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denverjohn

Acoustic Division?

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denverjohn    174

Let me preface this post by saying that I expect the naysayers to shoot this down by pointing out all the logistical and financial flaws that this might involve.

What I would like is a discussion of how this "choice" within the activity would provide some positive alternatives for those who advocate for something different.

I would envision a separate "division". Perhaps starting with something akin to Soundsport.

This division could self-restrict itself as it wished. Perhaps starting with rules prohibiting electronics and props.

The advantages would be that organizations could affiliate in said division without feeling the economic impact of having to keep up with the current "arms race" of spending for those 2 components. Rules could even allow the use of bagpipes if an organization should so choose.

I think this would be a viable alternative for organizations such as Pioneer that struggle to provide a more locally-based, lower-cost alternative for youth and their parents, staff and volunteers who struggle to compete.

Yes, there would be challenges with pit balance and I am not advocating that we eliminate the pit. Writing and dynamic levels would have to adjust. Perhaps more pianissimo segments in the brass line. Would that be any worse than more synthetic goo in the pit?

Feel free to think outside the box on how this could function in regard to partial touring, circuits, separate championships, etc.

Anyone else care to run with this or another variation?

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Stu    1,020
18 minutes ago, denverjohn said:

Let me preface this post by saying that I expect the naysayers to shoot this down by pointing out all the logistical and financial flaws that this might involve.

What I would like is a discussion of how this "choice" within the activity would provide some positive alternatives for those who advocate for something different.

I would envision a separate "division". Perhaps starting with something akin to Soundsport.

This division could self-restrict itself as it wished. Perhaps starting with rules prohibiting electronics and props.

The advantages would be that organizations could affiliate in said division without feeling the economic impact of having to keep up with the current "arms race" of spending for those 2 components. Rules could even allow the use of bagpipes if an organization should so choose.

I think this would be a viable alternative for organizations such as Pioneer that struggle to provide a more locally-based, lower-cost alternative for youth and their parents, staff and volunteers who struggle to compete.

Yes, there would be challenges with pit balance and I am not advocating that we eliminate the pit. Writing and dynamic levels would have to adjust. Perhaps more pianissimo segments in the brass line. Would that be any worse than more synthetic goo in the pit?

Feel free to think outside the box on how this could function in regard to partial touring, circuits, separate championships, etc.

Anyone else care to run with this or another variation?

Pioneer is in WC by choice, nobody 'forces' them to be there. And SoundSport is exactly what you are advocating for the local based local youth low budget organizations. So I say you need to vocally and financially help support SoundSport!

Edited by Stu

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denverjohn    174
1 minute ago, Stu said:

Pioneer is in WC by choice, nobody forces them to be there, and SounSport is there for the local based local youth low budget your refer to. So I say you need to vocally  and financially help support SounSport!

Noted. My first sentence is validated. I am not speaking for Pioneer but am only suggesting that it would be interesting if units had more choice.

If your school district had no charter schools you would "choose" to send your child to the one chosen for you.

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Stu    1,020
20 minutes ago, denverjohn said:

Noted. My first sentence is validated. I am not speaking for Pioneer but am only suggesting that it would be interesting if units had more choice.

If your school district had no charter schools you would "choose" to send your child to the one chosen for you.

Denver, I am actually on your side, I am 'not' a naysayer. There is already a great and wonderful class in DCI that provides for 'everything' you are asking for, and that is SoundSport. Unless, of course, you are seeking a class that just limits electronics while still providing a national tour performing at stadiums for lots of fans which would be extremely counterproductive to the cost savings you seek for the local based local youth low cost corps.

Edited by Stu

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denverjohn    174
Just now, Stu said:

Denver, I am actually on your side, I am 'not' a naysayer. There is already a great and wonderful class in DCI that provides for 'everything' you are asking for, and that is SoundSport. Unless, of course, you are seeking a class that just limits electronics while still providing a national tour which would be extremely counterproductive to the cost savings you seek for the local based local youth low cost corps.

I guess my reference to SoundSport was not a good example. I would like this type of division to still use an entire field with the same timing parameters but merely restrict electronics and props. SoundSport does not do this.

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Stu    1,020

But the 'cost savings' for just eliminating electronics for a full entire field, full touring schedule, full sized corps would be miniscule. Electronics for any full field touring corps is a very small fraction of their overall expenditures. Your concern, as per your initial post, is for local corps with local youth with low cost, and that 'is' SoundSport's bread and butter. My guess is that you would rather have 1999 WC instead of 2017 WC. Which is fine, but the comparitive  'touring costs' between the two, factoring in inflation, is pretty much the same with or without the electronics.  Be an advocate for SS!!!! It serves those local corps local youth low cost situations!

Edited by Stu

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Mello Dude    391

Perhaps, another circuit that simply does away with electronics.  Thing is, with enough purse money you could lure existing DCI corps to compete on another circuit save there being rules forbidding it.  This is how DCI came into being...seem a shame to not use the same idea.

 

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Hrothgar15    898
8 minutes ago, Mello Dude said:

Perhaps, another circuit that simply does away with electronics.  Thing is, with enough purse money you could lure existing DCI corps to compete on another circuit save there being rules forbidding it.  This is how DCI came into being...seem a shame to not use the same idea.

 

The sooner this happens the better and can only be good for drum corps as a whole. Call it Drum Corps Live and capitalize on the unique strengths and differences it would have over DCI. Market it around making a case that it's better for those reasons and gauge the interest of potential performers in and fans of it. Why not?

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ftwdrummer    324
59 minutes ago, Hrothgar15 said:

The sooner this happens the better and can only be good for drum corps as a whole. Call it Drum Corps Live and capitalize on the unique strengths and differences it would have over DCI. Market it around making a case that it's better for those reasons and gauge the interest of potential performers in and fans of it. Why not?

...wasn't this some of the logic behind the G7 secession?

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I'd rather see DCI change its name to what it actually is; Fine Arts International.

If they'd stop misrepresenting themselves and ditch the "drum corps" from their letterhead, why, we dinosaurs wouldn't have much to complain about anymore.  

That said, I'd definitely be on board with a drum and bugle corps circuit sans George Hopkins and company, with better rules, better priorities, and a better mission.  Aka, drum corps prior to George Hopkins and company sodomizing it.  The only thing preventing that from happening at this very moment is people like Jeff Ream, stu, MikeN, alexL, and oldcadetsop telling fans over and over and over and over again that it's a dumb idea and that it's not possible, like they've been doing on here for years. One can only wonder how many people told the founders of corps like Bluecoats, Carolina Crown and Phantom Regiment that it was a dumb idea and that it wasn't possible.....

It certainly wouldn't be easy.  Hopkins would do everything in his power to prevent it, and he pulls all the strings in BOA, WGI and DCI, so they would be right behind him shining his boots the whole way.  Band directors would be hostile towards it, as they ever have been.  And one couldn't expect to draw top-tier talent away from DCI, at least right away.  So yeah, it would be a challenge of a lifetime, and you would have to have directors with the backbone to stand up to Hopkins and say "You don't tell us what to do, now stand aside or we're going to march right over you".  But it would be no different than the challenges just about every single DCI corps themselves faced when they formed.  I've helped start two drum and bugle corps in my lifetime, so I know this to be true.  

Right now, that top tier talent only has one option.  And there are thousands upon thousands of additional stellar musicians out there right now who simply can't afford to participate in DCI anymore, along with hundreds of music educators out there who could definitely use the work.   Wouldn't it be nice if THEY had a summer marching activity that focused on keeping costs low and emphasized music education over decimal points on a score sheet?  And wouldn't it be nice if current DCI members who are feeling very apprehensive and self-conscience about the sweeping changes to the activity had another, less expensive option with the potential for the same learning opportunities without having to take ballet lessons?  Despite what you may have been led to believe, money isn't everything in drum corps.  Even so, the money is out there.  It just isn't being spent wisely in DCI today.

Start small, and claw your way up.  Give kids a choice; proud tradition and integrity, or leotards and amplifiers.  Sure, a lot of them would still choose the latter, but I promise you......I PROMISE YOU....there are plenty of kids out there who are hungry, nay, STARVING,  for the former.

Edited by Bobby L. Collins

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