BRASSO Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 (edited) I know you will find this hard to believe BUT many felt it was the most over rated show of the decade. But this is different. You said above that (your quote )" you could find as many that oppose almost anything " Thats quite different than when you state here that in your observation, " many felt.... ". Thats because " many felt " is way less than " as many as " I submit that only a very small handful of fans believe that 2008 Phantom Regiment " Spartacus " production was " the most overrated show of the decade ". I believe those that agree with this statement are WAY less than the number of fans that found BD's show lacking in 2010. Certainly, from my observation, Phantom's show was very well received in 2008. I think it's production was not quite up to the level of adulation that I observed, but I have not met anyone that thinks it was " the most overrated show of the decade " either. I'm sure they are always going to be some fans out there whose tastes do not match the overwhelming majority of Drum Corps fans out there. There is nothing to apologize for, for not liking something in Drum Corps that lots of other Drum Corps fans do either. I support all points of view re. fans reactions to a Corps show, good, bad, or indifferent. My particular like or dislike for a Corps show does not always square with what I perceive to be the general consensus of the show from around the country. But when Dennis Delucia on the Semi Finals broadcast in 2010 also acknowledges on air that the BD show is not meeting with expected national approval he is only echoing the very same sentiment that many others across the country like me had noted by the time the Corps arrived at Championship Week in 2010. Now... maybe you and a few others did not notice this, but Dennis, Rondo, Michael sure did. They noticed it too,... and acknowledged this. Why others can not likewise acknowledge this, is not in my domain. Edited May 8, 2012 by BRASSO 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris ncsu Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 *eyes bleeding* Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 But this is different. You said above that " you could find an EQUAL number that oppose almost anything ". Thats quite different than when you state here that in your observation, " many felt.... ". I do believe nothing is 100 % especially here on DCP or even at any particular show...like lets say Allentown..which has been one of my fav place to perform and teach a corps performing there. Its a way different crowd there compared to most shows. It brings out the die hards, and for sure older crowd.....................Now Im not saying thats bad in fact its good BUT certainly a crowd who likes what they like...So as big as that show is it cant be compared as an absoulute either.I think we may have beat this subject to death..........................as to the topic of thread I would be surprised if things change due to the sheets. Time will tell as always. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 Since the early 80's I can't remember anytime that BD could waltz into Allentown and receive more than a "polite" golf clap. I haven't been to J. Birney Crum in a while, but I would be tasked to think that the "local tenor" has changed considerably. I have been in JBC and seen the crowd react to BD very well on many occassions. Just not since about 2007 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 As I said -- AFAICT 'golf-clap' is more shorthand than a literal term. There's some very careful word choice going on here. Just what does "loud and clear" mean? Clearly audible? I'd phrase the BD crowd response as "less enthusiastic than the audience response to BD in the recent past". Silly to be word chopping here. It's clear BD has been designing shows which make great use of the intellectual and aesthetic legs of the effect triad but with far less use of the emotional. It becomes very obvious when you see BD defenders making claims "you just don't get it" and "at least it doesn't pander" or "not programmed to the lowest common denominator". Personally I think if your audience doesn't "get it", it's you (the designer) that has failed and not the audience. You need to take the whole audience on the journey not just those willing to do the legwork before viewing the show. But -- that's just my opinion :-) can you clinic that? thank you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 I agree with this in reference to BD 09 and 10. The audience responded less enthusiastically than it had to other BD (or other championship) shows in the past. However - and again, this is the big however - that isn't saying the crowd in general didn't like the show. I think the applause indicated clearly the crowd was voicing enthusiasm for BD. This isn't an exercise in semantics - at least not where I'm concerned. Neither is it just black or white, loved or hated. Nuance is necessary in this analysis because the crowd wasn't uniform. It is reasonable - and I say its factual - to report that BD 09-10 received a range of response that in aggregate was approving and enthusiastic. For the many golf claps in my chucklehead expert section, there were more fans clapping louder and harder in support of the show/performance/effort/chairs/mirrors/gator/younameit. Crown probably got more applause in 09. Cavies probably got more in 10. BD got plenty nonetheless, enough to say the crowd in general appreciated the show loudly and clearly. And by the way, not that it should determine my credibility in this matter, I was a golf clapper. HH gotta be honest...golf clapping isn't indicitive of support. it is indicitive of people being polite. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRASSO Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 (edited) I do believe nothing is 100 % especially here on DCP or even at any particular show...like lets say Allentown..which has been one of my fav place to perform and teach a corps performing there. Its a way different crowd there compared to most shows. It brings out the die hards, and for sure older crowd.....................Now Im not saying thats bad in fact its good BUT certainly a crowd who likes what they like...So as big as that show is it cant be compared as an absoulute either.I think we may have beat this subject to death..........................as to the topic of thread I would be surprised if things change due to the sheets. Time will tell as always. It could be that Dennis Delucia, Michael Cesario, Steve Rondinaro are getting to be an " older crowd " too, who knows. But when they notice that a Corps show is not meeting with lots of approval from around the country.. and acknowledge it on air, then they are no more " blasphemous " in my opinion than the " older crowd " thats going to some show venues... or for that matter designing these shows. The notion that the out there shows and out there brass charts are designed by " the younger crowd" only works if one thinks that Wayne Downey is a " young guy ". As for the thread question, like you, I don't think we'll see any Corps show benefitting ( or being penalized ) by the incorporation of new judging sheets. Thats my take too. But who knows. We'll learn in time. Edited May 8, 2012 by BRASSO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 It could be that Dennis Delucia, Michael Cesario, Steve Rondinaro are getting to be an " older crowd " too, who knows. But when they notice that a Corps show is not meeting with lots of approval from around the country.. and acknowledge it on air, then they are no more " blasphemous " in my opinion than the " older crowd " thats going to some show venues... or for that matter designing these shows. The notion that the out there shows and out there brass charts are designed by " the younger crowd" only works if one thinks that Wayne Downey is a " young guy ". As for the thread question, like you, I don't think we'll see any Corps show benefitting ( or being penalized ) by the incorporation of new judging sheets. Thats my take too. But who knows. We'll learn in time. I would agree although I cant speak about Steve BUT I have worked several times with dennis and a few with Michael and these guys are politicians....that there is no doubt..lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corpsband Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 can you clinic that? thank you Yes. Slide 1. Does the Audience understand your show? A) Yes. Go to Slide 3. B) No, Go to Slide 2. Slide 2. Simplify / clarify concepts. Don't be afraid of being obvious ! Go to Slide 1. Slide 3. Congratulations. Now clean that mess ! THE END. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 Yes. Slide 1. Does the Audience understand your show? A) Yes. Go to Slide 3. B) No, Go to Slide 2. Slide 2. Simplify / clarify concepts. Don't be afraid of being obvious ! Go to Slide 1. Slide 3. Congratulations. Now clean that mess ! THE END. win Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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