barigirl78 Posted August 6, 2012 Share Posted August 6, 2012 Like it or not.....the Rose Bowl blew attendance through the roof.... not because of proximity to drum corps fans or having a consistent venue...but because California loves drum corps and a lot of fans were starved to see finals up close. Having been to Indy for several years now....someone needs to explain to me the benefits...I just don't see it. Speaking for myself, I'm much more willing to go to a finals that is in a town with more to offer outside of drum corps than to one in a place not known as a tourist destination. This is going back a long ways, but I loved when it was in Montreal in the early 80's and Miami a few years later. I made a vacation out of it. I'm about to go to Indy for the first time, but the main reason wasn't the destination, but the people I'm going with. Even so, I've only secured tickets to semis because they are a better value than finals. You get to see more corps for less money. There's rarely any change in the top 12 rankings between semis and finals anyway and the performance level should be pretty close to what it is in finals. On the original topic of why there isn't streaming, many people disagree with their conclusions, but I believe DCI believes that limiting access to finals increases Finals ticket sales. They might be right and they might be wrong, but I think the only thing that might change their minds would be a sell-out well in advance of the event. I just checked and there are tickets still available for finals. If they sold out all of the seats well in advance, they would know they have their ticket sales maxed out and might consider the additional revenue live streaming would give them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted August 6, 2012 Share Posted August 6, 2012 Speaking for myself, I'm much more willing to go to a finals that is in a town with more to offer outside of drum corps than to one in a place not known as a tourist destination. This is going back a long ways, but I loved when it was in Montreal in the early 80's and Miami a few years later. I made a vacation out of it. I'm about to go to Indy for the first time, but the main reason wasn't the destination, but the people I'm going with. Even so, I've only secured tickets to semis because they are a better value than finals. You get to see more corps for less money. There's rarely any change in the top 12 rankings between semis and finals anyway and the performance level should be pretty close to what it is in finals. On the original topic of why there isn't streaming, many people disagree with their conclusions, but I believe DCI believes that limiting access to finals increases Finals ticket sales. They might be right and they might be wrong, but I think the only thing that might change their minds would be a sell-out well in advance of the event. I just checked and there are tickets still available for finals. If they sold out all of the seats well in advance, they would know they have their ticket sales maxed out and might consider the additional revenue live streaming would give them. you rarely got sell outs before the fan network. and given that the stadium isn't as popular as they want, you'll probably never have sell outs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plan9 Posted August 6, 2012 Share Posted August 6, 2012 (edited) the benefit is $$$. DCI gets cut a break on prices if attendance goes down.DCI HQ is right there. They claim they get a deal on hotels, but ###### if I know where the price break is. So let me understand this...part of the reason for selecting the Indy venue is based on the probablity of failure??? I can just see it....."Yes, I selected Orlando for my new theme park location, partly because the mayor promised he'd give us a tax break if no one comes!" W. Disney The worst part is...I'm sure your right! Edited August 6, 2012 by Plan9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plan9 Posted August 6, 2012 Share Posted August 6, 2012 Speaking for myself, I'm much more willing to go to a finals that is in a town with more to offer outside of drum corps than to one in a place not known as a tourist destination. This is going back a long ways, but I loved when it was in Montreal in the early 80's and Miami a few years later. I made a vacation out of it. I'm about to go to Indy for the first time, but the main reason wasn't the destination, but the people I'm going with. Even so, I've only secured tickets to semis because they are a better value than finals. You get to see more corps for less money. There's rarely any change in the top 12 rankings between semis and finals anyway and the performance level should be pretty close to what it is in finals. On the original topic of why there isn't streaming, many people disagree with their conclusions, but I believe DCI believes that limiting access to finals increases Finals ticket sales. They might be right and they might be wrong, but I think the only thing that might change their minds would be a sell-out well in advance of the event. I just checked and there are tickets still available for finals. If they sold out all of the seats well in advance, they would know they have their ticket sales maxed out and might consider the additional revenue live streaming would give them. Well now we're getting somewhere! BTW, I completely agree with the "other attraction" being the location. DCI just needs to be savvy enough to market the location for it's other values added. Indy is entirely one dimentional Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CLD Posted August 6, 2012 Share Posted August 6, 2012 Look at all we have to offer here in the Los Angeles area...fun, sun, surf, nightlife, Six Flags, Disney....so much to do for fans of all ages. C'mon back DCI! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garfield Posted August 6, 2012 Share Posted August 6, 2012 (edited) G, I think it's simplistic (or let's just say rationalistically challenging ) to assume that the reason for dwindling attendance in the years prior to 2009 were due to wandering finals. That pre-dates other innovations such as Fan Network live streaming, etc. We are a cyber society now and activities (with gates and attendance) need to embrace a wide range of participation portals (be careful....dont' spit on yourself saying that) including the internet, System Blue type camps, International Exhibiitions, etc)/ Like it or not.....the Rose Bowl blew attendance through the roof.... not because of proximity to drum corps fans or having a consistent venue...but because California loves drum corps and a lot of fans were starved to see finals up close. Having been to Indy for several years now....someone needs to explain to me the benefits...I just don't see it. Hey Plan, I didn't say "that the reason for dwindling attendance..." was due to wandering finals. My point is that for all those years finals wandered, and attendance still declined in those "early" years. In fact, I remember reading that part of the rationale for anchoring finals in Indy was to provide corps - AND FANS - the opportunity to know their DC vacation costs up front. It was thought that it would help increase finals attendance, and I'm not sure there's enough evidence yet to call that reason substantiated. I drive a 40 foot motorhome to finals, and have done so since 1999. We vacationed around DC from 1985 until 2008 and we saw a whole lot of country, and enjoyed many new destinations, because we were part of that roving circus. I'm whole-heartedly and completely in favor of wandering finals again, beginning next year. So says my personal desire. When I put my business hat on, however, the idea falls on it's face based on DCI's rationalization. The potential geographic and relationship scale that is attained by DCI being located in the heart of music and arts support along with many other music organizations cannot be denied and, they would contend, can be easily demonstrated in actual cost savings and increased revenue. Just the reduced stadium cost is a big number. Add in the benefit of supposedly mostly-known recurring expenses to attend finals and the expected benefits to the corps outweigh the fan benefit of wandering finals. I think the real answer is in the results of how DCI leverages off of those relationships. Other than a bunch of music buddies meeting for lunch every month to plot and plan, has there been a demonstrable benefit attained by being anchored in Indy? Have the decisions been based in reality, the actions taken efficiently and completely, and the results measured to prove their contention? I'm suspicious. I've always thought the contention was specious that corps could "plan better" knowing finals were in Indy every year. With the way the corps move around the country it's relatively the same task to plan for finals in Denver as it is for Indy, although I'm no tour-planning expert. Corps that don't make it to Indy wouldn't any more easily or safely make it to Denver to compete; if that extra $23,000 was make or break for the corps it's unlikely they can make the extra miles "safely" *. DCI seems to have emphasized the big regionals to replace the "finals vacation" of wandering finals, but there are only five of those and they're not finals. I do think that there's a building demand pressure for non-Indy finals from the fan base (witness the Rose Bowl), and in another few years there will be enough data to determine if the Indy contract was worth while. I wish they'd make the decision now, but I'd doubt the 4-year data as a sound decision base. The question is whether the demand will match the data when it's finally tablulated. * Assumptions: $350,000 annual corps budget, 15,000 average miles per season, approx. $23 per mile, 1000 miles between Indy and Denver (not verified, too lazy). Edited August 6, 2012 by garfield Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barigirl78 Posted August 6, 2012 Share Posted August 6, 2012 Well now we're getting somewhere! BTW, I completely agree with the "other attraction" being the location. DCI just needs to be savvy enough to market the location for it's other values added. Indy is entirely one dimentional Wasn't the reason they are in Indianapolis in the first place that they got a good deal? The money issue probably outweighs everything else. It IS DCI, afterall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted August 6, 2012 Share Posted August 6, 2012 So let me understand this...part of the reason for selecting the Indy venue is based on the probablity of failure??? I can just see it....."Yes, I selected Orlando for my new theme park location, partly because the mayor promised he'd give us a tax break if no one comes!" W. Disney The worst part is...I'm sure your right! it was put on here beforefrom legit knowledgable sources. theyknew it was a risk, so the contract had perks in case things got worse. and after 09 to 10, it paid off for DCI,. luckily last year went up Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted August 6, 2012 Share Posted August 6, 2012 hey I'll say one thing...Indy has been good for Allentowns attendance. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjeffeory Posted August 6, 2012 Share Posted August 6, 2012 Not buying it. DCI went years without making the best seats exclusive to donors. I should have the opportunity to get tickets in 239-241, 339-341, 439-441 w/o having to troll the message boards or other "scalpers". I shouldn't forced to spend x amount of money to get the opportunity to spend another x amount of money to buy the best seats. The reeks of exclusivity and keeping the regular fan away from the best seats. I am sorry and you can negative tick me into oblivion, but I should be forced into getting seats on the 30's or 35's ifI want to spend 255-275 per person for a "Super 3". If you want more money for those then charge 300, 325, 350...but don't make it an exclusive opportunity fo the affluent. I just won't go if I have to sit outside the 40s, especially at the inflated prices being charged.... That's the bottom line for me.... Streaming is a better option for my needs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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