground level videos help—but the best thing would be more CG fans posting from the lot, like brass/drumline fans). Anyway: lots of interesting body going on. But the difficulty is all so lyrical, and BD has such a natural sense of style, that they're already making it look easy. You can tell the guard is in love with that work, which is the best part.

I agree with you in general. Regarding compulsories (it can be debated as to what these are in 2017), they have added/included: a theme-based costume, expanded the electronic sound palate, embraced the trombone, greatly increased use of free form and characterization, included more props, picked a theme/show title that immediately asks "hmmm, I know that word/concept, but what will it reveal itself to be in their show?" All of this is fine and yes, reflects many of the devices used by the "more modern" corps that usually place above Scouts. As of now, the show seems to be embracing these newer devices, but perhaps not considering enough long standing show construction considerations which for me, are the cause of what is currently disjunct, unemotional, and just plain odd. No to be too cliche, I do think there is a ton of potential and I think The Academy has left the door wide open for a top 12 newcomer in 2017. I have always liked the Scouts and had hoped that the rumors of getting outside of their comfort zone was going to happen. They have done so, but not in the ways that make the show itself a wow. We need to get to end of the first impact and think "#### ####", they're in. My questions suggestion for the production: Time and Place: Thematically, how do you immediately put me where, when, and in what circumstances you want me to be as an audience member, on a first viewing? Props: If using the oxygen tanks ( a really cool idea IMO), they have to be worth it, really worth all the hauling around and storage, etc. Do you intend to use them more? Much more? Seems they could be introduced from the get go, at least one of them. That said, the show starts too abruptly. With such a bizarre concept, I think we have to be pulled in slowly so that the intrigue the show title and costuming suggests can be slowly and mysteriously pulled over the audience like a blanket, or like slowly putting on virtual reality glasses, carefully adjusting them into focus so we are now brought into your world. Props: The square stage in the middle seems out of place. Why is it pristinely square in a world that seems anything but. I think ragged edges or at least curved edges would be more authentic. Props: The fleur seems to be a central focus as far as where it is staged, but it is not presented as "home base" enough. What is its role? Can it anchor the theme? Characterization: Though I greatly appreciate that Scouts have gone there, and it seems super appropriate for the show, the members are extremely uncomfortable with these requirements. I understand it is early, but compared to most other units that are currently relying on role playing/characterization as a design component, any comparison shows Scouts as lagging greatly. There is also a lot of awkward body and horn movement. Much is written to be in unison or in A-B structures. I do not find them to be particularly musical and they seem out of place. If this is some survivalist world, perhaps influenced by Madd Maxx, The Hand of Man, etc. (all great inspirations), doing unison body work and horn moves seem too conventional, organized, from some other narrative. Seems the majority of the show should be non-unison, role and character driven, with occasional unisons that have a clear intent (unity, bonding, victory fist pump, etc.). While I know there is some of this type of unifying body motions in the show now- it gets lost amid all the unisons and the intent of the unisons. Pacing: the beginning starts interestingly enough, but not nearly interesting enough to capture and hold interest. Right off the bat the pacing will be effected by this because we then wait to feel connected to the show to some degree, to have been let in so to speak. We may not quite get subsequent effects because we are still in awkward mode. Once the intro is over, the time between major events/resolutions/arrivals/hits/etc. is most often too short. We need time to absorb, to get it and then appreciate it- what ever you want "it" to be. Orchestration/pacing: the pacing here also seems fast, with too much time spent in dense textures. I get that much of the source material is bitonal/atonal/complex harmonies, etc., but such makes arrivals difficult. Will major chords, "conventional" cadences ever sound like they fit? Right now those moments are out of place. Part of it is related to pacing; more room to breathe so to speak, more time for my ears to be taken on the journey with you. I can hear someone explaining that relentless is the message so the music tells that story. I get that, but how that is crafted is how you make it work, and if the theme, the journey, the final resolution was more clear, the "relentless" musical device could serve for better effect. Narrative: One of the most important rules in a play, book, movie, pageantry show with a story, or narrative, or general theme that displays question and answer is "They have to care." The audience has to care about the subject, the girl, the beautiful horse, the lost child, etc. and, has to feel a connection asap. As of now, there is noting to make me care, to pull for someone or something. The question is unclear, so I never care about the answer. The story does not have to be detailed like "Romeo and Juliet" or " The Man and the Sea", but I do not think this show will work its best without much more "story line" than what is there now. The Hand of Man: a dude is drawn to a tree, the tree gives him the thing, others want/need the thing, the things causes actions/reactions, another tree has been calling, it needs the other tree's thing/man's hand, eventually, it gets it. While this may or may not be the 100% exact story line that MCM based its decisions on (and I am being bit obtuse with the story line to make a point), it is what stuck with me and what I followed every time I saw that awesome show. So maybe nothing more detailed than that, but that is enough structure that my mind explores and thinks and sees and is intrigued 100% of the show. I cared to see the resolution and got exactly what I hoped for. I was let in, allowed to enjoy, and allowed to be right. Just my thoughts for how to resolve some show issues: Start much more slowly, add time prior to the backfield playing moment that currently starts the show. Cool electronics, mysterious. Establish that home base is where those that have the life blood/oxegen tanks reside. Maybe the fluer is some other symbol to start that gets replaced. Establish one member that needs to get to the home base Establish that the oxygen is the life blood, perhaps the most valuable of all "modern day" commodities Build to what is currently the start Keep the one character from getting to home base The narrative is now established and the middle portion of the show can let us interpret exactly what is happening and we see conflict, people kept from home base, people storming home base, etc. Does our main character nearly die, someone else, more (the ballad moment)? The not welcomed storm home base Fights ensue Indeed, all fall with last man standing- or all fall except those that have over taken home base, with what ever was on the mast at the home base being replaced by the fleur. Good guys (the Scouts) win so to speak. I know that this may seem too literal. But, only one or two corps get creative license enough to do etherial or obscure. Scouts is not one of those corps and a non-finalist is certainly not gradated that license. The show is currently extremely etherial and obscure. Marching the 8 trombones the whole show- awesome, original, cool, Scouts are the first in history to do it. It isn't enough to get them in. The costume is the best of the season. Inspired and cool. It isn't enough to get them in. The electronics are much improved. It isn't enough to get them in. All of these and the things mentioned above that they have embraced are icing on the cake sorts of things. I applaud them for going there. The cake, the structure needs the bulk of their attention. They have nothing to loose. I would clean what is guaranteed to stay, but sit all day in a room and restructure the show top to bottom so we are easily let into the theme, lead through the narrative, and given conclusion that allows us to be right- to have seen it coming and revel in the glory. Sorry for the comparison, but The Academy 2016 show was largely successful because we were hooked from the get go and hooked the entire time (not sure why they did not follow their own lead). I want all groups to do well. Not sure why I particularly felt myself pulling for Scouts this off season other than I do not want to see anyone, much less a corps as iconic as Scouts struggle to stay in finals. It usually leads to too many issues that eventually cause lots of heartache. I started typing and could not stop. Just my two cents.

Hey, good job Music City. Nice music, really nice solo. They did this strange thing: played melody of a piece for more than 10 seconds.

I'll be posting photos from Lisle on Saturday through The DrumScorps app. Including my first viewing of your beloved Boston Crusaders!

For those that like their drum corps loud...myself is included...BOSTON PEEL PAINT BABY!!! ...lol....one guys reaction at tonight's show...haha Topher Edmondson‏ HOLY HEARING DAMAGE!!!!! @bostoncrusaders #DrumsOTO #ineedearplugs

Eat 'em up BOSTON!

Aw now..we would have never seen Shayne's "wink" with that big ole helmet on his head. And it was pure gold...

I think too much is being made about "incomplete" panels and that they are basically worthless. I would point out that the placements and point spreads, this early in the season, would most likely change VERY little if you factored in the other 3 judges. Even with the two 5 man panels the Bluecoats have now experienced, along with the two 8 man panels, not a lot has changed. The 5 man panels have included a few judges that will be on the panels in Indy. Getting their input this early is, to a degree, helpful. Often the early season panels include some less experienced judges that need the opportunity to, themselves, be evaluated. As the season progresses and the regionals start happening you will see the average experience level of the panels begin to rise. Those are the folks that will make up the panels for the 3 days of championships. Some like to "blame" DCI or the local show hosts for the 5 man panels. The local shows really have no input. DCI assigns the judges. The idea of 5 man panels came from the DCI Board of Directors...made up of DCI corps directors. Yes, the primary reason was to save some money...money that finds its way back to...THE CORPS. I believe their thoughts were to have a few 8 man panels at the very beginning, go to 5 man panels for a short time (3 weeks or so), then back to full panels with the regionals and the last few weeks of the tour. Makes total financial sense to me...and let's face it...a June score of 70 from an 8 man panel and a score of 70 from a 5 man panel mean NOTHING come mid July.

In the various angles now on YT, you can REALLY see how many spots are being held for future additions. If 75% of the show changes by finals, I wouldn't be surprised. It is currently as perforated as swiss cheese. All that running the horns do through the doorways in the centers of the stairs near the end is a perfect setup for a costume change.

After seeing their full run, I'm 100% sold. The videos do them no justice; my ears were ringing after that opening hit. This corps is playing with total confidence and swagger and nailing every note that comes their way. Once percussion gets their hands fully behind this book and the corps is able to dial in the ideas they'll have in the coming weeks, this show will be unstoppable.

Great score for The Cavaliers! Definitely in the game with Crown at this point. Boston didn't go up as much since Massillon, but they may have made some changes too. Boston really hits you over the head and it becomes obvious they are for real this year. I have enjoyed many offerings from them over the years, but this year they come out and smack you with sound, design, and great performance and announce that they are not going to be 12th or lower. Looks like the Madison Scouts might have a serious show with legs this year. Great score for them. If they continue to hang with Blue Stars (who came out strong themselves) then we are in for a fun summer.

I'm proud of your brass BAC...only .2 behind Cavies and winning brass achievement for the night...WTG! :)

I've been told that the euph soloist has been given a bunch of practice time on it, and the corps spent time improving the ballad today.

Looks like Cavies are hangin' with Crown

Cavaliers were great and great fun. That guard does really difficult stuff and does it well. I think they deserve more respect than they get. The show seemed more cohesive and coherent than last week in Indy. Of course, that's probably something about me more than Cavaliers. Blue Stars do fine. I'm just not into their show much. The boy girl thing has been overdone. posted from the DrumScorps app

I can't say that I disagree with you...I say that not having seen BD and SCV live, but this Cadets show is more a CADETS show than I've seen in the last couple of years.

They gonna need a faster metronome!!!

Yeah they be good. I can't wait until the rest of the DCI world gets to see the program in a couple weeks once the end is on, its cleaner and all the corps are together. I strongly believe Bluecoats and Cadets have the 2 "shows of the year"

Couldn't stay for the run, but both efforts I heard were on point. Sounds like he's figured it out.

Hey...newbie here but long time reader of these fantastically polite forums. I'm a guard person but that was after I played trumpet and spent one year on a drumline (in H.S.). I watched BDCG while up at Stanford and will be at Pasadena for warmups and agree they make it look so effortless. I always get good close up vids "from the lot" -- if I get any of the above mentioned parts of the show and figure how to share, I will. BTW nice to meet you all. LOL

but the bluecoats turned DCI downside up

I think the Vienna Philharmonic, and a few others, might have something to say about that.

@JohnZ may wanna get rid of all these pointless and stupid off topic arguments on this thread

Yeah but we shouldn't have any optimism about it. Instead we should be wearing tinfoil hats.

Killed it tonight!!

Well, if they can get the GE numbers up a bit that could help. Of course if they continue to layer the music more, they'll be fine. I think it's too early to put a 5th place ceiling on them at the moment. Their percussion is doing extremely well, and their guard is very talented too, so it is early.

Madison live looks great. The uniforms are striking and interesting. Looking for the show to match.

Ah, I see the other 4 quads splitting out the back now. So the middle quad gets some jagged stage GE time, difficulty points for the spread, and also gets to maintain side to side symmetry while they all push forward. Wasn't sure if he had a solo feature up there, or what the deal was. Then all of the sudden, he comes sauntering down the steps and rejoins the group. Thanks for the explainer.

and... Eat 'em up BOSTON! :)

Good crowd tonight – long walk-up line 30 minutes before step-off. Weather was cool and partly cloudy with sun in the audience eyes for first three corps. I don’t talk too much about drumlines and color guards. GENESIS – Feel-good story. Nice balanced brass line with a modicum of stick-outs. Good trumpet soloist. Accessible music. I do not like the piped-in wide-eyed young girl character preaching about ‘imagination’ throughout the show. Nice brass line singing during Pure Imagination, then squeaky girl. Received an enthusiastic standing ovation, which obviously meant a lot to the members. Welcome to World Class. Seventh, 55.2. SPIRIT OF ATLANTA – After a forgettable few years, time to feel positive about Spirit of Atlanta again. Really like the musical selections, especially Eric’s Song and Shofukan. Classy and sharp uniforms. My ten-year-old son loved the drumspeak. The corps seemed very aggressive; not timid, as if they were uncomfortable with the show, something that an early season Spirit in years past would have been. So, yea Spirit. Sixth, 61.0. TROOPERS – An inspired performance on what must have been a terribly sad day for the 11th Cavalry. Nessun Dorma is just a treat. My ten-year-old loves the swordfighting. They do need, I think, to improve transitions and characterization, and the drill – well, let’s just say it’s everything that is stale in DCI. If I saw one I saw a thousand: rotating blocks; rotating (squads?) of four members; files (better dress left, Troopers, or change the drum solo drill); follow-the-leader; hornline blocks sprinting at each other during a drum break and then forming a big block for a power chord, horn arcs. Dress right, cover down. It’s not just the Troopers. But frankly, as long as I can listen to Nessun Dorma, I don’t really care all that much. Fourth, 62.4. COLTS – I saw them from outside the gate, because I needed to go back to my car during intermission to get my card to get, ironically enough, a Colts fidget-spinner for my ten-year-old. So I didn’t hear much music, but I like the color palette and the transition from black-and-white to color in all the visual aspects. I refuse to believe that it’s the same visual staff that came up with those atrocious light-boxes from last year. Fifth, 62.1. CROSSMEN – The Crossmen the past two years seem to be falling into one of the grooves a corps gets when they are building on a product year after year. Just an energetic show with recognizable music and a nice balanced hornline with some real oomph. The chart from A Beautiful Mind has a good rhythmic feel up and down the musical ensemble. Happy with the tuba section. Some nods to the history – starting with the ‘question-mark’ set which ended the 92 show. Really amazingly awesome French horn soloist. Placeholder sideline loud ending which I’m sure will change. A lot of the same complaints about drill design that I had with the Troopers. Third (only 5.7 points behind the defending champs!), 69.1. CADETS – At ensemble rehearsal the night before, I was the Faithful. At the show, I was the Fallen. Too much front ensemble, like way too much front ensemble. Did I mention, too much front ensemble? I am willing to posit that it might have been where I was sitting – 40, side 2, with an overhang. But I noticed the same the night before with no overhang. I am serious, I could not distinguish the hornline. I heard more of Genesis’s hornline than of Cadets. I know they’ve made a big deal of the vocalists, and they are fine, but I wish they would feature them and the brass separately instead of having the vocalists sing with the hornline. On the other hand, George Hopkins, who was pacing the track like a caged tiger, seemed to be happy with the drumline’s progress. I noticed a couple of improvements. Maybe by August, I can be the Forgiven? Second, 71.9. What the BLUECOATS show description should be: ‘It’s a jagged line. We hide under it. We stand and play and spin on it. We run down it. We march through it. Then you get off your ##### and scream your fool heads off and clap until your hands are raw and bleeding, because we’re that much fun. Enjoy the show.’ Bari/Euph soloist NAILED it tonight. Should have been farther ahead of The Cadets. First, 74.7. Is it ironic that my son opened his new fidget-spinner while the Bluecoats were playing Hymn of Acxiom in their encore? Thanks for reading.

Dunno. I always loved the dark helmets of the Bluecoats. Bad#zz. Facial expressions? - - - meh...

Ahhh, the age-old question: "What is Hip?" It's been asked in Drum Corps before, by some very hip teams like The Freelancers, Doc Crosser's Osage Precisionnaires (who nailed it to death) and the aforementioned Devils. And it's been dissected throughout the ages by other artistes like the Beat poets, the Greek poets and the Meat Puppets. Lord Buckley addressed the "hipsters, flipsters and finger-poppin' daddies" in his nightclub audience, among whom sat Sinatra, Martin, Davis...et al. But what IS it? In 1973, it was this: https://video.search.yahoo.com/yhs/search?fr=yhs-avast-001&hsimp=yhs-001&hspart=avast&p=What+is+hip+tower+of+power+lyrics#id=5&vid=4aff33aba12130878394697dafa5a34c&action=view Note the prophetic lyrics: "What's Hip today might become passe" "Hipness is...what it is" "Sometimes Hipness is what it ain't" The defense rests. Let the jurors deliberate.

I thought it was a type of underwear.

Thats what I said. I feel like they have a coloring page, and they only have half of their crayon box so they cant finish the page. When the other half of that crayon box is found though...I cant wait to be at the art gallery.

His son, also Bernie, was a good friend of mine in college. At me senior recital, I had young Bernie and his girlfriend (now wife) Trisha play with me in the recital on some ancient fife and drum stuff *Three Camps", etc...). Bernie played bass and Trisha played piccolos (she was a flute major). I played snare. since Bernie was playing, I invited Dr and Mrs Baggs to the recital (plus I had been to his home many times while an undergrad). My first piece was a timpani solo, and just as I was going on stage, Bernie tells me that even though his dad was a brass judge, his primary instrument was percussion, especially timpani. Imagine how this drum corps guy who had been exposed to Dr Baggs as one of THE top judges felt walking on to the stage. All went well, glad to say.

As stated, the soloist really did a nice job last night!! I was standing right beside one of Bluecaots brass staff, and he made it a point to clap enthusiastically after said solo (even putting his phone, which he was recording the show with at the time, under his arm to clap emphatically)!! The backfield playing with the mics picking up the sound seemed improved (based on what has been said) and I feel they are close to getting what they designed to happen there. I thought it was really nice, myself!! They are close to getting the balance they are trying to achieve with the sound. Very nice ballad :)

Cadets will win it all. Well, probably not. But someone had to say it.

C'mon folks! There's nothing wrong with commenting that it's a good sign that a particular corps has cut into a spread with the current scoring leader. Doesn't in itself mean they think they will pass them up.

Anyone who calls anyone delusional for thinking anything could happen in this stage of the season clearly has no experience at drum corps.

Original photo credit: https://www.facebook.com/JonBraudePhotography

Wow lame review. I disagree. also I'm pretty sure you brought up the same appropriating view on a more exclusive page and that idea was shut down there too. Your trying awfully hard to push that narrative.

Speaking of Music City, from last week:

We can tell you're new when you call DCP "polite" Welcome!!!

...and they pay for EVERY penny of it!

I will say if anyone will win guard it'll be either Bloo, BD or SCV... Crowns is not that hot this year

And I certainly don't disagree with you...but when a 17-18 year old kid reads "That show was an unbearable trainwreck" they don't make that discernment.