Jeff Ream Posted January 9, 2018 Author Share Posted January 9, 2018 6 hours ago, glory said: I am proud to disagree with the effect judges consistently. Having the power to assign scores isn't necessarily the same as being right. HH i never assigned who was right or wrong. I just stated the effect judges disagreed. Your presumption of guilt was overplayed 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted January 9, 2018 Author Share Posted January 9, 2018 5 hours ago, garfield said: Don't really care about the effect judges, I'm 100% with HH. The visual/audio "disconnect" (great word) was actually disconcerting, like vertigo or getting light-headed when you stand up too quickly. For those of use "programmed" to connect visual and audio in show production... And really, if there's a focal point that would excite the imagination of the tin-foil hat crowd, it's the "relationship" between the effect judges and the program designers, it seems to me. see above 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted January 9, 2018 Author Share Posted January 9, 2018 5 hours ago, garfield said: I keep asking myself where did FloMarching come from all of a sudden? Is Flo the de facto replacement for Tom Blair production? Maybe a different thread is warranted, but it's probably just that I missed the initial explanation of the genesis of Flo's increasing involvement. Blair still gets involved finals week. But Flo is picking up where other things like the Old Fan network used to step in, and is adding onto the Dan Potter stuff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted January 9, 2018 Author Share Posted January 9, 2018 5 hours ago, N.E. Brigand said: I did, again, because it seemed like an intentional effect to me. A bit like that moment in Blue Devils' "Constantly Risking Absurdity" where the guard sets up for a big rifle toss and then deliberately drops their equipment. And in general, I've opposed most so-called evolutions in recent drum corps history, but inevitably, after a few years, a handful of exceptions proves that I was wrong to be so broadly contrarian. Turns out I'm more like Jeff in that I find it's bad execution that matters more than the lousy principles. I liked the bD thing....despite generally disliking 96% of that show, than I did the Coats moment. I got the idea, it just seemed forced to me. Look, I was one of the biggest critics of amplification and electronics when it passed, and I went to 3 shows from 2004-2008 Because I was so mad. Granted I had far more local options to attend then than I do now, so all I get to live now is one show, but I do subscribe to the online viewing options. I've said all along, the justifications for using it were flimsy at best, and I'll go out on a limb and state that how it's used and how well it's used is BETTER in DCA than it is in DCA...and those guys only go on weekends. But it's here, and it's not going away. I do think it's added some really great things to some shows. And I think too often it's been used as a crutch. technological difficulties still occur after 14 years. While the execution technologically works far better in WGI....which by the way is filling the sound in a far smaller venue, it HAS gotten better. and most frustratingly, it's usually the same offenders, both with design and in execution ( as well as glitches). I'll say this for Bluecoats...it seems like every other year they take some gambles that don't work, then come back out roaring the next year ( 14 and 16 opposed to 15 and 17). Sure they have someone from Cirque on staff, and even he admits the challenges. It's like anything else in drum corps..."oh look a shiny new toy....let's see what it can do!" the impetus IMO still falls upon the judging community to make the statement when it's not working. I'll glady admit I've gotten my ### ripped in critique when I call someone out for bad any of the above, and I'll stand by every one of those calls. It's time DCI judges do as well. 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N.E. Brigand Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 3 hours ago, IllianaLancerContra said: “The best designed sound show is one that the audience does not notice,” he [Aaron Beck (professional sound guy also w/ Bluecoats) ] said. That's often said and often true of many artistic endeavors. But a good show-off can also be effective. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mingusmonk Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 14 hours ago, garfield said: I keep asking myself where did FloMarching come from all of a sudden? Is Flo the de facto replacement for Tom Blair production? Maybe a different thread is warranted, but it's probably just that I missed the initial explanation of the genesis of Flo's increasing involvement. Tom Blair has been consulting with DCI and Flo on improving the main season productions (that he doesn't actually produce). And he still runs the show on finals week. The whole plan with Flo from the beginning was to be more that just a live show feed. They want your eyeballs all year long and it's in DCI's best interest (or the best interest of the agreement) to cooperate and assist in making that happen. Another reason we have seen more of Flo last week is that they were involved in the electronics roundtable/presentation that Dan Potter live streamed on his facebook. They are trying to improve the quality of the feeds, especially from an audio perspective., by developing and proposing some standards and direct-feed solutions interfacing with the corps' sound equipment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fran Haring Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 9 hours ago, Jeff Ream said: Look, I was one of the biggest critics of amplification and electronics when it passed, and I went to 3 shows from 2004-2008 Because I was so mad. Granted I had far more local options to attend then than I do now, so all I get to live now is one show, but I do subscribe to the online viewing options. I've said all along, the justifications for using it were flimsy at best, and I'll go out on a limb and state that how it's used and how well it's used is BETTER in DCA than it is in DCI...and those guys only go on weekends. But it's here, and it's not going away. I do think it's added some really great things to some shows. And I think too often it's been used as a crutch. technological difficulties still occur after 14 years. While the execution technologically works far better in WGI....which by the way is filling the sound in a far smaller venue, it HAS gotten better. and most frustratingly, it's usually the same offenders, both with design and in execution ( as well as glitches). I'll say this for Bluecoats...it seems like every other year they take some gambles that don't work, then come back out roaring the next year ( 14 and 16 opposed to 15 and 17). Sure they have someone from Cirque on staff, and even he admits the challenges. It's like anything else in drum corps..."oh look a shiny new toy....let's see what it can do!" the impetus IMO still falls upon the judging community to make the statement when it's not working. I'll glady admit I've gotten my ### ripped in critique when I call someone out for bad any of the above, and I'll stand by every one of those calls. It's time DCI judges do as well. Well said. I agree, the DCA corps seem to have looked at what has worked and what hasn't on the DCI side... and applied those lessons. You are right... it's not going away. And some corps will do it better than others. Just the nature of the beast. If everyone was at the top of their game all the time, the Finals cutoff score would be a 98. LOL. And yes, judges should call out corps who don't have their act together, same as they would critique a corps that needs to march or play better. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted January 10, 2018 Author Share Posted January 10, 2018 15 hours ago, Fran Haring said: Well said. I agree, the DCA corps seem to have looked at what has worked and what hasn't on the DCI side... and applied those lessons. You are right... it's not going away. And some corps will do it better than others. Just the nature of the beast. If everyone was at the top of their game all the time, the Finals cutoff score would be a 98. LOL. And yes, judges should call out corps who don't have their act together, same as they would critique a corps that needs to march or play better. I'll be honest...i think it's working better in DCA because they take their time about it. They don't rush to throw a zillion things in at once. They try a few things out, make sure they get it good, and then work on more. DCI it's all about trying as much as you can as fast as you can. In hindsight, i think only going on the weekends allows DCA corps to step back, take an objective look at it, and then work it out. DCI is all about the quick fix for the next night 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terri Schehr Posted January 10, 2018 Share Posted January 10, 2018 7 hours ago, Jeff Ream said: I'll be honest...i think it's working better in DCA because they take their time about it. They don't rush to throw a zillion things in at once. They try a few things out, make sure they get it good, and then work on more. DCI it's all about trying as much as you can as fast as you can. In hindsight, i think only going on the weekends allows DCA corps to step back, take an objective look at it, and then work it out. DCI is all about the quick fix for the next night And often, the problem becomes worse. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted January 10, 2018 Author Share Posted January 10, 2018 7 hours ago, Terri Schehr said: And often, the problem becomes worse. very much so....and the habitual abusers never learn 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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