Amping the brass line

[Cappybara]

34 minutes ago, johnpendell said:

Agree, dunno if cheating is the right word... but it's definitely lame. 

Cheating, probably not. But morally questionable, I would say so. 

And this includes Phantom, which is a corps I love. 

Edited July 17, 2017 by Cappybara

[Mello Dude]

38 minutes ago, johnpendell said:

Agree, dunno if cheating is the right word... but it's definitely lame. 

That is disturbing.

[E3D]

9 hours ago, Liahona said:

FAST FORWARD TO 2017!!!!!

And where are we now folks?  I am VERY concerned now...

This VIDEO has not gotten enough traction IMO...there's been some discussion....but I AM VERY ALARMED actually...Is it cheating? well maybe I won't go that far...but I can say I DO NOT LIKE IT...this is a PERFORMANCE BASED ACTIVITY...SAD!

 

 

Makes a ton of good points. I don't like it and had a hard time watching Bluecoats show last year because of the way they had done the audio. 

I like to refer to it as "Audio Doping" because - basically the corps doing this are cheating. DCI should step in and make better rules for this. 

[E3D]

1 hour ago, Liahona said:

WOW...if true...that has gone way too far IMO...

I said the same thing last year to a friend of mine. If the corps are taking it so far as to mic and amplify the ensemble then what stops them from pre-recording and mixing in the stuff they want or a solo.

 

It is the same as when the bugler for a Veterans funeral is sham because it is a recording not a real bugle. The bugler stands there as if he is playing it goes through the motions all the while most of the family does not know that it is fake. 

[trumpetcam]

2 hours ago, Cappybara said:

I agree with you on SCV completely. There is something deceptive or dare I say "morally" wrong with micing your best players to play intricate parts and trying to pass that off as the full ensemble playing together. 

One could argue that they're solos, but I really don't see it that way because they would be highlighted visually if that was the case

I think you are misinformed about SCV. their whole concept is using a 12 person virtuoso ensemble as an additional group that adds another level of sophistication. If you think they carry the sole level of technique in the show, your obviously not paying attention at all. Do you also realize this small group does not even play the entire 2nd or most of 3rd production of show? In fact, SCV is playing most of the show with 64 brass, several times with 52 brass as some push props if key moments.  I think to make a blanket statement when you don't really know the facts is dangerous to the kids. I don't think any of us love amplification, but given modern staging and drill demands, it's necessary at times. If you don't think they are playing real meat, go watch a brass rehearsal and come back with actual information. I think you'd change your tune pretty fast. There is a reason they are in the mix for best brassline, field judges can barely hear small group down there. Plenty of good stuff in their show if you choose to open your ears. Same for bluecoats, Phantom and Blue Devils.

BD, however, does mike the whole hornline which is why it always sounds so clear and right in rhthe mix. BD is very talented, but have always used microphones very well too. Smart design and taking advantage of current rules. Like it or not, that's the game.

Edited July 17, 2017 by trumpetcam

[Liahona]

3 minutes ago, trumpetcam said:

I think you are misinformed about SCV. their whole concept is using a 12 person virtuoso ensemble as an additional group that adds another level of sophistication. If you think they carry the sole level of technique in the show, your obviously not paying attention at all. Do you also realize this small group does not even play the entire 2nd or most of 3rd production of show? In fact, SCV is playing most of the show with 64 brass, several times with 52 brass as some push props if key moments.  I think to make a blanket statement when you don't really know the facts is dangerous to the kids. I don't think any of us love amplification, but given modern staging and drill demands, it's necessary at times. If you don't think they are playing real meat, go watch a brass rehearsal and come back with actual information. I think you'd change your tune pretty fast.

 

BD and Phantom, however, does mike the whole hornline which is why it always sounds so clear and right in rhthe mix. BD is very talented, but have always used microphones very well too. 

I get it..defend one and criticize the others...

[trumpetcam]

6 minutes ago, Liahona said:

I get it..defend one and criticize the others...

How is this criticizing? One is an assumption while my observation is based on intimate knowledge of the product. It's good to have facts before you make a statement like "morally wrong" or "deceptive". You don't agree? Those are pretty strong words for a drum corps. You realize kids read this stuff so maybe we should think about them sometimes before we make assumptive statements without facts. Also, please don't mistake passion for criticism. 

Edited July 17, 2017 by trumpetcam

[E3D]

I don't like any of it. I do think it is cheating and is at the point of becoming disturbing. 

 

[Liahona]

1 minute ago, trumpetcam said:

How is this criticizing? It's good to have facts before you make a statement like "morally wrong." You don't agree?

I never said anything about being morally wrong. I don't agree with you though about another level of sophistication. That's just non-sense IMO.  I will reserve my right for further judgement when I see them live this summer...for now I'll just say it is questionable. And they are one of my favorites this season too.

[trumpetcam]

4 minutes ago, Liahona said:

I never said anything about being morally wrong. I don't agree with you though about another level of sophistication. That's just non-sense IMO.  I will reserve my right for further judgement when I see them live this summer...for now I'll just say it is questionable. And they are one of my favorites this season too.

Fair enough. I think when you see the small group spread 70 yards apart, you'll realize why their use and need for amplification is different than just volume and boosting the brass sound. BTW:  The original quote I used from  cappy said morally wrong, that's why I mentioned that .  

 

I'm not a huge fan either of this use in drum corps today, but I think some are really trying to use it in a fresh and unique way, not just turning the volume up. Everyone has work to do to make this a valuable addition, not a detriment. It's still a process. 

Edited July 17, 2017 by trumpetcam