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Bugles VS Trumpets


LSU GRAD 82

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Besides the fab four mentioned, Jupiter (from Taiwan) has a presence in the marching band ranks and has a few lines here and there in DivII/III. Design is based on OLD yamahas and quality leaves something to be desired, but both are improving rapidly.

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kanstul made bugles for VK, Freelancers, BD and many more during this period. Dynasty was NVER the only maker of G bugles, ever.

Not to argue here, but could you detail the extent of Kanstul's 2 valve bugle production for my enlightenment? From what I know Kanstul began business in 1986. They produced a Meehaphone, a 2 valve descant bugle, for BD. There was a 2 valve soprano made for VK sold on ebay a few years ago and described as rare. It went for 2-3 times what a standard 2 valve sold for.

Did Kanstul make a complete line of brass; sops, mellos, baris, euphs, contras? It was my understanding that tooling for a 2 valve set back in the late 80's when the 3 valve proposal was being floated at every Rules Congress was too cost prohibitive and risky. Kanstul only produced a set of bugles once three valves were allowed and still make them today. One of the benefits of going to three valves was getting Zig back in the bugle market.

So it was my understanding that prior to the introduction of three valve bugles, Dynasty was the producer of a complete set of bugles.

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I'm not sure, but didn't the USMC D&BC just get a new set of Kanstul two-valve G bugles? If so, Kanstul does make them (but maybe only on special order).

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They did, but like you said, it was a special order situation, which is the case for pretty much all G bugles now.

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I've heard even if you order a full line of Bb horns from Dynasty that too is made to order.

Given the expense of maintaining a large inventory, (even though for accounting purposes inventory counts as sales), it is a financial liability to have a large amount of unsold product.

A full line of instruments would most likely be made to order. Probably some from stock and the rest made to fill the order.

Most manufacturing operates this way these days. There are many economic reasons for this.

Edited by Martybucs
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  • 2 weeks later...
Actually, for a long time Dynasty instruments, all of them, were made by Allied Music Corporation the former parent company of Getzen.

DEG is a seperate company, but they did not actually manufacture the bugles. Now the Getzen company is family owned again and owns Allied Music, still the manufacturer of Dynasty, I believe.

Sort of. Two different companies. Same Getzen family. Cousins at this point.

Getzen does not make horns for DEG/Dynasty. Some horns in the past were identical because they sourced them from the same overseas mfgr. In Marquis' stock, there are a number of like-new Dynasty (DEG) 3-valve chrome sops and one Getzen that is identical, except for the brand stamp. Both from the same overseas (actually South America) plant.

EDIT: Kenny Norman tells/corrects me:

"Until 1993, most of the DEG horns were made at Allied. The smallbores all have Amado waterkeys. The baritones have an A prefix on the serial#. The euphs and contras were Willsons. (also the 2v altos, and one model of trombonium.)" About the time that Bob, Ed, & Tom bought back the Getzen name there was (an issue) over QC. The 3v bugles that were already made up for DEG were stamped with the Getzen stencil. Some were sold individually in 1993 by a sales rep at corps shows. There were a couple of ads in DCW. And finally the remaining stock was all sold to the Boston Crusaders Alumni corps. Allied does not even maintain any parts for these horns. All the marching stuff now is made by Weril, although it took a while for euph and contras to be developed there. There were still Willies being made, but the Werils could be had cheaper."

- Thanks Kenny

Related by family members. Allied Music Corporation was a common thread, which was a horn parts and repair tools supply company turned horn maker. DEG/Dynasty was Donald E. Getzen, whom is now retired but running a music accessory wholesale business -- helping Jim Kelly (the colorful mouthpieces) with marketing and distribution connections -- and for a while last year Don helped me with my SpitSpot pads. Don's son, Dan Getzen, is still at DEG/Dynasty. They are in Lake Geneva, WI. The Dynasty horns are not made here - they come from manufacturing outside the U.S., (EDIT - mfgr. by Weril) but they do carefully prep/fine-tune each horn in their Lake Geneva shop. It's a cozy place you can drive right past (Brent Turner and I went past it three times once before calling for directions.)

Don's NEPHEW, Tom, runs Getzen, which is about 20 minutes farther up the road in Elkhorn, (town is also home to Holton, now swallowed-up by Conn-Selmer). Getzen Co. is a manufacturer, making the trumpets, cornets, fluegels and t-bones right there. I think the background brasses are imported, though. Kind of a pro-shop setup; not a huge, mass-production place like some other brands. They have some nice videos on-line for you to see how they solder a trumpet valve section, spin a bell, silver plate, and draw a trombone slide. Their Edwards brand trombones are just about the best made.

(Tom's) Getzen company has really cranked-up the quality and marketing lately (it had dropped under previous control/ownership), and is currently setting up distributors in the U.K. to tap the HUGE brass band market there, which is STARVED for prized Getzen horns. I've seen U.K. brass banders come here and sell their European horns so they can take home a new Getzen. Getzen makes a 4-valve fluegelhorn that is to die for.

King, by the way, is just another cog in the HUGE Conn-Selmer (Steinway) conglomerate. BRANDS of Conn-Selmer include King, Bach, CG Conn, Holton, Benge, Ludwig/Musser, Leblanc, Martin, and so on. So I suppose you could consider King as Conn-Selmer's marching brand. They own factories all over the place.

And to relate that back better to the thread, I would think Conn-Selmer could "dump" deals on King horns about as well as Yamaha -- something that a much smaller outfit like Dynasty or Kanstul can't do.

Edited by dannyboy
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I'm not sure, but didn't the USMC D&BC just get a new set of Kanstul two-valve G bugles? If so, Kanstul does make them (but maybe only on special order).

Kanstul will make 2-valve ONLY for the USMC.

Imagine the bonus care and pride that goes into making those special horns?

Edited by dannyboy
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It makes me luagh so much hearing "conspiracy" theories about how yamaha or whatever introduced Bb horns and all that stuff...

my personal opinion? Bb and F horns sound better. simple as it is. projection, size of the bell... this is all theorical. let's talk about facts on football fields. Bb allowed a LOT of corps that sounded like crap to sound a lot better. Bb are easier to be played by mediocre players (which are a lot in drum corps) with all the things realted to it. quality of soud, control, balance, intonation, matching... if you like a corps sounding like a chainsaw but using G bugles... I don't care, it's up to you. but don't say it's better, because it isn't.

Bb/F are easier to be sold. and in these financially hard times a whole set of brand new instruments is pure gold in the hands of a corps.

so yamaha imposed the use of Bb instruments? THANK YOU VERY MUCH, YAMAHA.

and by the way, corps still can rip my face off when playing fffff. but now several corps can do it with balance and "characteristic" sound, not "tin" sound.

Edited by FH4life
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