DCI drum major

[84BDsop]

I did research. The camera doesn't lie. Please, Dude. I've NEVER seen anybody look so completely, utterly pisssssed off in a salute. There was practically blood coming out of his nose! That's hardly an "insult"; it's a frank observation.

It's also about as wrong as you can get. You have an opinion based on a short bit of video...I have FACT based on marching with Gary and talking to him about it.

Someone as classless as you claim he was would not have been as patient with an uber-rookout like me during the prior nine months.

I've performed with classless people in this activity...Gary Zinter was NOT one of them.

[jthomas666]

Slightly off topic, but 1984 was the only finals I was able to attend in person. Absolutely incredible. As it happened, I was sitting next to a couple of high school band teachers, and they were generally as stunned as I was by the level of performance.

[Kamarag]

I can understand the point you're trying to make - but if you look at the conducting styles of the world class corps - you're not going to find more than 6 or 7 corps that employ a style that's any more than 1-and-3, like a human metronome. That means that 6 or 7 drum major teams have the conducting abilities and freedom to become performing members themselves, not just figureheads. However, you won't find a drum major (at least in the top 15 or so) that isn't a good leader. Yes, you can be an alright conductor (1-and-3) but you can't be an alright leader and have your corps achieve greatness. It just seems as if leadership capabilities are prioritized more. But maybe that's just me?

I'm not discounting leadership, but it's just not as important as some folks think it is. Conducting, especially in DCI World Class and DCA Open Class isn't on one person. It's a team effort, usually between the drum major, the center snare (or whoever the staff has designated in the battery) and the members (knowing when to watch, and more importantly, when *not* to watch). They are all metronomes, even if it doesn't appear that way.

Even the few drum majors you feel have freedom in reality do not...trust me when i tell you that every little thing they do, that may appear showy or in some other way displaying freedom (say, a rubato phrase) are coordinated and rehearsed to the point that the freedom you see is an illusion.

There's one instance where this is not the case, and I'll give you an excellent example of when it happened recently: Damage control. When for some reason a corps falls apart, it's on the drum major to fix things on the fly. It's not a natural skill, but a learned and practiced one...one dependent on a confident, knowledgeable conductor. A fantastic example of damage control in action was Jersey Surf in Allentown last year. The corps literally fell apart at the beginning of Good Vibrations, and their drum major identified what was happening, and somehow pieced the corps back together (they were perilously close to having to stop and start over).

Some will say, "Oh, he's a great leader!". Well, I'm sure he was, and it's important that the corps members had the confidence in him to follow him as he fixed things, but it was a learned and practiced skill that benefited him, not some nebulous "leadership ability".

Anyone can turn the lights on in a gym, or tell the corps the evening's schedule during the post-run through meeting. I'll take the guy with tempo, conducting skill, and the ability to shake off getting criticism from staff (90% of the gig, actually) instead.

Edited March 6, 2016 by Kamarag

[jthomas666]

It's also about as wrong as you can get. You have an opinion based on a short bit of video...I have FACT based on marching with Gary and talking to him about it.

Someone as classless as you claim he was would not have been as patient with an uber-rookout like me during the prior nine months.

I've performed with classless people in this activity...Gary Zinter was NOT one of them.

If you want to judge a DM based on a short clip of video, let's consider Will Pitts, conductor of Phantom Regiment in 2008. Clearly he didn't care how his corps did; he looked practically dead, ;)

[xandandl]

If you want to judge a DM based on a short clip of video, let's consider Will Pitts, conductor of Phantom Regiment in 2008. Clearly he didn't care how his corps did; he looked practically dead, ;)

Ha, ha, ha.

To me that it one of the greatest self-sacrifices on the DCI field over the years: aging out and ending your career flat out with the crowd cheering your opponent and you just have to lie there doing absolutely nothing while someone else takes over your talent. He pulled it off (retreat included) as a professional.

I look to hear the life he gives to Regiment's arrangements this summer.

[Dan Detweiler]

I did research. The camera doesn't lie. Please, Dude. I've NEVER seen anybody look so completely, utterly pisssssed off in a salute. There was practically blood coming out of his nose! That's hardly an "insult"; it's a frank observation. He was being human. Perhaps a bit immature, given the TV cameras in his face. (Check out the '85 retreat. How many BD members fell to their knees when announced in 3rd?) Had your screenname been Phantom79, I'd have described one of the DMs whose shoulders and face just fell. His look of utter frustrated resignation was priceless (in the broad sense). "Come ON! Not AGAIN!" we observed (after their 3rd Silver in as many years).

Class? BD's DMs in 2008-- for having to professionally salute the crowd that was vociferously screaming because Phantom upset them---and the fact that they didn't win. And Nelson What'shisface, BD '88, when they were announced in 3rd. Again, the crowd was happy they didn't win.

And '84 Garfield lost that show to BD in Lansdale, PA for one reason: the grass was extremely high. Hopkins has publicly said on video (with nods from M. Sylvester, T. Hannum, B .Morrison, M. Twiggs, M. Klesch) that the minute they saw the field, it was over. Granted, they made their own bed, given the style they created (ditto Whitewater that year). Semis were 97.5 to 96.8.

Lastly, I can't remember the last corps to openly celebrate on the field when they won. This all started with you insulting Mr. Trump (yes, a public figure). He's very arrogant. What do you call the ONLY corps that, since 1982 anyway, jumps and screams on the field when they win? Champs Crown, Cadets, Phantom, SCV, Cavies, Star, Scouts (from 1983-on) stood motionless. I know it's BD's style. More power to 'em. Many would agree that it isn't classy.

That said, I DO love the close-up of the Devils' reaction to their 2014 score. The "OMG!" guy was priceless.

Wow, really? You know we tend to forget that these are 20 and 21 year old kids. They are under immense pressure and retreat at the World Championships is the ultimate pressure cooker. I just watched the video of retreat in '84 and my heart started racing again 30+ years later. Yes, you are correct, it is Blue Devils "style" if you will to celebrate a world championship on the field. It is also Santa Clara's to not. Both have the utmost respect for each other, both would never have it any other way. Both could also care less what others think for the most part. Their actions speak for themselves. So do their championships. If I hadn't marched in Blue Devils I would have gone to Santa Clara. Two completely different approaches but both nothing but class and excellence from top to bottom...in my opinion.

By the way, I marched with Gary Zinter. Gary Zinter was a groomsman in my wedding and I call him a good friend to this day. He is everything that is, was, or will be good about this activity. To look at that 10 seconds of video and make character judgements based solely on that is unfair and completely incorrect. Yes, we were all shocked and disappointed in the heat of the moment. I think anyone would be under the same circumstances. Doesn't, nor should it, define a person or an organization.

Dan