zig zig ZAG

Dear Cadets Family, I've been associated with the corps since the 1991 season, and was a huge fan as a teen when I saw Doug conduct a show that didn't just transform drum corps, nor just transcended the drum corps idiom, but transformed and transcended every individual on the field and in the stands to create a timeless experience of grace and beauty and community. That incredible people like Doug and Scott are at the helm with Tom and Drew and so many amazing others, all gives me not just hope, but knowledge, absolute certainty, that something special is happening. Something beautiful, and for the ages. As I posted on this forum a few times in the last couple years (including calling publicly for a resignation multiple times), that once a change of the guard occurs, the Cadets community would come together like never before, and that alumni and friends would come forth to support the corps and carry it forward into a new era of unity and excellence. It's happening. The Cadets have weathered the era of "me" and have again become "We". And a larger, more inclusive and united "We" than ever before. Like the finale of 1987, we dissolved into chaos, scattered and confused, but then came together into a Unity that embraces everyone from 1934 to 2018 and beyond. I am so jealous of all you members right now. I feel what you feel. With every push-up and every warm-up, with every scale, drop of sweat, split lip, teary eye, pulled muscle, run-through, we all are with you. And more - with every hug, pat on the back, smile, cheer, and song, and with every single expression of the love and community and creativity and solidarity that has made The Cadets the oldest, greatest, most innovative, most accomplished organization in all of Drum Corps - the marching members Unite everyone in the Cadets family, and everyone in Drum Corps. This is the Cadets year. This is your year. We are all so jealous of you, and we are all so united behind and among you. For Unity Shall Always Be. 1987 has been my favorite show of all time, and I love so many, from so many corps. I know little about this year's show. I am on the edge of my seat to find out, to see, to feel Unity. Finally, I'm again thrilled for a Cadets season! Like the old Garfield tee shirt: First we zigged, Then everybody zigged....ZAG! I do know one more thing with all my heart: 2018 is already my favorite Cadets show of all time. Thank you to everyone in the Cadets management and staff - all the volunteers, the employees who have sacrificed so much, the new leadership, the old leadership, the United leadership! Thank you especially to the marching members who, with every step, take the corps forward to experiment, challenge, and create beautiful music and art while creating beautiful people who change every life they touch. You've already won gold. All of you. Now go out and win it every day! FHNSAB! FOR UNITY SHALL ALWAYS BE!

DCI+WGI = Miles Davis turning his back to the audience and hiding behind the amps for more of his shows. Or serialist composers boasting that they don't need an audience. You can innovate without putting yourself into a geeky ghetto of rarefied standards of design and 'excellence' that most DCI fans don't even seem to like anymore. This discussion isn't over. DCI needs its own version of ###### Riot to wake everyone up. A bad### punk corps (or better: age-out corps) that shows the standards the directors, designers, and judges are shoving down everyone's throats are just a product of their own lack of creativity to innovate within the strictures of a form. DCI needs some satire and protest. Seriously. I feel bad for the kids who are caught in the middle of this. They deserve better leadership and standards that reward their effort, not play-to-the-sheets WGIDCI.

This. Exactly. I love the Olympics because judging incentivizes risk and demand, not just cautious 'design' of routines and execution. DCI does not. DCI judging rewards sleight-of-hand design. Clean is boring. DCI is dying because of a lack of creativity to innovate while appealing to audiences. Designers have been begging for bells and whistles not because they want to advance the activity, but because they're not good enough to innovate within the strictures of form. Like classical composers who pull amps out onto the stage, or add multimedia, or play video game scores to pull in audiences too addled with ADHD to have the patience to try to relate to a Mozart concerto or a world premier by Higdon or Reich. I want demand+execution. I want less props, less high-school band drop-the-instruments body-movement. I want no amplification of instruments (voice I can deal with, but usually cringe). I want more creativity and skill within the traditional activity.

Exactly. Watching the Olympics and seeing demand plus execution rewarded by judges, made me tune out of finals altogether. Crown has the most demanding show out there. BD has the best executed show. Olympic motto: higher, faster, stronger. DCI motto: easier, cleaner, safer.

Um, in the 80s, when I happened upon a certain performance of Appalachian Spring on a PBS rebroadcast a month after finals (yes, many PBS stations used to broadcast finals several times), many, many more people saw DCI around the country on TV than see anything on the internet or in theaters. And many more fans came to live shows, from regionals to finals. I attended finals a couple times where half of an NFL stadium or college stadium with over 90,000 seats was full. And a couple million saw the PBS live broadcast or rebroadcasts. The fan base has been dramatically shrinking. Pretty soon it will be closer to the fan base of high school marching band or winter guard: exactly the two most baneful influences on DCI that have made my interest wane dramatically.

Let's do some meta-analysis here on two schools of show design. As I see it, themes keep coming up in the last decade especially: which philosophy of show design is more demanding, which connects with the audience more, which connects with the judges more, which wins. Over the years, I connected with SCV and Cadets because what I saw was corps pushing the physical and musical limits of performance. Virtuosity I love. CC seems to fall into that category too, even though I can't help but loathe most all body movement and anything redolent of marching band. I would put Star in this group too; always loved them for pushing the limits in every way. I always loved BD because of their jazz and their consummate skill and sophistication, especially musical, and Cavies because of their skill and style, especially visual, that is often mind-blowing. I enjoy watching young people marching AND playing AND pushing the limit, and that means simultaneously for the most part. SCV and Cadets usually try to do this. (After all, when you call yourselves "Vanguard" being on the cutting edge is your raison d'être). When they are able to clean it, they win. Usually, they can't quite clean it. In the end, at the top-five level (all have decent enough show designs even in the top-12), cleanest wins. BD and Cavies in different parts of their shows, to a greater or lesser degree, clearly, indisputably (yes, the video can be analyzed, yes, there is such a thing as evidence, as fact), prioritize either marching or playing, not as much both simultaneously, or will march slower if the music is demanding, or vice versa. That way, it's much easier to clean and control. Usually, in the last decade or so, that approach wins. Which 'school' of show design is valued by the fans depends on your taste. Corps like Phantom and Madison are harder to categorize, but they mainly try to emotionally connect and draw at times from both of the above schools. The judges and fans do value the 'effect' of how impressive or emotionally moving shows are, so at times, Phantom and Madison out-perform everyone. Until the judging system explicitly values demand and can agree on what's demanding, we'll have nothing but bickering on here, and we'll be moving towards more cautious, clever, show designs that are selectively demanding. Some will say "brilliant staging" instead of my choice of word "clever", but that reveals which school of DCI show design you're coming from. Yes, this is all an oversimplification, but that's what a meta-analysis tries to do. I'm biased towards virtuosity and demand (aim over your head). Other fans are biased toward clean (aim lower, manage risk, be clean). What do all y'all think?

Truly inspiring to see that innovation and demand and uncompromising aesthetics have been rewarded this year. Congratulations to everyone in the Cadets family! FHNSAB

And I agree with you. Completely. I even enjoy the caps. It tells me you're righter than right. All these insane, sheets-naive corps who do all these ridiculously hard things and take such risks to challenge themselves and the audience, and commit to innovate year after year, should be ticked into submission. I say: slow it down. Park and blow. Take a chair. Take it easy. Don't aim too high, brah. Just execute what you have. If you execute the ordinary perfectly, voila, it becomes extraordinary. It's, like, totally magic. And if it isn't magic enough this year to win, the MISTAKE is probably the JUDGES' FAULT. (See how the caps work their magic?) I say: Play to the sheets, not to an audience's or an artistic standard, and then win that way, using the same proven formula, and finally, for decades, lord it over everyone else about how they don't 'execute' well enough to win enough. I proclaim: Let us all bow down and kiss their rings. So now that I've kissed all of them, I feel better. Relieved. Reborn. I know my place now. It's all good, dude. We all know that if you wipe out on Mavericks, you're a kook, and it's your fault. Better to try to surf waist-high waves. Perfectly, though. But don't even try to hum while you do it. That would be too risky.

Stop blaming this on demons. I'm tired of all the hating on this board. Members falling is a sign to me that all corps need to lower their demand so that they can execute perfectly, all the time, no matter what. We need to prevent the insanity and danger to life, limb, and performance scores of playing and marching simultaneously, and especially doing it fast, backwards, or on grass, which stains uniforms, or astroturf, which may chafe. We need to "stage" more effectively to make things look harder, and thus mitigate risk. Pushing the envelope causes injuries, such as the Cadets snare who gutted it out for weeks but then had to bow out, causing significant reassignments in the drill, risking lower scores. Sports, too, I think need to be toned down on demand, because people can get hurt consistently pushing themselves. And they sweat from exertion, which is just plain offensive. And let's not forget property. Instruments get damaged too. Yamaha's gonna sue someone. Instead of marching, drum corps members should stand still so we don't dent a bari or bend a mello's bell. Oh, and let's get this straight: the Cadets contra who fell and recovered didn't "squeeze" back into the line. I read the other thread. Didn't you? He was clearly "slotted" into the line by the judges. And speaking of judges: I was shocked to see that they actually run around on that field. Get them off the field, because fast movements, as well as simultaneous movement and talking into their tri-corders, make me very nervous. They should slot themselves into some chairs. I wish all the corps good luck, and seriously, despite the risk, no more injuries. I am heartened to see that most corps really do push the limit. I've never seen so much quality on the field than I did at quarter finals. Amazing. Congrats to every single marching member in every single corps (even if I have which I might call a 'long-standing' beef with certain show designers who act too much like attorneys). And thank you Madison, who brought tears to my family's eyes this year, to Crown, who they thought was great fun and had phenomenal brass, to Vanguard, who always, always push the limit, to the Cavaliers, who amaze with their marching, and to the Blue Devils, whose members have the talent to execute anything. May everyone play and march their best tonight. Enjoy the experience - what an amazing, amazing year of drum corps.

I agree with absolutely everything you said except the point about BD. This thread isn't about them, but about the sheets. BD thinks they're in the driver's seat, leading the pack, but they're just being driven by the sheets, and that's driving innovation and virtuosity out of shows, and driving people away from DCI. In fact, I haven't driven to a show in three years. I've posted in past years about the sheets driving the disincentive for corps to push the envelope because the sheets don't care about demand, especially simultaneous demand (whole corps doing something demanding, for more time in a show, speed, difficulty in music, and multiple demands on individuals - marching, playing, etc.) The Cavaliers invented this strategy, responding to the sheets. They'd do the same thing, and other corps followed. Those corps figured out that 'body movement' is easier to clean and control and execute, for example, than drill and design. So we have more of it, and it gets goofier and more high school all the time. Lots of hard marching in places, almost no simultaneous playing, and some hard(er) playing, but no marching, one group in a corps doing something hard while the rest move props or 'move' their 'body' without playing, etc. etc. That's not drum corps to me, and I'm not old school, and I'm not against evolution. That's devolution. That's just cheap. Gaming the system. If I want great marching and little or no playing at the same time, I'll watch the Marines. If I want to see people playing phenomenally well, I'll see the Cleveland Orchestra. If all this is only about points, and winning through sleight-of-hand (or at the propagandists say, "staging" and "effective design"), then I care less and less. I used to be angry about it. Now I'm just demoralized. I feel like DCI has lost something essential, has cheapened its unique art form, and it's also my loss. A lot of so-called 'standards' and discourse in this country has been cheapened too. "Every time I think I'm becoming more cynical, something else happens and I realize I'll never keep up" (Lily Tomlin) I used to take my family to several shows a year, local, regional, and travelling hundreds of miles to get to finals. I haven't been to a show in three years (though I regret missing Rockford this year, and speaking of Rockford, regret missing Phantom 08). Recently, I just sigh and pay attention to other art forms and sports where virtuosity and skill and innovation are valued explicitly and transparently in competition. I never say "wow!" at a high score or a medal. I say "wow!" at innovation and virtuosity and emotion and beauty on the field. I think most other fans of most all corps feel the same way. Or maybe they just learn to care a little bit less, and lower their standards along with the sheets. Maybe they just can't imagine anything different, and when that happens, the terrorists win and I'll give up forever as I have my final feast on Cargill turkey with Blackwater/Xe relish and drizzled with Chernobyl sauce. But gold's at $1400 an ounce....hold the turkey...maybe I'll do whatever I have to do to get me some...

I used to work as an editor.

Very interesting numbers. Since I'm guessing you believe that they do, in fact, capture demand somehow, my analysis of those numbers, since now there's all this discussion of certain groups, even though this was supposed to be a general discussion about demand and judging standards, tells me that these Cadets people (whoever they are) have a show that is 1-3% more demanding than these Blue Devil people (though I thought people say the Cadets had the demonic influence going this year). 1-3% difference in "demand" if that's what's measured in those sub-captions? That's no difference, really. Neck and neck. But so many people on these forums seem to be saying that the difference in demand between these 'teams' is actually huge. I don't know as I've seen no one live this year, unfortunately. So...on the judges sheets, it's all pretty much equally demanding. And if you clearly biased fans think you can judge shows better than the Judges, because you don't have to fit your judgment into narrow categories and according to vague DCI standards (cited early in this thread), and think that certain corps have less or much less demand, you're blind, or a hater, or naive to what's really important: winning. It's the way the game is played, son. Grow up. The message from DCI without subcaptions for demand = don't try so hard. And when you try hard, just have 1/3 or 1/5 of the corps try hard, and give the rest a rest. The judges, following DCI's judging standards, (as well as some loyal fans) will call it brilliant staging, and you'll get lots of gold, and the rest of the corps will follow, going for gold or trying to crack the top 12. I wonder if that's what we want, because from my outsider's perspective, that's a lot of what's been happening in the last ten years.

The last number of posts illustrate my point: it's all equally demanding. We all *find* demand wherever we look, and what we like, and those corps for which we honk, always seems to end up being the most "demanding" thing on the field. All we need is rose colored glasses, or mirrors, to magically make anything twice as risky and demanding. Voila. As I've said: visual sleight-of-hand ain't demand. Staging one section while others do nothing particularly demanding isn't great design, it's just cleverly managing risk. It's not making what's really hard look easy, which is virtuosity. It's making what's easier look harder, which is DCI these days. Without more objective standards for evaluating demand, demand effectively means nothing, because it's all relative.

Interesting fencing analogy, but it's not mainly about making hard look easy to beginners. It's about doing hard things and having experts (judges, FMM fans, musicians) recognize and value that difficulty. I think it's even clearer with diving or gymnastics or skating or snowboarding, etc. etc. Individual moves have demand levels; you execute them well, it's a multiplier effect. So demand is rewarded. We want to reward risk-taking and innovation, not caution. I want to see the DCI equivalent of Mary Lou Retton, who needs to get a 9.9 or 10.0 on a very difficult vault to win gold, and she can't win with an easier vault, so there's no point being cautious. And then see her stick it. And get rewarded.

Speed up any of those things, i.e. adding visual demand, and add musical demand, do things simultaneously, and every one is MUCH harder, and I'd say, has greater virtuosity and effect, and should be scored higher. It's not all equally hard, so let's stop pretending it is. This is getting Orwellian.