corpsband Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Cainan said: Well... I played on System Blue Professional series last season with Kidsgrove Scouts... We didn't have any abnormal issues with regards to the horns denting and the metal being too thin. There was one tuba out of the whole of the brassline that had serious issue with regards to finish (it pretty much de-lacquered), which by the way was promptly addressed by System Blue, but other than that the horns were perfectly fine. One dodgy horn out of 60 is an anomaly... not an overall condemnation of the brand. sounds like you had a good experience. but was that an anomaly? we'll have to wait and see, i guess. chinese instruments are here whether we like it or not. like System Blue, Schiller is selling jinbao manufactured products on ebay. $1100 for 4/4 marching tuba. Edited March 2, 2017 by corpsband Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cainan Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 Just now, corpsband said: sounds like you had a good experience. but was that an anomaly? we'll have to wait and see, i guess. chinese instruments are here whether we like it or not. like System Blue, Schiller is selling jinbao manufactured products on ebay. $1100 for 4/4 marching tuba. I think the Chinese instruments are a necessity in an activity that is eye wateringly expensive to new entries... If a corps can pay $1100 for a tuba and get a few years out of it then that to me seems like a good return on investments. Lest you forget, it's only the very top tier corps that actually get sponsorships... the rest of the commonfolk have to pay. Like i said, we found no major issues. Bear in mind, that we also did have a prototype line so there are design changes being implemented on the back of our season with these horns, but the bottom line is they play well, they project, they have a nice dark tone (especially the euphs and mellos) and they are competitively priced. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corpsband Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 1 minute ago, Cainan said: I think the Chinese instruments are a necessity in an activity that is eye wateringly expensive to new entries... If a corps can pay $1100 for a tuba and get a few years out of it then that to me seems like a good return on investments. Lest you forget, it's only the very top tier corps that actually get sponsorships... the rest of the commonfolk have to pay. Like i said, we found no major issues. Bear in mind, that we also did have a prototype line so there are design changes being implemented on the back of our season with these horns, but the bottom line is they play well, they project, they have a nice dark tone (especially the euphs and mellos) and they are competitively priced. And as a prototype recipient, you probably received extraordinary attention. I get the low price / acceptable quality. But when you hear about an entire hornline order being returned for defects -- well it makes you take a moment. The problem with Jinbao seems to be it's a roll-of-the-dice for what you receive. Some folks reporting perfectly fine experiences and some reporting..well..not so fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad T. Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 Much like with American made everything else, this mass flooding of the market with cheaply made Chinese garbage will put American workers and factories out of business. As a consumer I would rather pay more and know I'm helping to keep food on the table of a citizen of my own country. I'm not a MAGA type, I'm just a consumer who finds the flood of cheap Chinese garbage in the market to be wholly offensive. If I ran a drum corps, and some day wish to, I will only purchase King or Kanstul. And since I will be buying a brand new line of G bugles, Kanstul will be my horn manufacturer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cainan Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 18 minutes ago, Brad T. said: Much like with American made everything else, this mass flooding of the market with cheaply made Chinese garbage will put American workers and factories out of business. As a consumer I would rather pay more and know I'm helping to keep food on the table of a citizen of my own country. I'm not a MAGA type, I'm just a consumer who finds the flood of cheap Chinese garbage in the market to be wholly offensive. If I ran a drum corps, and some day wish to, I will only purchase King or Kanstul. And since I will be buying a brand new line of G bugles, Kanstul will be my horn manufacturer. You must have some serious financial backing then.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cainan Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 21 minutes ago, Brad T. said: Much like with American made everything else, this mass flooding of the market with cheaply made Chinese garbage will put American workers and factories out of business. As a consumer I would rather pay more and know I'm helping to keep food on the table of a citizen of my own country. I'm not a MAGA type, I'm just a consumer who finds the flood of cheap Chinese garbage in the market to be wholly offensive. If I ran a drum corps, and some day wish to, I will only purchase King or Kanstul. And since I will be buying a brand new line of G bugles, Kanstul will be my horn manufacturer. And don't forget, America is not the only place drum corps exists. There is a very healthy European scene as well as the Philippines and Japan. The world does not end at the American border. And before you freak out.. I am an American. Grew up in California, I just happen to live in the UK now, so perhaps I see the world from a different perspective. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brad T. Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 Deep pockets? I wish. That's why this ideal drum corps will never happen. I am aware the activity exists in other nations. If these other countries wish to build their own instruments, great. But the fact the instruments are built and sold purposely to undercut American markets makes me very angry. Sadly I can't buy American made electronics anymore. I can barely find American made clothes. I could argue that a nation that divests its entire manufacturing infrastructure will never survive a catastrophic global market collapse, but this is DCP. Those contract deals you mention aren't just for the "top corps." Corps up and down the roster are able to sign with one of the Pacific Rim nations and get an influx of garbage from Jinbao, Jupiter, or Yamaha. Jupiter contract pricing is some of the cheapest out there, at less than 30% of MSRP listed online such as through WWBW and other retailers. Their product is also akin to metal kazoos. Contract pricing by and large is roughly 30%-40% of MSRP. That shows the *true* value of the raw materials and starvation wages paid to laborers in these Pacific Rim countries. So an Andalucia Bb trumpet (soprano or whatever they claim it to be), that lists at $1200 new likely costs under $500 for a corps to buy on contract. These corps then turn around and sell said horns for $600-$700, tell everyone what a deal they can have by buying gently used, and pocket the rest. Most of the Pacific Rim horns don't last more than 2-3 seasons before completely calling apart. I own G bugles that are 50 years old in better shape than 2 year old Yamaha tubas. At the end of the day, if your only concern is initial costs and/or a resale fund raiser, and the ethics behind your $500 trumpet don't matter, buy all the garbage you want. I personally care about the quality of my instruments, the conditions of the factories in which they were made, the skill level of the craftsmen, and whether or not they are paid fairly. I am not completely against overseas manufacturing. My concert tuba is from Germany. If I owned a Euphonium, I would choose a European brand any day. For marching brass, I will only buy American however. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwoValves Posted March 7, 2017 Share Posted March 7, 2017 (edited) Spirit of Atlanta is now with Adams - who are using this as an entry into the US market and DCI specifically. And not made in China Edited March 7, 2017 by TwoValves Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frachel Posted March 7, 2017 Share Posted March 7, 2017 8 hours ago, TwoValves said: Spirit of Atlanta is now with Adams - who are using this as an entry into the US market and DCI specifically. And not made in China I loved the Adams trumpets I've played, I didn't know they did marching instruments, that's awesome! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BoaDci Posted March 7, 2017 Author Share Posted March 7, 2017 Horn sponsorships are actually one of the greatest things to happen to the sport imo. Its a win win. Corporations get lots of free advertising, corps get to play on brand new horns and sell them for profit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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