BRASSO Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 (edited) True. The Supreme Court has ruled that one's Freedom of Religion, Speech, Assembly, 2nd Amendment Rights, and other Constitutionally protected Freedoms are not iron clad Freedoms that extend to all environments equally. For just one example... an individual in an Employers domain. Employers, the Courts have ruled, have Employer Rights too. Courts have to balance the Rights of Individuals vs. the Collective Good all the time in their Court Rulings. Since this is a Flag thread, an individual's right to dishonor an American Flag, for example, does not automatically extend to an Employers domain. As such, an Employer ( such as the " NFL " ) would be within their legal rights to terminate an employee if they chose too for dishonoring the American Flag on company time, on company grounds, for example. Heck, in most cases, they could even legally terminate an employee for being late to the Flag ceremony, if they chose too. On the other hand, the Courts give much greater deference when the exercise of one's Freedoms are done away from the employer's domain, and not in a clash with that of an Employer's Constitutionally protected Rights. Edited October 25, 2017 by BRASSO 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted October 25, 2017 Share Posted October 25, 2017 (edited) nm Edited October 25, 2017 by GUARDLING Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exitmusic Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 Quote n the other hand, the Courts give much greater deference when the exercise of one's Freedoms are done away from the employer's domain, and not in a clash with that of an Employer's Constitutionally protected Rights. What? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 (edited) 10 hours ago, exitmusic said: What? For example, it is difficult for an employer to jusify curtailing someone's speech on their personal Facebook page when that person is on their own time and on their own computer unless the postings are directly related to the company. Edited October 26, 2017 by Stu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skevinp Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 I think the first amendment just protects speech from restriction by the government or, in some cases, on behalf of the government. I don't think it normally applies to private businesses or private organizations, unless perhaps a government issue is involved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 4 hours ago, skevinp said: I think the first amendment just protects speech from restriction by the government or, in some cases, on behalf of the government. I don't think it normally applies to private businesses or private organizations, unless perhaps a government issue is involved. Many of the NFL players wanted to protest against domestic violance while in uniform, but the NFL said no just like they said no to the Cowboys desire to support the fallen Dallas officers while in uniform. Which again is the Right of the NFL to do so while the players are officially representing the NFL. Thus in the case of the kneeling the NFL is hiding behind the hypocritical guise that they cannot do anything and are protecting the players freedom of expression. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRASSO Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 (edited) 3 hours ago, Stu said: Many of the NFL players wanted to protest against domestic violance while in uniform, but the NFL said no just like they said no to the Cowboys desire to support the fallen Dallas officers while in uniform. Which again is the Right of the NFL to do so while the players are officially representing the NFL. Thus in the case of the kneeling the NFL is hiding behind the hypocritical guise that they cannot do anything and are protecting the players freedom of expression. Its probably a little bit bolder than that, imo. The NFL League Office has purposefully elected to alter a previous Pre game Flag Ceremony organized by the NFL to simply honor Veterans with the unveiling of the American Flag, singing of the national anthem, but then allowed that pre game Flag/ Veteran honor ceremony to be altered into a political platform to express statements re. police brutality, and other politically charged Social Justice Issues. The League Office supports this. Their lawyers are bright enough to tell them they could have protected that Flag/ Veteran pre game honor ceremony as it was harmlessly and innocuously intended for, if they really wanted too. Edited October 26, 2017 by BRASSO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironlips Posted October 26, 2017 Share Posted October 26, 2017 So, just to bring this full circle and back to drum corps, protests always produce results of one kind or another. When the Immaculate Conception Reveries protested their placement by occupying the starting line in a sit-down demonstration years ago, they were summarily DQ-ed. That was the immediate result. In short order however, that corps morphed into an East Coast powerhouse called the 27th Lancers which proceeded to tear up the league for the better part of 20 years, giving creative opportunities to the likes of Charlie Poole, Jim Wedge, Ike Ianessa, George Zingale, Marc Sylvester, Denice Bonfiglio and others whose impact on today's activity is both evident and significant. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRASSO Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 (edited) 3 hours ago, ironlips said: So, just to bring this full circle and back to drum corps, protests always produce results of one kind or another. When the Immaculate Conception Reveries protested their placement by occupying the starting line in a sit-down demonstration years ago, they were summarily DQ-ed. That was the immediate result. In short order however, that corps morphed into an East Coast powerhouse called the 27th Lancers which proceeded to tear up the league for the better part of 20 years, giving creative opportunities to the likes of Charlie Poole, Jim Wedge, Ike Ianessa, George Zingale, Marc Sylvester, Denice Bonfiglio and others whose impact on today's activity is both evident and significant. The I.C. Reveries did not become the 27th Lancers however.. nor did they " morph " into anything else. The 1.C. Reveries continued on as a Drum Corps for more than a decade after the 1966 incident at the VFW Nationals.. The Mgt of the 27th Lancers left the I.C. Reveries after the '66 incident, and started their own Drum Corps, and named their brand new Corps the 27th Lancers, and copywrited the name. Years later, for example, when an alumni/ reunion Corps " 27th Lancers " group decided to keep that " 27th Lancers " name ( beyond '94), the original owners of the ' 27th Lancers " name went into court and got a court order for that Corps to drop the name . They protested that court order, but then acquiesced, and agreed to change the name from the" 27th Lancers" to "The Light Brigade". Ironically, neither the 1.C. Reveries, 27th Lancers, nor The Light Brigade ( all once fine Corps )perform any longer in either competitions, nor exhibitions. Finally, I'm not quite sure what any of this has to do with the subject matter, which is principally the American Flag, Color Presentations, its history, Freedoms and/ or Protests with the Flag, etc and so forth. Oh well.. we occasionally digress from time to time on here, and thats fine too, imo. Edited October 27, 2017 by BRASSO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironlips Posted October 27, 2017 Share Posted October 27, 2017 Well, OK. The leadership of the Reveries formed a new corps. Perhaps "morphed" was a bit of a stretch there. Still, the point is that a protest produced a result. The thrust of the article was the freedom of expression, and the purpose was to generate a discussion thereof, within the context of how that played itself out in drum corps. It is, after all, a microcosm or "the real world", after all. Thanks for your thoughts, wherever they lead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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