waliman4444

are brass soloists allowed to improvise

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after listening to really good soloists over the years it dawned on me that from show to show the solos were pretty much the same...meaning, played the same way every time*give or take a note)..hence..how much if any improvisation is being done by the soloists in drum corps

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No, but itd be cool if they did.

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30 minutes ago, waliman4444 said:

after listening to really good soloists over the years it dawned on me that from show to show the solos were pretty much the same...meaning, played the same way every time*give or take a note)..hence..how much if any improvisation is being done by the soloists in drum corps

Not enough, IMO!! but I think you would guess that to be my stance given my profile.....

DCI Corps program history is packed FULL of charts from the great Big Band genre.

Let's bring that back......somehow..........I beg.

Edited by JAZZER
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 Brass solo improvisations by youth in DCI field competition are discouraged  by adult instructors for a whole host of bonafide reasons. For one, such attempts at self improvisations by youthful soloists can cause meter beat, timing irregularities that could wreck havoc with other sections of the Corps timings. The inherent risks to self improvisation playing FAR outweigh any perceived benefits for the allowance for a youthful attempt to alter the required playing as prescribed and written by the adult brass arrangers of the musical piece. The DCI I&E  individual solo competitions are the appropriate setting for a youthful soloist to take on the responsibility to free lance and improvise their personal solos at their individual choosing, imo. DCI I & E have INDIVIDUAL solo competitions. DCI Corps competitions, by contrast are TEAM competitions. You don't get to wing it as a brass soloist with your brass solo in team competitions, imo.

Edited by BRASSO

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4 minutes ago, BRASSO said:

 Brass solo improvisations by youth in DCI field competition are discouraged  by adult instructors for a whole host of bonafide reasons. For one, such attempts at self improvisations by youthful solists can cause meter beat, timing irregularities that could wreck havoc with other sections of the Corps timings. The risks FAR outweigh any perceived benefits for the allowance for a youthful attempt to alter the required playing as prescribed and written by the adult brass arrangers of the musical piece. The DCI I&E  individual solo competitions are the appropriate wnvironment setting for a youthful soloist to take on the responsibilty to free lance and improvise their solos at their individual choosing, imo

The only reason I raise the topic is because of the TREMENDOUS talent in DCI (many of whom are adults)Given their familiarity with the charts I thought that some of the best musicians might take tasteful risks at improvising (with the blessing of the brass instructor and within limits...No Don Cherry solos!!! I do however see your point

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7 minutes ago, waliman4444 said:

The only reason I raise the topic is because of the TREMENDOUS talent in DCI (many of whom are adults)Given their familiarity with the charts I thought that some of the best musicians might take tasteful risks at improvising (with the blessing of the brass instructor and within limits...No Don Cherry solos!!! I do however see your point

 Don't get me wrong, I'd like to hear a solo played differently from show to show too, especially for some fans like us that get to hear/ see a Corps in performance on multiple occasions in the summer. However, the risks far outweigh the benefits, so I can understand why its discouraged by just about every Corps, no matter the level of talent of the individual soloist.

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BD's soloists did improvise this year. They were given a framework for the solos and then allowed to improvise within that. I don't think they deviated tremendously from what they had come up with as the season progressed, mainly because the versions they had "set" worked so well.

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6 minutes ago, NakedEye said:

BD's soloists did improvise this year. They were given a framework for the solos and then allowed to improvise within that. I don't think they deviated tremendously from what they had come up with as the season progressed, mainly because the versions they had "set" worked so well.

 True.. I did notice that. But the changes were really so insignificant, it really wasn't much different to my ears. Besides, as we all know by now, the Blue Devils are pretty much an All Star DCI Drum Corps, so conventional wisdom does not always apply to them. They're in a DCI Class all by themselves, lets face it. I wish THAT was different too, ( but its not )

Edited by BRASSO

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1 hour ago, BRASSO said:

 Brass solo improvisations by youth in DCI field competition are discouraged  by adult instructors for a whole host of bonafide reasons. For one, such attempts at self improvisations by youthful soloists can cause meter beat, timing irregularities that could wreck havoc with other sections of the Corps timings. The inherent risks to self improvisation playing FAR outweigh any perceived benefits for the allowance for a youthful attempt to alter the required playing as prescribed and written by the adult brass arrangers of the musical piece. The DCI I&E  individual solo competitions are the appropriate setting for a youthful soloist to take on the responsibility to free lance and improvise their personal solos at their individual choosing, imo. DCI I & E have INDIVIDUAL solo competitions. DCI Corps competitions, by contrast are TEAM competitions. You don't get to wing it as a brass soloist with your brass solo in team competitions, imo.

I think a visit to a competitive/adjudicated jazz festival highlighting the talents of under 21 aged musicians might change your opinion. When was the last time you have seen/heard today's top talent improvising? IMO this is not your father's Oldsmobile..........."youthful attempt". c'mon man

The mere suggestion that a talented improvisor is "winging it" is a flat out insult as well, IMO. 

And, today's talented improvisors have NO problem covering what any DCI brass arranger can create. 

btw, every big band competing is a team competing at these festivals. Heck, I know know of NO jazz group in which it is not a team endeavor, as well. Every festival that I have adjudicated has included improvisors in a team setting. EVERY.

Now, I do not disagree with your suggestion the I & E is also a good opportunity for this talent to excel. 

Who are these adult instructors that discourage this in DCI?

Are not DCI judges qualified in the concepts of jazz improvisation? If not, then is THIS the risk of which you suppose?

Oh yeah, ......my bad......there's no place on the sheet to "box" that...........got'cha.

Let's not "dare" do something that doesn't fit.....................

 

 

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5 minutes ago, JAZZER said:

I think a visit to a competitive/adjudicated jazz festival highlighting the talents of under 21 aged musicians might change your opinion. When was the last time you have seen/heard today's top talent improvising? IMO this is not your father's Oldsmobile..........."youthful attempt". c'mon man

The mere suggestion that a talented improvisor is "winging it" is a flat out insult as well, IMO. 

And, today's talented improvisors have NO problem covering what any DCI brass arranger can create. 

btw, every big band competing is a team competing at these festivals. Heck, I know know of NO jazz group in which it is not a team endeavor, as well. Every festival that I have adjudicated has included improvisors in a team setting. EVERY.

Now, I do not disagree with your suggestion the I & E is also a good opportunity for this talent to excel. 

Who are these adult instructors that discourage this in DCI?

Are not DCI judges qualified in the concepts of jazz improvisation? If not, then is THIS the risk of which you suppose?

Oh yeah, ......my bad......there's no place on the sheet to "box" that...........got'cha.

Let's not "dare" do something that doesn't fit.....................

 

 

IMO, most symphony orchestras suck at jazz; most concert wind ensembles suck at jazz; their approach of 'play the notes on the page as clinically exact and precise as possible' butcher the feel and sound. The same holds true for most of the competitive marching ensembles.

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