Jeff Ream Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 You should know by now I'm good at that. true. I forgot your "skills" at humor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeD Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 I have to admit I've often thought about this same scenario. How could you not? Any performer worth his or her salt has to think at some point, "I'm friggen good at this thing called 'drum corps' and I could march/play/spin/throw/drum circles around those kids/older folk." Timing is one problem. DCI corps rehearse to peak about 3 weeks earlier than DCA corps. DCA corps make huge jumps in performance level in the time from the end of DCI champs to DCA champs weekend. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Doherty Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 (edited) I agree we're talking about apples vs. oranges, but I witnessed many Dream competitions in the sixties (and earlier) where both juniors and seniors were in competition in their respective categories. In 1963 Blessed Sacrament was at the top of their game as were the Caballeros. Both were weekend Corps, so there's an apples to apples comparison. The Seniors were considered superior because of bigger lung power and horn skills and larger numbers. The Cabs were doing double tonguing, lots of trills, high note playing from the mellos and sops, and twice the power overall from the same number of contras as Sac. However Sac was considered to be be a much better executing corps in all areas. The Cabs could blow the roof off of Roosevelt Stadium, which no junior could do. However, the Cabs would typically have over 40 horns whereas Sac marched 32 until later on in the 60s and the Cabs marched as many as 54 horns at one time in the 60s, so now it could be argued that it was becoming an apple vs. oranges situation. However one area where Sac was clearly superior was the drum line and in my opinion, the juniors have been superior from the sixties forward. Just pointing out that one can find a close apples to apples situation, although it was a long time ago. If anyone is interested, check out DCW to see if the 63 Dream is available on CD. I will also check. Kevin Edited May 31, 2012 by Kevin Doherty Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 I agree we're talking about apples vs. oranges, but I witnessed many Dream competitions in the sixties (and earlier) where both juniors and seniors were in competition in their respective categories. In 1963 Blessed Sacrament was at the top of their game as were the Caballeros. Both were weekend Corps, so there's an apples to apples comparison. The Seniors were considered superior because of bigger lung power and horn skills and larger numbers. The Cabs were doing double tonguing, lots of trills, high note playing from the mellos and sops, and twice the power overall from the same number of contras as Sac. However Sac was considered to be be a much better executing corps in all areas. The Cabs could blow the roof off of Roosevelt Stadium, which no junior could do. However, the Cabs would typically have over 40 horns whereas Sac marched 32 until later on in the 60s and the Cabs marched as many as 54 horns at one time in the 60s, so now it could be argued that it was becoming an apple vs. oranges situation. However one area where Sac was clearly superior was the drum line and in my opinion, the juniors have been superior from the sixties forward. Just pointing out that one can find a close apples to apples situation, although it was a long time ago. If anyone is interested, check out DCW to see if the 63 Dream is available on CD. I will also check. Kevin Although you are right , It hasnt been like that for dozens of years. When Jr corps got savy, more creative, advanced year after year, pushed the envelope, it changed alot, decades ago. remember also most of members of Sr. corps had some kind of experience going into their corps. corps, maybe marched Jr. first Jr. kids back then were raw , right off the street. Not any more, kids come in very savy now, like in everything.....very different. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KeithHall Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 Today's DCA corps are younger (IMO) and, although, there are some older cats in the corps...why not allow a DCA corps to compete in DCI or even at the championship. Can't hurt! Beatrix has been coming here a few times and they have members over the age limit. Can't hurt anything. I say if a DCA corps wants to compete in DCI then DCI should allow it. The other way around too...If a DCI corps wants to compete at DCA, why not? Here's another idea....merge DCA and DCI and just have one drum corps umbrella. Both organizations are smaller than they were...well maybe not DCA. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skeptic Posted May 31, 2012 Author Share Posted May 31, 2012 I have to admit I've often thought about this same scenario. How could you not? Any performer worth his or her salt has to think at some point, "I'm friggen good at this thing called 'drum corps' and I could march/play/spin/throw/drum circles around those kids/older folk." I think, too, if you've participated in DCA and then went to watch a DCI show, or if you've participated in both activities at some point in your life, it's hard not to try to compare the two, as dissimilar as they are, though they are more similar than not in this fan's opinion. Now, as to the question of where might a top DCA corps place at DCI quarterfinals, I don't know. I have no clue. However, I say we try it some time, and then we'll all know. Why not ask a top DCA corps to BRING IT? Invite Minnesota Brass, Inc., last year's DCA champ, to perform and be scored next to the DCI corps at prelims or something. What could it hurt? Wouldn't that be a huge rush to any member of that drum corps? If it were me holding a horn in that corps — and I soooo wish it were had that challenge come along — I would be jazzed beyond belief and telling, begging, pleading with the instructional staff to teach the snot out of me and rehearse the bajeepers out of me to the point where I was so good that we just might have a shot. And isn't this push for excellence, inspired by competition, the very hallmark of this great activity? (cue National Anthem) So what if they get stomped or elevated or placed 26th or 10th or fifth or whatever. I mean, their placement at DCI would have no bearing on their DCA status, would it? It's the drive to be awesome, not the final competitive placement result, that drives us, no? Annika Sorenstam and other ladies tried the PGA, didn't they? (and no, I'm not calling anyone a bunch of "girls") But they had to think, "man, I had better elevate my game. To that I say, "heck yeah!" I equate it to the movie (the original, not the remake), the Bad News Bears. The crowd chanted "Let them play," and the kids got to finish their ballgame on the field of the venerable Astrodome. In this case, what would be the harm in letting the senior circuit not only on the same field as "the Astros," but how about letting them have a game? After all, no matter what circuit, it's a game (yeah, yeah, different rules and restrictions and rehearsal schedule and all of that, whatever, I get it.). But, pure and simple it's a game. And you gotta love this game. This. This is basically why I made the thread. Just a fun thing to talk about but some here have major issues with it I guess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 Today's DCA corps are younger (IMO) and, although, there are some older cats in the corps...why not allow a DCA corps to compete in DCI or even at the championship. Can't hurt! Beatrix has been coming here a few times and they have members over the age limit. Can't hurt anything. I say if a DCA corps wants to compete in DCI then DCI should allow it. The other way around too...If a DCI corps wants to compete at DCA, why not? Here's another idea....merge DCA and DCI and just have one drum corps umbrella. Both organizations are smaller than they were...well maybe not DCA. now theres a nightmare of subjectivity...lol.....even cadets 2 couldnt compete in DCI with the age limit being 25..........Im also not sure many DCA corps members would want to compete in a DCI senerio. I think show design factors would seperate the 2 alot also. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeD Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 Today's DCA corps are younger (IMO) and, although, there are some older cats in the corps...why not allow a DCA corps to compete in DCI or even at the championship. Can't hurt! Beatrix has been coming here a few times and they have members over the age limit. Can't hurt anything. I say if a DCA corps wants to compete in DCI then DCI should allow it. The other way around too...If a DCI corps wants to compete at DCA, why not? So you want DCI to do away with their age limitations? I think this might have an impact on the legal side of the organization and the member corps, though I am no attorney. And you want DCA to permit, say, the Cadets or Blue Devils to show up at DCA champs and basically walk away with a title? This of course assumes that those corps are able to hang together for another three weeks after DCI champs. Given the age makeup of those corps (i.e. HS and college semesters starting), that might not be as viable an option as it would appear. Plus, what would those touring corps do for three weeks to fund the added costs of keeping the road show operational until Labor Day? DCA only has a couple of weekend shows in that timeframe, hardly enough income for the DCI corps. Here's another idea....merge DCA and DCI and just have one drum corps umbrella. Both organizations are smaller than they were...well maybe not DCA. I don't see the DCA organization (and member corps) wanting to give up their control and freedom to be merged into DCI at this point. What would happen to scoring in a situation where a DCI top corps or two showed up and competed at DCA? At 2011 DCI champs, the Cadets and BD scored 98.35/97.80 respectively. At 2011 DCA champs MBI and the Bucs scored 98.35/97.45 respectively. Do you really think that on the same scoring scale the DCA scores would hold to those levels? Like a lot of things, the devil is in the details! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KeithHall Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 THEN it would END the point of this thread!!! Did I need to put the sarcasm button on? LOL. Do it once and you'll have your answer and then move on. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonasquad Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 It is already the task of judges to compare "apples" to "oranges" so I don't see a problem with DCI and DCA groups competing against one another. Of course, the DCA groups would get beaten by most or all of groups that rehearse daily. But there are DCI corps in Open Class that have limited tours, and limited rehearsal time. I think Skeptic was very much in the ballpark when he placed the top of DCA around 25th place. It would be very cool to see a DCA corps show up to the DCI quarters now that there is the new all-skate format, and see how they stacked up. There would be several challenges (show designed with DCA's rubric in mind, judges' first read, etc.) and the risk would probably outwieigh the reward, but it could be a hype for that group if they did well! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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