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I have a simple request for next season: please wait until Labor Day before starting the "Staff Merry-Go-Round 2019" thread. Thanks.

Cool. I didn't like the show or the music arranging and the guard and visual were dirty and imo overscored. Felt the same the year prior but liked that show even less very narcissistic sense of design and performing going on imo, and don't get me started on the brass arranging and magnified amplification

I don't know what you mean by "weak one". Do you consider Bluecoats 2nd place finish in 2014 as WEAK? They never beat Cadets until finals night. Same thing with Cavies passing Coats this year. It happens. Not weak. Just peaking at the right time.

I have no problem with your tastes; I'm a huge Bluecoats' and Cavaliers' fan. I'm a displaced Ohioan too, so I always LOVE the Bluecoats' shows. I don't think you're anything but honorable towards the Cavaliers, but I do know that over the years you just don't seem to like them. When they were at the very top, I noticed you always pick them below other corps. It is what it is... No problem, we all have our favorites and those corps we do not like. I personally haven't LOVED a BD show since 1993. ...and everyone on here knows that. I just feel that the judges placed the Cavaliers where they placed them, just like when they place Blue Devils at the top with designs that I never care about regardless of performance levels, or other times where they place Bluecoats at the top despite some performance levels. I wouldn't call Bluecoats' win in 2016 a weak 1st, and I wouldn't call the Cavalier' 2017 placement a weak 4th. Both corps were obviously good enough in some captions to overtake the competition.

I, too, was surprised the Cavies ended up in fourth. And I was a little surprised they ended up in fifth in 2016. I haven't been overly entertained by them the last couple years, but DCI is better when they're in the top six.

She was very, very good however and consistent to the nines. But I can understand your point about how much voice/choir compared to how much brass we heard the whole show.

Brass version was outstanding. A cold horn and MM being out of breath from dragging benches onto the field had a lot to do with the cracks, IMO. Wish they would have kept it though.

Because those who forget (or choose to ignore) the past are doomed to repeat it, that's why.

This wasn't mentioned yesterday, but to nobody's surprise, the entire Mandarins design team from last year is staying.

It certainly will if they don't focus more on their core competency and what has made them who they are.

Thanks, BT. I'll give it a listen. I saw the series also has a lecture on New World Symphony. Did you post that on the P.R. thread? They could use the uplift.

Becky got married, thus the change in last name. The change in first name was an error by DCI in their reporting of the Soundsport competition. We have incessantly teased "Vicky" about her first name change since the DCI error.

I used the word similar. As in somewhat like but not the same.

Didn't he do what Madison "wore" this summer?

Uniform wise for next year I would love to see the second uniform from 2017 with a slightly modernized shako. I thought it really captured the classic Cadets look in a modern style.

Yeah she was but.....not to be critical...I want to hear brass. Same with Crown's singer during the Wicked balled. Nothing against them but how nice to hear a wonderful brass soloist instead of a singer

I don't like the voice in the middle of the show either - and they kept adding and adding to it. The 'can I get an amen?" was horrible (nothing in Cavaliers was that bad trust me) IF they would have stuck to the moments they should have had the choir and gotten right of ALL the narration/officiating I really believe Cadets would have scored much higher

well it all is being rewarded these days - hence 4th place there was a lot of dirty my biggest issue was the design - especially musically the guard were great performers but I felt the work was repetitive and a ton of phasing going on - and the guard did not march well at all - mostly jazz running all over the place out of step without any defined technique battery marched well except the bass - brass had mostly clean sets but the interim marching was pretty rough - especially intervals, leaning into direction changes, controlling the contras and bells as far as the sense of design - it reminds me of watching hipsters take selfies, very about drawing attention to themselves performance is about the audience, not the performer. Both Bloo and Cavaliers had a lot of "me me me" moments this year Most of what I'm saying comes down to taste As far as 4th - I felt Bluecoats were stronger in all captions and I much preferred the music arrangement. Visual design coats had moments but lost GE at other times. I personally would have put them around 3 points ahead of Cavaliers on the next competitive tier JMO - closer to Crown than Cavaliers I usually like the Cavaliers - just not the past 2 seasons. Even liked the "down years" - and loved many others

I will gladly go forward, as I want the Cadets to be successful and I want to love them too. B is entirely my own inability to enjoy that part of the show, so I know it's me. I can't wait to hear what Cadets choose to do for next year.

No, Sheldon.

Will you be announcing a staff change too for a new draper and costumer? Cesario? Miller? Stan Berry? or Tommy Bahamas?

a and c I can agree with you completely. b I can see your perspective but don't agree with it completely though you probably have some valid reasons. But that's so 2017. Let us not live in the past.

Side note: if you REALLY want to take this approach further, it should be story/theme/elements/whatever the heck is guiding your show other than visual/music, and then portray that story/theme/whatever through visual and music. Same approach that goes into interpretive dance.

While y'all argue about visual vs. music, I'm gonna kick back and enjoy watching this Doc over the weekend.

Stage production's, for the most part, have a symbiotic relationship between music and visual that compliment each other 'equally'. DCI show design used to hold to that equal respect treatment. Movies, on the other hand, mainly treat music as a sublime role of underlying support for everything else iprojected from the screen in visual, sound effects, and dialogue. That religated role for music has been the show design direction DCI has mainly gone post Y2K. Visually I am not saying to harken back to the eighties and nineties; nor am I against modern technology advances of sound production. But the musical arranging in many DCI shows post Y2K has taken on such a background film-score visual driven role it makes no musical sense whatsoever, but merely supports the visual thematic motion. That is where the problem lies in the musical arranging; religation to the vusual not equal respect with the visual.

Also I want to say I'm not trying to be combative, I like the debate and I agree that marching groups that feel like they should be checking off the boxes on a design sheet rather than working towards making a cohesive design do create those poor design decisions then. 100%...... but I don't think that's determined by the need to marry visual and musical concepts.

Oh brother...... hahahahaha why would any try to coordinate what they see with what they hear?....... if only there weren't those pesky judge's sheet that determine integration of effects and ideas. We wouldn't have themes, or uniforms, or color guards, or staging, or music that compliments each other. 100% of the time in the last 20 years of drum corps groups have had to worry about how their musical ideas and concepts fit their visual concepts and vice versa. It's part of the symbiotic relationship that is now drum corps. It's not just checking off all the boxes, it's making sure the pacing is on point and impacts are on point. It's very evident to people when a visual concept or guard work or props or anything having to do with visual are an afterthought and not part of the original thought process. None the less thanks for to the OP for posting this. Can't wait watch it. I thought seeing other people's creative process in action. I'm the guy that watches the DVD extras. haha

Are ties in 12th place not allowed anymore or is that now decided by who has the most electronics and singers?

Wasn't this supposed to be a thread about Cadets?

The staffs are told where to go and this year it was 306. I will assume we all behaved ourselves or nobody from that seating area reads DCP or no news is good news. Back to staring at the weather channel. ;)

Yea, plus it's not like the thing includes state secrets or matters of national security. It's a freakin' rule book. I have a copy...the idea that is must be kept secret is mind-numbing.

I was personally shocked they got fourth. I think a lot of people were

If you're looking for Gaines drill, sure. They captured that vibe and energy really well this year

no you can believe it

Yea, but you NEVER seem to like them; sorta a damning with faint praise. I don't think they'll ever be your thing.

But add to this scenario that the Cavaliers since 2006 until now have been through no less than 4 maybe even as many as 5 corps and organization head/directors beginning with Adolph DeGrauwe replacing Jeff Fiedler. (I'm enumerating both CEO's and corps managers.) The Cadets, for better or worse, has had the same corporate head and, for better or worse, the same corps director during that same time period, although by point of standard used the Cadets window would begin at 2011 rather than 2006.

I agree, but they have not found their way back into the top 3. They were a perennial top 3 corps, just like Cadets; so the comparison is fair. Since 2011 they [Cavaliers] have not been the same corps. And to me their 4th place finish this year was a weak one.

I'm going to go out on a limb here and say the Blue Devils are safe. Yes, I'm a "$2 to show" bettor.

Push forward. Before Bloo ever plugged in a synth, before the Cavaliers layered a voice, before SCV spun a wheel, before BD painted massive field props white - the Cadets were pushing the boundaries of what could be done. They were the pioneers ... then they seemed to stop. Mike

Ok, give some specific examples from this year's shows of what you believe is "emulating what is seen in DCI" . And go beyond electronics and microphones...that stuff isn't emulation. Give some well-reasoned examples in terms of show design. We'll wait. (I'm not saying you are wrong here...I just want to see what you think the emulation points are). Also, when you state "I don't see much crossover interest shown by DCI fans. Maybe, there's too much "been there, done that' in DCA for those folks", you're proceeding on the false assumption that DCA fans aren't also DCI fans. DCI is getting more exposure to DCA thought the massive number of DCA veterans moving to DCI corps (and also the reverse), and this year from FLO's excellent coverage. The number of Blue Devils alumni who were turned on to DCA this past weekend via the FLO coverage was impressive, based on their postings in our alumni groups. I highly suspect it was similar elsewhere. Hopefully FLO will release some viewer numbers at some point.

I've said it before but there is nothing wrong with peoples perceptions of The Cadets that a few years of well designed shows won't fix. Whether the current design staff is able to create shows that will do that is yet to be seen.

Funny, I've attended finals since 2008 and didn't get a survey. I guess they figure I am hooked regardless.

From his Facebook Don Taylor (1990s Crown and Magic) will be on BK brass staff. Very happy for him.

Zach here - in typical Couchmen fashion I'm too lazy to make another account. But you can find most of my photos on the "Music And Marching" Facebook page and instagram account. Also check out "DCI Cam Fam" on Instagram, as a lot of the individual corps photographers post their work there!

Yes and thanks for the kind words! I am beyond thrilled to be working with Chuck again. Especially with this Corps.

don't fret...GH will fill in for any voids

This is DUMB...considering their Achilles heel was GUARD....

I agree with a lot of your critique of Bluecoats. The only exception would be the criticism that Jagged Line wasn't a big enough move from Down Side Up, only that Blue Devils have relied on the exact same design concepts for almost a decade and it hasn't seemed to impact their scores. When I first saw Jagged Line, my main concern was how they would be able to execute a medalist show with a massive stage plunked down the middle of the field. In the end, they did as good a job making it an asset as possible but it was definitely a liability as well. The biggest issue was the fact that you had to go single file from field left to field right. It dictated too much of the drill the end. The biggest miss of the show was the ballad. It was a valiant design effort and concept that just never worked as well as it needed to. They took a fourth of the show up to execute an idea that never really was worth the investment. Purely from a design concept standpoint, and this is just me, it was a conceptual mismatch to do a Fosse show visually with ultra modern music. If you are going to do Fosse, do it 100%.

Bloo's design team is f*cking amazing and I have no doubt they're going to come out with a highly entertaining and unique show for us next year. Im optimistic.

This is a very stable and creative staff. I am sure they learned a couple of things this year ... they experimented with a guard and movement concept that pleased the crowds but not so much the judges. I am very confident they will come out with something new and amazing again next year that will please the fans ... and maybe even the judges, too!