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7 hours ago, MikeRapp said:

 I think it would be interesting to ask ourselves if Carolina crown could do Babylon or session 44. Could there approach to design and arrangements embrace those two styles of shows. I have to say I don’t think so, but I think it would be really cool to see them try something new that wasn’t forced into what I would call their predictable design patterns of the past.

I love the cleanliness of their triple tonguing passages, but if you watch them over the years it does get predictable and a bit, I don’t know, disappointing I guess. Maybe if I was in charge of Carolina crown I would say well that’s who we are and that’s what’s made us great and that’s what people love about us. They can win medals doing that, so technically there’s no reason to change other than creativity and excellence.

As one of the resident Crownies, I can say without question that the current design staff is not capable of designing such a show. Do they have the talent to pull it off, if taught by SCV’s staff most definitely in the drums and brass section, probably not visually. The corps lost quite a bit when they lost Leon and the visual team 2 years ago, both from a design and performance standpoint. And it’s extremely evident. Now with Ron gone, there will be some major questions that need to be answered if they wish to remain competitive. This will be a critical off season for this organization, and I think there will be some whole-sale changes that a lot of people didn’t see coming. 

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8 hours ago, flammaster said:

Bluecoats really push the bar creatively while Crown relies on gimmickry in desperation to do anything to win coupled with an in your face smugness by their fans who had the nerve to come here and boo us when we beat them at our home show which is why I simply can not stand them.

I agree and disagree about Crown “fans.” I do come from Massachusetts and see Crown pretty frequently in the early season. With the exception of 2017 when things were a bit strained, Crown is pretty popular up here. However, the fan base in New England includes high school kids but tends not to have 20-40 something’s. There is an age gap and the crowds can be older. Debates can be strong in the stands, but responses are polite.  I do see a big difference in Allentown. Crown can have a rowdy and rude fan base, but I’ve also noticed we’re not talking about alums and staff. Crown has in the past attracted an opinionated and rowdy crowd, as people in Indy in 2012 when BD won the title will recall. However if you also recall in 2012 there was good sportsmanship at the retreat by corps members and staff. 

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1 hour ago, Newseditor44 said:

As one of the resident Crownies, I can say without question that the current design staff is not capable of designing such a show. Do they have the talent to pull it off, if taught by SCV’s staff most definitely in the drums and brass section, probably not visually. The corps lost quite a bit when they lost Leon and the visual team 2 years ago, both from a design and performance standpoint. And it’s extremely evident. Now with Ron gone, there will be some major questions that need to be answered if they wish to remain competitive. This will be a critical off season for this organization, and I think there will be some whole-sale changes that a lot of people didn’t see coming. 

Did Ron and his crew resign after finals? They are still listed on Crown's website. 

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48 minutes ago, Tim K said:

However if you also recall in 2012 there was good sportsmanship at the retreat by corps members and staff. 

To this day, BD is usually the first group Crown goes to after retreat to congratulate on a great season and vice-versa. There is a lot of respect shown between both corps. I personally get a lot of lip from my DCI friends when I talk up BD but I don't care one bit. Mad respect for that organization.

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I'm not quite sure what the OP is going for. Personally, I don't see a whole lot of similarities between the Crown of 2012 and the Crown of the last couple of years. They definitely seem willing to change things up to try to be at/near the top. I see a very similar willingness in Bloo, and SCV. For any of these groups, risky designs mean that sometimes it doesn't work out. It's awfully crowded at the top of DCI these days and if you have a show design that doesn't quite come together in a given year, it's easy to quickly fall behind those with stronger vehicles.

But hey, Crown is obviously doing quite a lot of things right in Brass and Percussion. If they go back to some familiar ideas with brass each year, it's only because those ideas have had them basically owning the caption for the last decade. Maybe it's time to change it up a bit, but for sure they have the arranger, caption staff and performers to be able to do so whenever they please.

They had a big visual staff change a couple of years ago, and maybe the new team hasn't fully figured things out yet.

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