Cadets98 Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 As a life-long Holy Name/Cadets fan (since early 50's) I have to say that 92 was the most shocking outcome I ever witnessed. Tremendous show. I could watch it forever. I love the musical content and drill. But the horns were out of tune at crucial points and this seemed to be ignored. I think Star had everything needed to leap over BD and, no matter what the sheets say, I still cannot understand the results. I think as musicians we can maintain objectivity, and whatever my homey tendencies might be, the best performance deserves the best results. I refuse to bash judges. Their job is very difficult. Kevin Star might have had the best hornline in DCI history that year. I just think that DCI wasn't ready to have that design win. Star was getting booed every night they won, including Quarterfinals night. At Semis, the crowd went absolutely nuts when Star's score was announced under Cavaliers. It was one of those moments in DCI history. Did popular opinion have an effect on the judges then? Who knows. As I read your post again, there was definitely no leaping for Star that year. They were a falling Star that year. 1st Quarters, 2nd Semis, and 3rd Finals Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Doherty Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 Zeke, I was one of those, among several, who pointed out the intonation problems, although from Mike's clip, it also shows that the Cadets played big in-tune chords. The intonation problems were there - listen to the CD or watch the DVD. What the judges heard and judged is not for me to say. They did their very difficult job. Mike mentioned, and many others have, that if only Corps X had another week of cleaning time, the results may have been different. Maybe so, but you don't get extra time and we all know that. There is a deadline All the Corps live with it. It levels the playing field from a time perspective. Sorry for stating the obvious, for which I will get leveled, but I could stand some smoothing. To stretch the analogy, if Schwartzkopf's Colonels had said, Geez General, can I have another week to clean up my unit's performance? Then we will be prepared for this day. Schwarzkopf: We have a strict timetable. We go today. Bust your fanny. I maintain my support of Star for 92 but retrospect is futile unless you don't learn to not repeat your mistakes. BTW, Cadets worked very hard on intonation in 93. I was at a number of rehearsals. It paid off. Sorry for rambling. Kevin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrumManTx Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 Still don't understand why Star got booed so much that year, but I guess that's a whole other topic in itself. The show seemed pretty crowd accessible, so I'm at a loss. Love the Cadets show as well though, Amazing guard as pointed out, love the closer. Some fast stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Doherty Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 Sorry, Still feel ignorant when I wrote BD instead of Cavies. KD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 My mistake. I should have said Cavies rather than BD I did see the Cavies that year and the musical performance was excellent and the Brubaker drill superb, but I'm sticking with Star (as if I could change history. I shouldn't give myself a break on that issue-idiotic on my part) Kevin i'm with you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Boo Posted March 15, 2012 Author Share Posted March 15, 2012 Still don't understand why Star got booed so much that year, but I guess that's a whole other topic in itself. The show seemed pretty crowd accessible, so I'm at a loss. Love the Cadets show as well though, Amazing guard as pointed out, love the closer. Some fast stuff. That remains quite disturbing to me. I was with Bill Cook (in Toledo?...don't remember for sure where) when he was with customers of his whom he was introducing to drum corps. They were quite confused as to why some fans were booing Star and Bill was justifiably humiliated by the action. I couldn't explain it, but I wondered if envy was part of the equation. I hope the fans never appear to be booing kids in any corps ever again. Even if the booing isn't of the kids but the results, how can one tell the kids that? It's only going to sound like they are being booed. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrumManTx Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 That remains quite disturbing to me. I was with Bill Cook (in Toledo?...don't remember for sure where) when he was with customers of his whom he was introducing to drum corps. They were quite confused as to why some fans were booing Star and Bill was justifiably humiliated by the action. I couldn't explain it, but I wondered if envy was part of the equation. I hope the fans never appear to be booing kids in any corps ever again. Even if the booing isn't of the kids but the results, how can one tell the kids that? It's only going to sound like they are being booed. Haters gonna hate. lol But yeah, jealously or something seems to be the only thing that would cause that. I guess it's only mind boggling cause it seemed the past 2 years they really had the crowd on their side (especially 91). Who knows. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Doherty Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 Re: last couple of comments. I am appalled. Mike, that had to have been a terrible experience. Drum manTX: The Yin Yang is always at work. That doesn't mean we can't work to shift it. We don't have to tolerate the haters. Let's send them to their hater's place so they can hate each other. Having worked in Labor Relations for many years, one of my Union Official friends would tell me " I'm a Lover, Not a Fighter" We got along very well and accomplished a lot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Boo Posted March 15, 2012 Author Share Posted March 15, 2012 Re: last couple of comments. I am appalled. Mike, that had to have been a terrible experience... It was. Sometimes, one feels bad not for how something affects them personally, but for how something affects someone whom they care about. Bill mentioned that incident as the moment he didn't feel welcomed in drum corps. George Bonfiglio, who had long closed up 27th Lancers, mentioned later that drum corps didn't realize what it had when it chased Bill away. I was haunted by those words. Fortunately, I think time has made many people realize that actions often have consequences. Does anyone else remember the announcer at Ypsilanti Preview of Champions in 1993 when he publicly scolded people for booing after Star won the show? I remember there was a controversy over that because many (understandably) felt it was equally inappropriate to berate people who are paying for tickets. I remember two officials with DCI (who are no longer with DCI) telling me that personally. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cadets98 Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 It was. Sometimes, one feels bad not for how something affects them personally, but for how something affects someone whom they care about. Bill mentioned that incident as the moment he didn't feel welcomed in drum corps. George Bonfiglio, who had long closed up 27th Lancers, mentioned later that drum corps didn't realize what it had when it chased Bill away. I was haunted by those words. Fortunately, I think time has made many people realize that actions often have consequences. Does anyone else remember the announcer at Ypsilanti Preview of Champions in 1993 when he publicly scolded people for booing after Star won the show? I remember there was a controversy over that because many (understandably) felt it was equally inappropriate to berate people who are paying for tickets. I remember two officials with DCI (who are no longer with DCI) telling me that personally. Hmm...I was there and I do not remember that. I was also 16 years old and who knows maybe I was one of them booing. I hope not but I was young and dumb at one time. Some of my friends and mentors marched Star in those years and they said they pretty much got used to the booing. It probably developed a certain kind of competitive character. Many of these folks are now on Crown's staff and their personalities are one's with a lot of "fire." Who knows if there is really a connection. Personally, I can remember being booed in 95 everytime we (Cadets) beat Madison. This even happened at OUR HOME SHOW at Giants Stadium. It was crazy. At the time, I thought it was kind of funny and maybe a bit of a "badge of honor." I thought who cares if we are getting booed, we still beat them and I knew we were better anyway. We had our eyes on BD bigtime, (we never saw Cavies coming that year). Maybe some of that "badge of honor" feeling came from me seeing it happen to Star which by that time I appreciated. I can distinctly remember Star being booed at their home show in Bloomington too in 92 (I think, maybe 93). Anyways, this is a rambling post and sorry that it got off topic there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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