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3 hours ago, garfield said:

Again, you're applying your version of the law and penalty.  Your version is not the law and you can't hold any other in contempt if they believe differently than you.

What you're really saying is that you're ticked off at Cadets for hiring this guy because you have a personal opinion about how this guy should be punished that is different than the law, and different than Cadets' viewpoint.

Again, I'm not taking a position contrary to yours regarding the incident.  But I am holding firm to exactly what the law says; doing anything else invites and inflames a crowd mentality against a person who, according to the law, has paid the penalty required.

Frankly I don’t give two good craps about the 7th place Cadets or the people they feel the need to hire. I can see where someone within the organization thought it to be a good fit.  Shockingly predictable.

Like some, I’m not going to pretend it didn’t happen on the grounds that the person  has paid his penalty under the law. It did happen which continues to be ignored as if it didn’t. 

Or would I ever entertain the thought or the possibility that the person has changed the behavior then hire him when there are other candidates available who are not sick.

I’m no Cadet boot licking sycophant. We will have to agree to disagree, so please don’t spew your nonsense on me. None of which has anything to do with signing the petition. 

Edited by Jim Schehr
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This issue is far greater than any one corps. When it comes to the safety of the marching members, there should be no concessions. That applies to things obvious things like props and hydration. And also to the ethics and behavior of the staff.

That should be incontrovertible, no? I don't understand the disagreement on this issue.

Edited by danielwdunn
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28 minutes ago, danielwdunn said:

Can someone summarize the argument against signing this petition? 

From what I gathered, it seems people don't want this issue brought up because it reflects poorly on DCI and particular corps. But the point of the petition is to avoid that in the future, isn't it? That is, the petition requests higher standards to ensure protection of the marching members.

Am I missing something here? What is the material objection to this petition?

fear? i dont get it either

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18 minutes ago, danielwdunn said:

This issue is far greater than any one corps. When it comes to the safety of the marching members, there should be no concessions. That applies to things obvious things like props and hydration. And also to the ethics and behavior of the staff.

That should be incontrovertible, no? I don't understand the disagreement on this issue.

Agree. The petition doesn’t identify any person or organization. However there seems to be some obvious paranoia surfacing which in itself is interesting. The point of the petition is to bring attention to the governing body of all performing arts activities for consideration.

Edited by Jim Schehr

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22 minutes ago, danielwdunn said:

This issue is far greater than any one corps. When it comes to the safety of the marching members, there should be no concessions. That applies to things obvious things like props and hydration. And also to the ethics and behavior of the staff.

That should be incontrovertible, no? I don't understand the disagreement on this issue.

Thank you. 

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34 minutes ago, danielwdunn said:

Can someone summarize the argument against signing this petition? 

From what I gathered, it seems people don't want this issue brought up because it reflects poorly on DCI and particular corps. But the point of the petition is to avoid that in the future, isn't it? That is, the petition requests higher standards to ensure protection of the marching members.

Am I missing something here? What is the material objection to this petition?

With regard to this petition and petitions in general.  I would bet it's nothing more than apathy.

Like the old posed question...

The difference between ignorance and apathy?

I don't know.  I don't care.

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11 minutes ago, Jeff Ream said:

fear? i dont get it either

Based on the level of anger and attacks on this thread, I would be far more afraid NOT to sign the petition.  

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54 minutes ago, Jim Schehr said:

Frankly I don’t give two good craps about the 7th place Cadets or the people they feel the need to hire. I can see where someone within the organization thought it to be a good fit.  Shockingly predictable.

Like some, I’m not going to pretend it didn’t happen on the grounds that the person  has paid his penalty under the law. It did happen which continues to be ignored as if it didn’t. 

Or would I ever entertain the thought or the possibility that the person has changed the behavior then hire him when there are other candidates available who are not sick.

I’m no Cadet boot licking sycophant. We will have to agree to disagree, so please don’t spew your nonsense on me. None of which has anything to do with signing the petition. 

Oh stop.  The first two-thirds of your post were a joy to read, then you got personal.  I'm no boot licking sycophant, either, for God's sake.  And what makes you think that I am?  

My "nonsense" is about applying the law equally to all offenders and defendants, not based on the beliefs of one person or group, affected or involved or not.

I understand your viewpoint - BTW, you DON'T KNOW mine!  So don't think we are automatically on opposite sides.

You may believe with all your heart that a person can't change, but that's not how the law is written.  And you should take your anger out on the law and those who create it instead of on a single person who is following the law.

It's the pitchforks I object to.  The judge's order didn't include the pitchforks, despite your personal beliefs.

 

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3 minutes ago, garfield said:

Oh stop.  The first two-thirds of your post were a joy to read, then you got personal.  I'm no boot licking sycophant, either, for God's sake.  And what makes you think that I am?  

My "nonsense" is about applying the law equally to all offenders and defendants, not based on the beliefs of one person or group, affected or involved or not.

I understand your viewpoint - BTW, you DON'T KNOW mine!  So don't think we are automatically on opposite sides.

You may believe with all your heart that a person can't change, but that's not how the law is written.  And you should take your anger out on the law and those who create it instead of on a single person who is following the law.

It's the pitchforks I object to.  The judge's order didn't include the pitchforks, despite your personal beliefs.

 

judges can screw up.

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Do corps need to follow the law? Yes. 

Can they do better than simply follow the law by ensuring higher standards for staff? Absolutely.

I read your posts on this thread, garfield, and I don't think I understand where you're coming from.

Edited by danielwdunn

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