GUARDLING Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 But keep in mind that some of the reaction on finals 2008 was due to who didn't win. That's just the way it is...and it's not one or the other...it's a big mix of both. this is very true.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plan9 Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 june 22ish is DDay. and if others keep saying it to you, maybe it is the messenger, not the person receiving the message. I know you well enough to know when you're full of #### and when you're just your usual self First off, when am I not full of ####?.....and because you "know", please tell my wife who thinks that's always my usual self! :-) love ya man! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRASSO Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 (edited) 2008 was great no doubt BUT theres a bigger picture with that. PR was the one to beat BD and maybe everyone that year and everyone loves a new winner let alone one who has done it so few times. This added to the frenzy. That was some of it too. Theres no denying that, imo. Most people do respond favorably to the underdog. That said, most of it was the show itself, imo. But no need to bring out the cartoon here with the guy with the whip thats beating the dead horse. I've enjoyed BD a lot more over the years than not... so heres hoping they have a great show this year and I wish them nothing but the best. Edited May 8, 2012 by BRASSO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Photographer Jim Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 I’ve been following this thread with some interest. I will admit to being a big BD fan (hey, they ARE my home town corps, and I have over the years had many students who were corps members), so I have been curious to see the reaction to this year’s show announcement, but my comments here are more a response to the ongoing debate on DCP regarding BD’s show design choices, fan reception, etc. Understand, I’m coming at this from the position of one who is a producer of art (visual, not musical) rather than that of a consumer of art. There are basically three driving forces at play when I create an image; I think these three forces are at play with ANY artist(s), regardless of medium. They are: a goal of executing my work with the highest possible technical proficiency that I can; a desire to express my “creative vision”; and a desire to produce an image that resonates with my viewing audience. Interestingly, (or not) the drive for technical perfection is actually the most important for me as an artist, because regardless of which of the other two is serving as the primary motivational goal, neither can be fully realized if I don’t nail the technical presentation. Presenting anything less than my technical best at the time is a disservice to my viewers. (Side-note: in competitive arenas, this force becomes even more important). The other two forces are the most problematic. Do I produce an image that is primarily motivated by what I wish to express, or do I make an image that comes primarily from what I perceive the viewing audience would prefer (like, appreciate)? I’ve done both. The ultimate goal, of course is to do both at the same time, but that can be a very narrow line to walk, and there are pit-falls to either choice. Following one’s own creative vision can leave some, or a lot, of the viewers dis-satisfied. Aim for perceived viewer response primarily, and one runs the risk of stagnating creatively as an artist. The key, IMO, is not permanently emphasizing one motivational force over the other. As I said, it’s a thin line to walk. In terms of drum corps, the best situation (again, IMO) is when SOME corps are designing their shows with an eye primarily on what do they think the current fans desire (at least from that corps), and when SOME corps are focused primarily on producing a show that best expresses their creative approach to the medium. Having both is ESSENTIAL for the ultimate health of the art form. If EVERY corps plays primarily to what they think the audience wants, not enough risks will be taken, and the art form becomes stale. If EVERY corps focuses primarily on their own personal creative interpretation of the medium, there is the possibility (depending on the direction the creative choices go) of ultimately losing too many fans, and becoming too much of a niche activity. I guess what I am saying is that I TAKE A GREAT DEAL OF COMFORT IN THE CONSTANT DEBATE (currently surrounding BD this time) over show choices and which motivational factors corps SHOULD be considering, because the existence of the debate means that different corps ARE approaching shows from different motivational directions and that is good for the long term health of this activity we all so love. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 That was some of it too. Theres no denying that, imo. Most people do respond favorably to the underdog. That said, most of it was the show itself, imo. But no need to bring out the cartoon here with the guy with the whip thats beating the dead horse. I've enjoyed BD a lot more over the years than not... so heres hoping they have a great show this year and I wish them nothing but the best. lets hope so Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kickhaltsforlife Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 But keep in mind that some of the reaction on finals 2008 was due to who didn't win. That's just the way it is...and it's not one or the other...it's a big mix of both. I wouldn't say it was a big mix of both. Yes I can't deny that many people were happy the see BD lose. Including myself. But it was more because I wanted Phantom to win. That show was AWESOME. And let's not forget that even before they beat Cavies and BD finals week, that show was already receiving a great crowd response the second half of the season. I remember early season BD was one of the fan favorites, but the show lost it's appeal to many people for some reason. When I saw BD at San Antonio in 08 I thought it was awesome. When I saw Phantom I was left flat, and thought they had a long way to go. I saw both in Atlanta and it was still the same feeling for the most part, but BD was losing me. Then I saw Phantom in Allentown and the crowd, including me went nuts. Come finals week BD was leaving me flat, and Phantom had me. It had nothing to do with wanting BD to lose. I'm a pretty small sample size myself... but let's not forget that no one knew who won until scores were announced. And Phantom won the crowd that night with their show. The crowd went nuts when BD was announced because Phantom won. I think it would have been the same if they beat the Cadets, Cavaliers, SCV. But again, I can't say that I wasn't a little more happy because it was BD they beat in the end. Especially because of the history. And it's not easy to beat BD. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plan9 Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 I wouldn't say it was a big mix of both. Yes I can't deny that many people were happy the see BD lose. Including myself. But it was more because I wanted Phantom to win. That show was AWESOME. And let's not forget that even before they beat Cavies and BD finals week, that show was already receiving a great crowd response the second half of the season. I remember early season BD was one of the fan favorites, but the show lost it's appeal to many people for some reason. When I saw BD at San Antonio in 08 I thought it was awesome. When I saw Phantom I was left flat, and thought they had a long way to go. I saw both in Atlanta and it was still the same feeling for the most part, but BD was losing me. Then I saw Phantom in Allentown and the crowd, including me went nuts. Come finals week BD was leaving me flat, and Phantom had me. It had nothing to do with wanting BD to lose. I'm a pretty small sample size myself... but let's not forget that no one knew who won until scores were announced. And Phantom won the crowd that night with their show. The crowd went nuts when BD was announced because Phantom won. I think it would have been the same if they beat the Cadets, Cavaliers, SCV. But again, I can't say that I wasn't a little more happy because it was BD they beat in the end. Especially because of the history. And it's not easy to beat BD. Very thoughtful and rational synopsis of your viewing experience that summer. RV nailed it with PR's timing of the complete story; while BD risked it with a fraction over the top percussion that cost them. Both were great shows and the scores tell it all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 But keep in mind that some of the reaction on finals 2008 was due to who didn't win. That's just the way it is...and it's not one or the other...it's a big mix of both. on one night yes possibly. however in Allentown the week before, BD didn't perform the same night, and the crowd went ape #### for Phantom and golf clapped BD. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 First off, when am I not full of ####?.....and because you "know", please tell my wife who thinks that's always my usual self! :-) love ya man! ok allow me to rephrase: I know when you're fuller of your own #### than usual better? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 (edited) on one night yes possibly. however in Allentown the week before, BD didn't perform the same night, and the crowd went ape #### for Phantom and golf clapped BD. very relateable show to an older crowd ( not that young didnt apppreciate it also) Edited May 8, 2012 by GUARDLING Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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