Saving Drum Corps part I: Defining the problem

[reallyoldfrt]

Precisely!

[Tim K]

It's funny, DCI can get vilainized in many posts and being the reason the state of drum corps is the way it is today. I see some of the points and concerns are valid. I think it can also be argued that drum corps would not exist today if it were not for DCI because the activity was beginning to decline in the early 70's, but few realized it. I recall seeing in one post that the number of corps that disbanded with fewer new corps to replace them began around 1971 and most of the replacement corps were mergers and mergers did not fare very well, the Crossmen being the notable exception. I have never directed a drum corps so I do not know specific costs or salaries, but professionally I a understand non-profit organizations and have to had to fundraise, meet salaries, heating costs, maintenance costs, and the like for a non-profit organization. And the challenges faced by drum corps are not unique and are faced by other organizations that involve young people, and DCI creating a group of elite corps has little or nothing to do with it.

Back in the heyday of drum corps, which most would agree would be the 50's, 60's and up to the mid 70's, most youth organizations whether they be musical or athletic, ran on the belief that if an activity was going to emerge, funding would follow. No one wanted to let the kids down, and by and large this worked. It's not realistic to function this way anymore. Budgets are needed and funds have to be raised. Instruments are more expensive, there are cost that didn't exist back then, namely insurance and royalties that have to be paid to be paid for music, and I'm sure I am only at the tip of the iceberg for even a non-travelling corps. Even with volunteers as instructors and designers, and without "the pit" for percussion sections, the costs are high and the funds have to be raised prior to fielding. This is a truth that all the happy memories of the past will not change today's realities. If we want new drum corps, funds need to be raised to meet costs.

While we cannot go back to the good old days as far as funding is concerned, DCI could be instrumental in bringing back local circuits and helping form smaller local corps by assisting with the training of managers an instructors and having people help with development and fundraising. It could also limit how much money elite corps can be spend in instructional and design fees and salaries to make the playing field a little more equal, but I'm not naïve and I know it will not happen. DCI refers to itself as "Marching Music's Major League," well whose a greater supporter of Little League than Major League Baseball? DCI should support all levels of corps, even those taht will neve rtravel to Indianapolis.

Edited January 12, 2012 by Tim K

[GUARDLING]

The person above should demonstrate to any thoughtful reader exactly the current, elitist, closed club mentality that pervades the money minded population of the pitifully few corps that still exist in the activity.

I think I mentioned there were talented people in the "good ole days". People that we revere as treasures. They worked for gas, or lunch money. They taught kids who wouldn't know a bugle from a Chevrolet. They got music out of those kids. So did people that some current snobs would dismiss as "unqualified". The horn line of my corps was taught , for gas money, by a guy named Harry Rogers. Harry was a legendary arranger, and partner of Artie Shaw, and principle arranger for the Artie Shaw Orchestra, and others. As a sideman he played in many bands, Benny Goodman, Harry James, Tommy Dorsey, Woody Herman, and others. You may have heard of them.

Just because all the instructors in the GODs worked for the love of music, and of drum corps didn't make them bums. They were dedicated music educators. Elitist Pr--ks, like the guy up the page, make me ill.

Because of this funnyman, and the legions who have become used to gorging on the kids sweat, makes it all too clear how vampires enjoy their current popularity.

Besides, remember, this is all a pipe dream.

I also was taught back then and had wonderful people teaching and directing BUT that was then this is now. Corps could never survive the way it was then, corps can be a 24/7 job for directors and staff. No churchor school gives up space to rehearse....if you could fit 150 kids. Drum corps is not a hobby any more. Ive lived through both and for me love to look back but would rather stay here in the now although the tightness of local kids, local corps local staff was really nice BUT ya know CYOs,Church groups, clubs all could say the same, its not the same world and not serving the same kid. KIDS have many many choices today not like we did. I also would like to pay 40cents for a gallon of gas and thats not going to happen either.

[Tim K]

I am currently trying to get a music program going in an elementary school. I am hoping it will be a concert band that will also do parades. My thought is to start small and work up to something larger. Some of the people involved will be paid which is fitting since it is a school activity, others will be volunteers, namely parents. I was thinking about this endeavor as I was reading some posts. Many people speak about volunteers doing everything and running low cost corps. It might be doable though it would still involve more costs than in the past, but if people want to see it happen, someone has to make it happen: begin from scratch, find the volunteers, and make it happen.

One other note, while I cannot say for certain, my guess is that even in the “good old days” prior to DCI, the lead drill instructors, music directors, and head percussion instructors and maybe even color guard directors were paid. Even if it was a “gift” at the end of the season, there had to be some compensation which would explain why some instructors seemed to go from drum corps to band to drill team to band to drum corps so frequently. Drum corps had a glorious past, no doubt, but it was not a cost free past.

[reallyoldfrt]

No one ever said it was free BITD.There have always been costs. Some of them can not be reduced, horns and drums for example. What is undeniably true is that costs must be reduced, drastically in most areas where it can be done. Drum corps is not a hobby anymore. I'm saying that it should be. One poster said that kids today have many more things to do now. I believe that the kids today would enjoy participating in drum corps if only they hadn't been told to F O right at the front door because they weren't trained musicians, didn't have their own horn, or didn't have X thousand dollars to go on tour, or eight weeks off in the summer.

To achieve significant cost reduction for all corps, drastic re-thinking is going to be required. If you read, and comprehended, my first post you would have seen a few things in that proposal that might make sense, given the will.

DCI is set up at all levels to favor the four or five corps that have the money. Few, or maybe, none, of the others have any realistic chance of beating the big money corps. Almost every "innovation" put into the rule book is set up to increase costs. These things are promulgated by the money corps, and manipulated into the way things are done by the money corps. With each refinement the money corps gain another advantage, (as if they needed more), and the other corps, (that's you Boston, you Glassmen, you Bluecoats, in fact 90+% of all corps.

While the kids in these corps are just overworked, underfed, and ignored, the Biggies live in relative comfort, have the best shows money can buy, and exert all their prestige and monetary power to gain unfair advantage over their lesser brethren.

The DCI officials, staff, and judges live like kings in luxury hotels, rental cars, hospitality suites, and eat in fine restaurants that they've been able to bludgeon out of hapless local sponsors where ever they go. They have posh off-season meetings in places like Cancun, Hawaii, and American Samoa, all paid for by the blood, sweat, labor, and cash contributions of the 90% of the corps they've been screwing for decades now. Believe me, the American Legion, and VFW, were rank amateurs compared to DCI when it comes to screwing the corps they claim to be aiding. And the screw-ees just keep thanking them for it. It's a brilliant scam.

There are those who say that, if it weren't for DCI there would be no drum corps today. It's a statement that be argued either way. The fact is nobody can prove it, or disprove it..

Given the indisputable fact that, under the stewardship of DCI, over 95% of all corps that existed in 1972 have taken the eternal dirt nap. If you want to argue that most of those corps lacked any artistic merit, you might be partially right. But all those corps provided a healthy, positive social environment for their members, and all of them had a fundamental right to exist. That is probably the single most un-American principle of DCI. They sincerely believe that; if corps is not actively seeking a national championship, or lacks the where-with-all to do so, they have no right to exist, except as a source of talent for the Big Boys to harvest.

[Puppet]

While Elphaba said most of what I would have to reply and many of you have chimed in with your memories, I must most ardently add as I have said many times before.

• If these are World Class Drum Corps, why then are they sleeping on floors and eating from what can only be called roach coaches?
  

With all the money we didn't have we always slept in Hotels and Motels and ate in restaurants while we were on tour.

• 
  
• Why do these so-called World Class Drum Corps have so many money problems when the members are required to pay thousands of dollars each just to participate?
  

I was a member of a "Class A" drum corps who funded itself by running a bingo once a week and we never required our members to ever pay a fee or any dues.

All else has been said over and over on these pages. There is no solution to what DCI has become.

Yes, I do love to see these fresh-faced adults going through their paces.

No, I do not love that I have to have a second mortgage just to buy a ticket to a venue in which I cannot hear a blessed thing other than the synthesizers.

Yes, I appreciate the time and effort put forth by these fresh-faced adults through their try-outs and camps and travel and so forth.

But no, I do not think for one single second that they appreciate the year-long efforts we gave to play and march for our 6 to 7 month competition seasons.

Am I whining? Heck no. I wouldn't trade my time and my experience for one single minute of those adults who are "marching" now. Why? Because those are memories (selective though they may be!) of my youth. My adolescent days are precious to me. There will never be any going back to how Drum Corps was. But I ask you: Will any of these adults in uniform ever experience thee thrill of seeing for the first time a corps they have never seen in person before?

There's the rub, my friends. There is no thrill for these people ... ever. And it's a shame.

Edited January 12, 2012 by Puppet

[KeithHall]

What happened to all the posts from yesterday?

[JimF-LowBari]

What happened to all the posts from yesterday?

Think the answer is there were two threads Keith. The other one (in the non-historical area) got closed about this time yesterday.

Edited January 12, 2012 by JimF-LowBari

[Tim K]

You have some interesting points here, but there is one that I think frames this discussion in an important direction, that being the merit of the activity. I was involved in the CYO music program in junior high and early high school. The competition was real and heart felt, and most units had their good and bad years, but all offered great experiences, even one that most believed had no “artistic” merit. My band mourned the demise of this band (judging from his profile, my guess is that “reallyoldfrt” knows what band I’m referring to), but that’s because anytime they competed we were guaranteed not to place last, only kidding. Also “artistic merit” can be overrated and is in the eye of the beholder. I am amazed at the ways horn lines and drum lines march today, and I would argue it’s artistic, but some of the color guards may be artistic, but does every show need ballet scenes, combined with bizarre costumes a uniforms, a heavy dose of make-up and “Cirque du Soleil” style dance moves that resemble contortions? However I should not be too critical of these young people who have more talent in their little finger that I have in my entire body, besides its off topic

I’m sure DCI’s top priority would be creating national champions, and bottom line that’s how it should be, but the elite should not be the only ones who get to march. Even kids who qualify for elite corps have to begin somewhere. Also, young people who have to work for college expenses but have some time to devote to a corps needs someplace to march and as older role models can impart some of these values. I remember many life lessons learned from various musical instructors, drill instructors, and parents who made the whole program run. Drum corps, like sporting activities and theater arts should be available to as many kids at as at many different levels as possible.

I have had the opportunity to know as colleagues, mentors, friends, and in one case employer some of the great “CYO” priests of the Archdiocese of Boston, names like Fr. Joe Kierce, Fr. Charlie Duggan, Fr. Henry Cunney, Msgr. “Speed” Carroll and Msgr. McNiell. I am willing to bet that each of these priests, some of whom were founders of corps, probably thought first about what lessons ought to be taught, then started the drum corps, band, or drill team. Musical marching activities was a way to teach the values and life lessons, success in competition was second, well at least in theory. These men liked to win, but they loved the participants more.

No one ever said it was free BITD.There have always been costs. Some of them can not be reduced, horns and drums for example. What is undeniably true is that costs must be reduced, drastically in most areas where it can be done. Drum corps is not a hobby anymore. I'm saying that it should be. One poster said that kids today have many more things to do now. I believe that the kids today would enjoy participating in drum corps if only they hadn't been told to F O right at the front door because they weren't trained musicians, didn't have their own horn, or didn't have X thousand dollars to go on tour, or eight weeks off in the summer.

To achieve significant cost reduction for all corps, drastic re-thinking is going to be required. If you read, and comprehended, my first post you would have seen a few things in that proposal that might make sense, given the will.

DCI is set up at all levels to favor the four or five corps that have the money. Few, or maybe, none, of the others have any realistic chance of beating the big money corps. Almost every "innovation" put into the rule book is set up to increase costs. These things are promulgated by the money corps, and manipulated into the way things are done by the money corps. With each refinement the money corps gain another advantage, (as if they needed more), and the other corps, (that's you Boston, you Glassmen, you Bluecoats, in fact 90+% of all corps.

While the kids in these corps are just overworked, underfed, and ignored, the Biggies live in relative comfort, have the best shows money can buy, and exert all their prestige and monetary power to gain unfair advantage over their lesser brethren.

The DCI officials, staff, and judges live like kings in luxury hotels, rental cars, hospitality suites, and eat in fine restaurants that they've been able to bludgeon out of hapless local sponsors where ever they go. They have posh off-season meetings in places like Cancun, Hawaii, and American Samoa, all paid for by the blood, sweat, labor, and cash contributions of the 90% of the corps they've been screwing for decades now. Believe me, the American Legion, and VFW, were rank amateurs compared to DCI when it comes to screwing the corps they claim to be aiding. And the screw-ees just keep thanking them for it. It's a brilliant scam.

There are those who say that, if it weren't for DCI there would be no drum corps today. It's a statement that be argued either way. The fact is nobody can prove it, or disprove it..

Given the indisputable fact that, under the stewardship of DCI, over 95% of all corps that existed in 1972 have taken the eternal dirt nap. If you want to argue that most of those corps lacked any artistic merit, you might be partially right. But all those corps provided a healthy, positive social environment for their members, and all of them had a fundamental right to exist. That is probably the single most un-American principle of DCI. They sincerely believe that; if corps is not actively seeking a national championship, or lacks the where-with-all to do so, they have no right to exist, except as a source of talent for the Big Boys to harvest.

[garfield]

While Elphaba said most of what I would have to reply and many of you have chimed in with your memories, I must most ardently add as I have said many times before.

• If these are World Class Drum Corps, why then are they sleeping on floors and eating from what can only be called roach coaches?

With all the money we didn't have we always slept in Hotels and Motels and ate in restaurants while we were on tour.

• Why do these so-called World Class Drum Corps have so many money problems when the members are required to pay thousands of dollars each just to participate?

I was a member of a "Class A" drum corps who funded itself by running a bingo once a week and we never required our members to ever pay a fee or any dues.

All else has been said over and over on these pages. There is no solution to what DCI has become.

Yes, I do love to see these fresh-faced adults going through their paces.

No, I do not love that I have to have a second mortgage just to buy a ticket to a venue in which I cannot hear a blessed thing other than the synthesizers.

Yes, I appreciate the time and effort put forth by these fresh-faced adults through their try-outs and camps and travel and so forth.

But no, I do not think for one single second that they appreciate the year-long efforts we gave to play and march for our 6 to 7 month competition seasons.

Am I whining? Heck no. I wouldn't trade my time and my experience for one single minute of those adults who are "marching" now. Why? Because those are memories (selective though they may be!) of my youth. My adolescent days are precious to me. There will never be any going back to how Drum Corps was. But I ask you: Will any of these adults in uniform ever experience thee thrill of seeing for the first time a corps they have never seen in person before?

There's the rub, my friends. There is no thrill for these people ... ever. And it's a shame.

I gather from the tone of the posts here, and the complete-sentence thoughts being expressed, that Tim, Puppet, and Oldfart are "old guys", and I have always highly valued the chance to learn from people older and more experienced than I. I wonder if Tim and Oldfart and Puppet would share their ages? Disclosure: I'm 52, probably a youngin to you guys, and I went to my first show in '72. Guardian and DrillMan and I argue lots on the WC threads; I like to get this, seemingly, "older" viewpoint. I probably share lots of your feelings anyway.

But, to the point. It's hard to tell your hyperbole from your point, Puppet. I get the one-liners and, again, I value and agree with much of what you say. It's always good to establish where you are before you plan a way forward.

The arguments about costs to participate are relative - I make more annually today than my Dad made in 10 years; $125 finals ticket prices don't bug me. The fact that corps run "hand-to-mouth" bugs me, when they're charging for kids to participate. In a way, you should expect it: as the number of corps has diminished there are now more qualified members available each year than the (sadly, low) number of corps can handle. The supply of MMs far outstrips the number of corps that can take them. It also reflects the nature of kids today, many fewer kids will "settle" and march a lower corps if they get cut at their dream corps. They'll just go home and do something else. When directors started seeing the long lines at auditions they (rightly, to some degree) started charging to whittle out the not-serious and less-experienced.

More thoughts later...