Corps staffers gather: What would you tell them

[E3D]

41 minutes ago, Fred Windish said:

This increased reliance on more, and different forms of, electronics concerns me more than anything else. It brings a constant potential to "BITE YOU IN THE AZZZ." When a human performer stumbles down, he/she gets back up, picks up the equipment and blends back in as seamlessly possible. Flub a note, he/she recovers on their own. One good power surge, outage, or connector coming loose and your performance is effected for a longer time, and the failure itself more noticeable.

Another concern I have is with piping in these fake, deep, and rich chords, particularly at the conclusion of numbers. This will quickly get out of hand. I mean . . . . BIG DEAL, someone turned a dial to 11. 

Because it was 11. 

Yes this is already out of control. Someone please do something or else next year we will have a recording being played with 3 giant zig zag props and 275 color

guard members. 

[Jim Schehr]

More drum corps less band, and no singing 

[garfield]

1 hour ago, xandandl said:

The whole current model of drum corps living, tour, and training has removed from the occasion most, particularly females, teens dealing with issues of obesity, thyroid, and less than streamline physique. We've bought too much into the Cali/Texas teen movies of high school cheerleaders and the anorexic look of dancers and ballerinas/male ballet dancers. Drum corps is supposed to be an activity  SERVING youth formation not stick figures. A reason BodybyDrumCorps website, sadly even highlighted on the DCI official page during the off season, is popular is due to the false idea of what true personhood is. Shame on you DCI webmasters.

I get it.

But talented horse-person-ship doesn't entitle all to be jockeys.

The message to be fit and trim is not a negative one, no matter the desire for political correctness.

 

[Tim K]

1 hour ago, xandandl said:

The whole current model of drum corps living, tour, and training has removed from the occasion most, particularly females, teens dealing with issues of obesity, thyroid, and less than streamline physique. We've bought too much into the Cali/Texas teen movies of high school cheerleaders and the anorexic look of dancers and ballerinas/male ballet dancers. Drum corps is supposed to be an activity  SERVING youth formation not stick figures. A reason BodybyDrumCorps website, sadly even highlighted on the DCI official page during the off season, is popular is due to the false idea of what true personhood is. Shame on you DCI webmasters.

One of things I like about Mandarins is that it appears to be the most racially diverse corps and diversity is growing in other corps as well. Having corps look like  the country's population can remind us being one doesn't mean being identical, which includes body type. Regarding BodybyDrumCorps, some have pointed out unless a doctor or qualified professional is supervising, losing so much weight can be dangerous.

[xandandl]

2 minutes ago, garfield said:

I get it.

But talented horse-person-ship doesn't entitle all to be jockeys.

The message to be fit and trim is not a negative one, no matter the desire for political correctness.

 

No, but I do advocate for those people whose biologies will never look like "tour weight." I myself was born into this world almost at 12 pounds and it has always been a struggle. It's not a matter of political correctness at my end, but rather railing against the almost German army of the 1940's attitude of human perfection . Particularly when the artistic directors and designers of these same guards and corps haven't seen "tour weight" for themselves in centuries if ever. If anything, they should understand that they are shaping self image and whole adult outlooks rather than auditioning-out and cutting those for whom the weight thing is not a choice but a cross.

[garfield]

35 minutes ago, xandandl said:

No, but I do advocate for those people whose biologies will never look like "tour weight." I myself was born into this world almost at 12 pounds and it has always been a struggle. It's not a matter of political correctness at my end, but rather railing against the almost German army of the 1940's attitude of human perfection . Particularly when the artistic directors and designers of these same guards and corps haven't seen "tour weight" for themselves in centuries if ever. If anything, they should understand that they are shaping self image and whole adult outlooks rather than auditioning-out and cutting those for whom the weight thing is not a choice but a cross.

In the end, it should always be about ability, not looks, but with so much emphasis put on visual and symmetry of look, and add to it the perception that a heavier person is a bigger risk to quitting because of lack of ability, and it's not hard to see how the corps look all beefy-buff - and thin.

There are always battles to fight.  Choosing this one in this activity seems mostly like "head-meets-brick wall".

[xandandl]

42 minutes ago, garfield said:

In the end, it should always be about ability, not looks, but with so much emphasis put on visual and symmetry of look, and add to it the perception that a heavier person is a bigger risk to quitting because of lack of ability, and it's not hard to see how the corps look all beefy-buff - and thin.

There are always battles to fight.  Choosing this one in this activity seems mostly like "head-meets-brick wall".

Those are war words. 

Desire is as much a motivator as native born agility in drum corps. In fact, it is the slim and anorexic who may be able to twist their bony exposed bodies like a Pennnyslvania-Ohio pretzel but will more commonly lack the endurance and stamina with no reserve capacity. Size does not equate to ability. Strength is a better measure from throwing a seven to rushing the stands at 260 bpm. Few anorexic kids carry bass 5, march a contra or euph, or move the props. 

[Cleveland1]

11 minutes ago, xandandl said:

Desire is as much a motivator as native born agility in drum corps. In fact, it is the slim and anorexic who may be able to twist their bony exposed bodies like a Pennnyslvania-Ohio pretzel but will more commonly lack the endurance and stamina with no reserve capacity. Size does not equate to ability. Strength is a better measure from throwing a seven to rushing the stands at 260 bpm. Few anorexic kids carry bass 5, march a contra or euph, or move the props. 

What is with the anorexia talk? is there a problem of anorexia and DCI that I missed? I understand that the higher levels of DCI typically have people who are slimmer, but i don't think its a problem for the activity top to bottom. 

The MMs are athletes and the demands are largely on things like agility and endurance rather than strength (with notable exceptions for specific instruments). They are more like soccer players than rugby players. 

Throughout a season a MM will probably lose weight because they are taking in x amount of calories and burning off y amount every day. The corps do what they can to make sure that the MMs stay well nourished and all that, but losing weight is only a problem if they are losing dangerous amounts of it. 

I still don't get the anorexia talk. if MMs were anorexic they probably wouldn't last a full season. Not to mention the staff should notice that x member hasn't been eating and it has been impacting their performance overall. 

[Kamarag]

40 minutes ago, xandandl said:

Those are war words. 

Desire is as much a motivator as native born agility in drum corps. In fact, it is the slim and anorexic who may be able to twist their bony exposed bodies like a Pennnyslvania-Ohio pretzel but will more commonly lack the endurance and stamina with no reserve capacity. Size does not equate to ability. Strength is a better measure from throwing a seven to rushing the stands at 260 bpm. Few anorexic kids carry bass 5, march a contra or euph, or move the props. 

 

They aren't war words, they are words of reality.

Performing a world-class show requires endurance and stamina (yes, with reserve capacity). It also requires strength. While your're partly right about size not equating to ability, there absolutely is a point where folks on the larger side simply cannot compete with those that are fit. Body types do indeed vary, but your assertion (on multiple counts even in the post I'm quoting) that "tour body" equals anorexic is not only absurd, it's patently wrong.

Bigger folks *can* do drum corps. There are a number of them in my own DCA corps, as a matter of fact. But could those folks perform the Blue Devils or Vanguard shows at a level approaching the members of those corps? Probably not. If they can, great. They'll get the spot...maybe. 

Health and health risk assessment is a very real thing, and the top corps not only understand that, but employ doctors, nurses, EMTs, fitness trainers and other health professionals. Their input is taken *very* seriously. That risk extends to the people performing around the member in question as well.

The other thing to consider is that at in world class, body type does matter from an appearance standpoint, and there is nothing wrong with that. Uniformity of style, technique, and performance can dictate who gets a spot, and it #### well should. There is also nothing wrong with that either. That's how casting for roles in a production works.

 

Edited July 24, 2017 by Kamarag

[xandandl]

 

3 hours ago, Kamarag said:

 

They aren't war words, they are words of reality.

Performing a world-class show requires endurance and stamina (yes, with reserve capacity). It also requires strength. While your're partly right about size not equating to ability, there absolutely is a point where folks on the larger side simply cannot compete with those that are fit. Body types do indeed vary, but your assertion (on multiple counts even in the post I'm quoting) that "tour body" equals anorexic is not only absurd, it's patently wrong.

Bigger folks *can* do drum corps. There are a number of them in my own DCA corps, as a matter of fact. But could those folks perform the Blue Devils or Vanguard shows at a level approaching the members of those corps? Probably not. If they can, great. They'll get the spot...maybe. 

Health and health risk assessment is a very real thing, and the top corps not only understand that, but employ doctors, nurses, EMTs, fitness trainers and other health professionals. Their input is taken *very* seriously. That risk extends to the people performing around the member in question as well.

The other thing to consider is that at in world class, body type does matter from an appearance standpoint, and there is nothing wrong with that. Uniformity of style, technique, and performance can dictate who gets a spot, and it #### well should. There is also nothing wrong with that either. That's how casting for roles in a production works.

 

Paragraph 2. Body size and fitness are not the same thing. Then you start putting words in my mouth. No where in any post did i use the term tour body. I did use the term tour weight. Weight is not a number alone but what is appropriate to that specific body, particularly when discussing long time good health..

Paragraph 3.Mostly we are in agreement here. There is a vast difference between the needs of a senior drum corps, an all-age drum corps, a weekend only drum corps, and a drum corps doing four months of daily practices and performances. There is a different standard for those doing park-and-bark shows and those doing slides, tilts, trampolines, and chutes & ladders. Being a member of one doesn't preclude the other automatically. 

Paragraph 4. Yes, you are correct. I have been "employed" by DCI finalist, champion, and other corps to help assess those  dangers both physical health and mental health. I am very aware and conversant with the reports, dialogues, conversations and concerns of the DCI Medical committee and its subcommittee, some of these public and some internal, presently and during DCI's history. Because someone takes a different point from yours, do not presume the other person is ignorant, unaware, or lacks experience. In my 45 years of involvement with DCI as admin, faculty, and volunteer, I have seen the progress made; but some problems still exist and some still need to be addressed. Your own corps of origin has made vast improvements in the way health, diet, and medical concerns are addressed.

Paragraph 5. On this point we will disagree because we will disagree about show design and what the activity is and is to be.  fundamentally. Your presentation is consistent with one philosophy. There are others and many. You emphasize show production. I emphasize the experience of the membership and those who arrive at the auditions.

Enjoy the rest of the season.

Edited July 24, 2017 by xandandl