BRASSO Posted November 2, 2017 Share Posted November 2, 2017 (edited) 23 minutes ago, Cappybara said: Huh? So it’s somehow our fault that college tuition is significantly higher than it was 10-15 years ago? No. I never said that, nor even believe that. Colleges & Universities are free to charge whatever they believe the market will bear for their services. Consumers ( parents/ students ) are free to say yea, or nay to the sticker prices. Its not a parents/ students fault if they say no, nor the Schools fault for charging whatever they believe they can command in pricing. Its between the buyer and the seller. They mutually decide. But if a Parent/ Student signs on the dotted line, its their agreement to the terms and the pricing for that loan or with that University. It doesn't sound all that complicated to me regarding responsibilities in the transaction. Nobody put a gun to anybody's head in any of this to agree to pay " too much " or whatever. Sometimes the best deal is to walk away and choose another option that could provide better value for the financial investment that is being asked for. Edited November 2, 2017 by BRASSO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cappybara Posted November 2, 2017 Share Posted November 2, 2017 2 hours ago, BRASSO said: No. I never said that, nor even believe that. Colleges & Universities are free to charge whatever they believe the market will bear for their services. Consumers ( parents/ students ) are free to say yea, or nay to the sticker prices. Its not a Parents/ students fault if they say no, nor the Schools fault for charging whatever they believe they can command in pricing. Its between the buyer and the seller. They mutually decide. But if a Parent/ Student signs on the dotted line, its their agreement to the terms and the pricing for that loan or with that University. It doesn't sound all that complicated to me regarding responsibilities in the transaction. Nobody put a gun to anybody's head in any of this to agree to pay " too much " or whatever. Oh really? How exactly does someone get a job in today’s market without a bachelors degree? It’s quite easy for people already established or retired to say “nobody’s forcing a gun to your head” But more importantly, what changed so dramatically in the last 10-15 years to justify such a big increase in tuition? You do realize rates are going up 3-5 percent every year right? Why is that? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Dixon Posted November 2, 2017 Share Posted November 2, 2017 3 hours ago, Cappybara said: Oh really? How exactly does someone get a job in today’s market without a bachelors degree? It’s quite easy for people already established or retired to say “nobody’s forcing a gun to your head” But more importantly, what changed so dramatically in the last 10-15 years to justify such a big increase in tuition? You do realize rates are going up 3-5 percent every year right? Why is that? Exactly. It's a disgrace. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Dixon Posted November 2, 2017 Share Posted November 2, 2017 11 hours ago, kdaddy said: This is not correct. Don't apply causation to some sort of spurious correlation. Increases in financial aid have gone hand-in-hand with decreases in state funding for public schools. I can't speak for private schools (e.g., I've never heard of Hopkins University/College, though I'd be suspicious of how it handles money given the name... here's guessing it spends a lot of money on gaudy tarps). Also, cost of doing business (e.g., healthcare for employees) has increased exponentially over that time. This is a pretty absurd statement. You've never heard of Johns Hopkins? https://www.nytimes.com/2015/04/05/opinion/sunday/the-real-reason-college-tuition-costs-so-much.html there are a variety of factors including bloated administrations, investment in facilities and sports programs, sure healthcare for employees etc... driving spending per student up faster than inflation this started in the 90s - what else started in the 90s? Quote 1992: The Higher Education Amendments of 1992 create FAFSA, the Direct Lending program, and unsubsidized Stafford loans. 1993: The Student Loan Reform Act officially implements the Direct Lending program. Under this program, the government directly lends to borrowers, as opposed to through a private institution. another Clinton era program/change that had significant impact aka "unintended consequences" down the road - much like the changes made to home lending programs/underwriting which led to the great recession - which in that case they blamed on "evil bankers" anyway - we are off topic so that's my final reply on the matter - PM me if you'd like to take the chat offline 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kdaddy Posted November 2, 2017 Share Posted November 2, 2017 1 hour ago, George Dixon said: this started in the 90s - what else started in the 90s? Abandonment of higher education (a public good) by state legislators. But if some of the opinions I've seen on here (e.g., useless undergraduate degrees) are any indication, perhaps I shouldn't be surprised that state legislators don't see education not as an individual privilege but a public good. And I'll suggest again to not equate causation with spurious correlation. 1 hour ago, George Dixon said: anyway - we are off topic so that's my final reply on the matter - PM me if you'd like to take the chat offline Indeed, and my apologies for perpetuating this conversation. We should instead be talking about getting braces or something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Dixon Posted November 2, 2017 Share Posted November 2, 2017 45 minutes ago, kdaddy said: Abandonment of higher education (a public good) by state legislators. But if some of the opinions I've seen on here (e.g., useless undergraduate degrees) are any indication, perhaps I shouldn't be surprised that state legislators don't see education not as an individual privilege but a public good. And I'll suggest again to not equate causation with spurious correlation. Wow. I’m just too dim-witted, clearly. The snarky “causation vs correlation” reply over and over, as if that’s not a very basic intellectual concept that most learned back in middle school. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fran Haring Posted November 2, 2017 Share Posted November 2, 2017 (edited) 10 hours ago, xandandl said: lacrosse school called Blue Jays or something like that. Excellent medical school. Blue Jays, correct. They've been called the New York Yankees of the college lacrosse world. Even though they haven't been a dominant force in recent years.... a lot of programs have caught up to them. To call the Hopkins med school an "excellent medical school" would be an understatement. Hands down one of the best in the world, if not THE best. Same for the Hopkins hospital/medical system. I've lived in the Baltimore area for nearly 30 years... and I can tell you for a fact that the Johns Hopkins organization... its medical system and sub-systems, its university system... drives the bus in this region. Heck... to some degree they not only drive the bus, they own the bus company. LOL Edited November 2, 2017 by Fran Haring Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRASSO Posted November 2, 2017 Share Posted November 2, 2017 (edited) 8 hours ago, Cappybara said: Oh really? How exactly does someone get a job in today’s market without a bachelors degree? Life's hard. But lots of people were able to rise up the ranks without any college degree at all. Some became skilled tradesmen.. others worked hard, learned through a mentor, and started their own business or franchises.. Working and toiling for somebody else, and helping THEM make money never made a whole lot of sense to me to from the getgo. People that are looking for " a job " really are on their own.. But sure, in todays world, it makes sense to get a good education, or develop a marketable skill that people want / need. People that feel the need to go to a Fancy Pants Univ. however know the deal and the costs. Its their choice. Freedom is a great thing. You get to freely choose your path, and get to reap the benefits and or the schizz in the future as the case may be for those school/ career decisions made. Edited November 2, 2017 by BRASSO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mingusmonk Posted November 2, 2017 Share Posted November 2, 2017 I hope this post doesn't bother the decidedly intellectual goings-on in the thread. Apologies in advance. News Meet the (crossmen) 2018 Percussion Staff! http://www.crossmen.org/news#Section33238830 Quote Josh BrickeyPercussion Caption Head percussion@crossmen.orgLane SummerlinAssistant Caption Head Drew AndersonPercussion Instruction - Snare Lucas VangeisonPercussion Instruction - SnareRyan Ellis Percussion Instruction - SnareBen RuslerPercussion Instruction - BassJohn GengaPercussion Instruction - BassJared KortzPercussion Instruction - BassAndre WilsonPercussion Instruction - TenorsMando GaucinPercussion Instruction - TenorsBryan KendrickPercussion Instruction - CymbalsZack BlessingPercussion Instruction - CymbalsLee AllmanPercussion Instruction - Front EnsembleWill BuetowPercussion Instruction - Front EnsembleEric PujariPercussion Instruction - Front EnsembleDan SchmittAudio Engineer 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRASSO Posted November 2, 2017 Share Posted November 2, 2017 (edited) Merging the topic a bit with " education", its becoming increasingly clear that securing a degree in Engineering may become as valuable ( or more valuable ) than a degree in the Music field. Guards really don't need a Music Degree, and the Guard section, as most of us have seen, are becoming THE most important section of a Corps on the new DCI scoring sheets in generating points for a Corps. Moving forward, Corps will be increasingly utilizing Sound Engineers as a vital,... very vital.... component of their shows. More so than even now, imo. One does not need a degree in Music, Dance,( or Art History or whatever) to become a great Sound Engineer, but it helps if you have a Degree in Engineering, or a skill learned in the Electronics field realm. As Drum Corps and their shows evolve, so won't the predominant skills and talents needed by Corps and their Show Designers. At the moment, its hard not to envision how critically important to Corps shows, scores, placements of the Sound Engineers that they are hiring now, and will be hiring in the future. If a single Sound Engineer can create a brass sound that " sounds " like 12 brass playing, for example, there really is not much need for so many of those brass players, like before now is there ? Things change. Things evolve, and if one can anticipate what the future will look like... whether its Drum Corps, or the world around us, its to the visionaries that stand to gain. Same as it ever was, I suppose, in that respect. Edited November 2, 2017 by BRASSO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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