JAZZER Posted September 19, 2017 Share Posted September 19, 2017 Just now, Stu said: Most symphonic trained players cannot swing. Some can crossover, like Wynton, but most are way to clinical in their sound and feel. Which is wonderful for symphonic, but square as #### for jazz. uh huh! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRASSO Posted September 19, 2017 Share Posted September 19, 2017 9 minutes ago, JAZZER said: I would not be surprised if there was a soloist in their ranks that could have performed a killer improvised solo during one of those arrangements. Â Â No doubt. But this is not what the OP is asking us here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAZZER Posted September 19, 2017 Share Posted September 19, 2017 7 minutes ago, BRASSO said:  All of em. Every one of the dozens I've met over the years, anyway. Sometimes they'll allow a brass soloist to hit a triple C or some such if they feel comfortable at the moment in a show performance. They're can be some ever so slight variations sometimes heard in the solos from show to show in a Corps performance. But the OP's question is asking us here if there is " improvisational brass playing " in brass solos from show to show. The answer is " No". If we are looking for improvisational brass solo playing in DCI ( with the conventional definition of " improvisational brass playing " ( as uniquely differet from show to show ), we don't find it in DCI  Corps competition. The brass solos tend to be the same from show to show, unless changed at practice beforhand. There is very little individual " winging it " in brass solos that have ever occured in DCI, even with " the Kilties, Bridgemen  et al". Their brass solos were pretty much identical in arrangement playing from show to show, with very little " improvisation " in the playing. Where we DO see brass solo improvisation is in DCI I & E INDIVIDUAL competitions over the years.  But in DCI Corps competitions ? No. I don't detect it.'never have either. Even with BD. BD's brass solos this year from show to show were remarkably the same from show to show... not different thru " improvisational brass playing " in the least. Maybe you heard BD at different shows than I did though... who knows. so every one YOu have met.......sampling of? btw......do you consider hitting a "triple C" ...or LOL  "some such"......[what is some such?] to be improvising?????? Really, I would like to know. "if they feel comfortable"...........HEY!!! That's a decision.........NOT winging it!!!! Why re-define the OP's question? It was a yes or no question. allowed. It IS allowed. period.   Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAZZER Posted September 19, 2017 Share Posted September 19, 2017 1 minute ago, BRASSO said: Â No doubt. But this is not what the OP is asking us here. true. Is it allowed? absolutely Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAZZER Posted September 19, 2017 Share Posted September 19, 2017 2 minutes ago, BRASSO said: Â No doubt. But this is not what the OP is asking us here. Agreed. It is allowed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRASSO Posted September 19, 2017 Share Posted September 19, 2017 (edited) 29 minutes ago, JAZZER said: so every one YOu have met.......sampling of? btw......do you consider hitting a "triple C" ...or LOL  "some such"......[what is some such?] to be improvising?????? Really, I would like to know. "if they feel comfortable"...........HEY!!! That's a decision.........NOT winging it!!!! Why re-define the OP's question? It was a yes or no question. allowed. It IS allowed. period.    Perhaps we are using a different definition of what " improvisation " in brass solo playing is. This might explain things that you are witnessing in Drum Corps field competition, that I never have. Almost never anyway,.  The Merriam- Webster definition ( that I'm utilizing ) for " improvisation " is.... " an unforseen happening, ie executing something without previous preparation ".  The brass solos ... just about all of 'em... over the years from show performance to show performance were mostly known for their similarities in playing arrangements with the solo, than their dissimilarities in playing from performance to performance. They'd be ever so slight nuances noticed from show to show.. of course. But unless there was a pre arranged change beforehand in the arrangement, the brass solos were almost always identical from show to show with all the Corps ( unless the soloist botched how it was arranged to be played). That was true in 1972, and its true here in 2017. BD's brass solos this season from show to show were remarkably similar from show to show, ..., not dissimilar. I never heard  " unforseen happenings " in the brass solos from show to show at all this season in DCI amongst any of the Corps, without pre show preparation/ practice beforehand that this was how it was going to be played in the show performance competition..  By design. By choice. By the Corps. Edited September 19, 2017 by BRASSO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAZZER Posted September 19, 2017 Share Posted September 19, 2017 16 minutes ago, BRASSO said:  Perhaps we are using a different definition of what " improvisation " in brass solo playing is. This might explain things that you are witnessing in Drum Corps field competition, that I never have. Almost never anyway,.  The Merriam- Webster definition ( that I'm utilizing ) for " improvisation " is.... " an unforseen happening, ie executing something without previous preparation ".  The brass solos ... just about all of 'em... over the years from show performance to show performance were mostly known for their similarities in playing arrangements with the solo, than their dissimilarities in playing from performance to performance. They'd be ever so slight nuances noticed from show to show.. of course. But unless there was a pre arranged change beforehand in the arrangement, the brass solos were almost always identical from show to show with all the Corps ( unless the soloist botched how it was arranged to be played). That was true in 1972, and its true here in 2017. BD's brass solos this season from show to show were remarkably similar from show to show, ..., not dissimilar. I never heard  " unforseen happenings " in the brass solos from show to show at all this season in DCI amongst any of the Corps, without pre show preparation/ practice beforehand that this was how it was going to be played in the show performance competition..  By design. By choice. By the Corps. Musical improvisation involves previous preparation. Form, chord structures, rehearsal, etc.  Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRASSO Posted September 19, 2017 Share Posted September 19, 2017 (edited) 14 minutes ago, JAZZER said: Musical improvisation involves previous preparation. Form, chord structures, rehearsal, etc.   Of course. I have never heard a brass soloist however play a brass solo that surprised others with " improvisation " in the arrangement, where the playing arrangement was more dissimilar than similar in the show performance from show to show. If you'd care to provide an example of any Corps soloist that engaged in winging it in a brass solo, I'm like to know of it, and when... and what was so unexpectedly dissimilar in the show performance playing of that brass solo ( in a pleasing way.. not a botched way ). DCI Corps do not have their brass soloists engaging in what is conventionally understood to be " improvisational brass playing solos " in the music delivery in show performance competition. I 've never heard of this before either. But like I said, perhaps you are utilizing an unconventional definition of what " improv. brass playing is " in the music realm, if not, I have no idea where you are hearing things in Drum Corps in brass solos that I've never, or rarely if ever,  have ever heard of before in Corps brass solos playing. Edited September 19, 2017 by BRASSO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRASSO Posted September 19, 2017 Share Posted September 19, 2017 (edited)  Funny true story on one of the very few instances that I ever recall of a " brass solo improvisation ".  I know of an instance where an overeager young brass soloist in a World Class Division Corps, in a big competition, after he finished his terrific brass solo as designed to be played, opted to do a improv., spontaneous, rather lengthy, " moon walk " dance imitation ala Michael Jackson, ( the rage dance at the time ) before he got back into line ( in this case, the podium as he was the DM too ). He did it in hopes of generating some needed GE. Can't fault him for his spontaneous act of cleverness, if not practicality. But Man, did he hear an earful from others when he came off the field... marchers, staffers alike, with one scolding him.. " Theres no efffing dancing in Drum Corps !!!. ( lol) They all liked him, so they quickly forgot it... but to this day, he is often reminded of his dance " improvisation " that day... to mostly chuckles now though.... lol! Edited September 19, 2017 by BRASSO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted September 19, 2017 Share Posted September 19, 2017 2 hours ago, JAZZER said: AGREED! nor did I. But, they will not improvise the written, as per the meaning of improvisation.[soloing over chord changes] We agree . Yep!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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