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Free Labor? You mean, volunteering?...the backbone of just about every corps...not just the cadets? It's amusing how you make it sound dirty... Every corps asks for volunteers, but he is putting himself out there in front of the alumni, where he at least runs the risk of taking a beating. If anything, it would be easier (and more beneficial as far as soliciting donations / volunteering) if they didn't send george, but i'm guessing he's the man people want to see....

I get your drift. Allow me to offer an alternate hypothesis, one that you might actually agree with (even though it might upset the digestion on much of DCP). Here it is: Possibly, just possibly, not every Cadet alum is an idiot. Indeed, probably, very probably, most of them are not. Most Cadet alums while sharing a profound affection for the uniform they wore understand the challenge to balance tradition and innovation. Most surely appreciate the corps for what it is rather than what it's not. They understand a corps like the Cadets at times will push boundaries, including theirs. They accept that not everything that transpires can meet the individual expectations of a group so large, diverse and interested. Though these alums might be included in the DCP insurgency, they most definitely are not defined by it, which is good. Many have revealed the embarrassment they felt from the loudmouth malcontents who shamed the corps and their fellow alums by their impertinently public comments on Facebook. As such, many alums in all these place will be glad that Hopkins is reaching out as he is. Many won’t find nefarious motives in the timing. Many will be glad this corps cares enough to facilitate what they could, and perhaps should, have done already. Many will admire that, whatever the context, this leader has the courage of his convictions to meet them eye to eye. That’s what I think. HH

You know...i watched you almost write this post a few days ago (I could tell that your SN was in italics...indicating that you were typing a response to my post), and then you stopped. What made you change your mind?? As far as what he said, could you point out what was so bad about it in the first place? I mean honestly, I dont remember. I recall generally disagreeing with him, but i dont recall any instances where he insulted the current members, or said they were less deserving of respect. Maybe he complained about hopkins or something, but if we shunned everyone on dcp who did that, even I wouldn't be here. And are you really worried about an apology-fest on DCP? Really? On this website people change opinions about as often as the cadets wear green. It just seems like a strange concern to have, at least on this website. I understand having concequences for actions, especially in the real world, but as we know, this place is far from it...and personally, there are enough people on this site for me to waste time arguing with without having to go after the ones i've already convinced....

This Chicken vs Egg Debate is pointless. The uniform discussions have surely been ongoing for 3 or 4 months, and I'm guessing the alumni gatherings have been planned for a while as well. Even George Hopkins, the creator of drum corps, and the answer to questions such as "what is the meaning of life?" and "what is 2+2?" can not simply wave his hand and create reservations for conference rooms in hotels to fit a tightly scheduled east coast business trip.... Why can people just accept the fact that the folks that are angry about the uniform changing were going to be angry about it either way, regardless of what the proverbial headline was when the story broke...

it also has the worst tone ever. Valve trombones fail. Just man up (or woman up) and march a Baritone/Euphonium.

I just received an e-mail about what is billed as "Hop's Alumni Tour 2011," describing how George Hopkins is taking several days to travel to four locations in order to open alumni chapters in four locations. As corps alums spread out across the country, this seems like a brilliant idea to keep them connected and I can only guess such chapters could spread across the country. Hop's tour will be taking him to meet alums in the Boston area, Philadelphia/South Jersey, Northern Virginia/Metro DC and the Atlanta region. I realize some might say this is an effort to mitigate some of the alumni reaction to news about the possible uniform changes, but it's still a pretty cool thing to do to provide outreach to alums that live away from the corps' base. If you know of any other corps that do the same sort of coordinated effort, please let us know. It might be something worth considering for DCP to have an alumni forum where alums from all corps could have a place to learn about alumni meetings and other alumni news. What do you think?

Well a few reasons. 1) is it really needed? especially in todays economic climate, can corps justfiy the expense of a whole new uniform.costume/set of jammies on a football field? 2) tradition. Many of the greatest drum corps shows of all time were created in uniforms considered iconic. Those shows didn't need it, why would this? I mean, when I watch 87, I don't see the West Point look hurting App Apring. and lets face it, tradition wise, as drum corps throws more of it away, you can also see the fan base dwindling. There is some correlation 3) these days, people will always use creatvitiy as a justification for anything new. Really, to be truly creative, you need limitations to allow true genius to show thru. I still laugh at some of the justifications trotted out since 2003 for some rules passages that were a laugh then and proven to be lies since.

Well said! Communication on any level is a good thing.

IF George has every chained you to his desk and whipped you in order to work at a USSBA events then that's a different story. That's one way to get "free labor" but honestly what you are referring to (so negatively I might add) is merely "volunteering"... clearly your mind is in the wrong place with the spin you're putting on everything. And if you do not like to volunteer the best thing to do is just to not volunteer.

What you say might make sense, except i would bet a pretty penny that hop already had a feel of the 'pulse' of the alumni, remembering that he has considered drastically changing the uniform before (but backed off), and did so in 05/06. Additionally, the reaction from certain quarters has been documented and predictable for every other minor uniform change, so I'm not sure that 'asking' the alumni if they were ok with it would have been productive. I maybe would have liked to know a little earlier, but other than that, I cant really see much reason to do things differently...

If the band circuit is what makes the money, and a lot of the profits go to helping get the cadets down the road, then does it really matter? As an alum, i've been asked many times to work such events, and I've never felt cheated or exploited... sorry if you feel otherwise

I didn't know about this. Thanks for bringing it to my attention, Boo. I think what Hop is doing is a great idea. After all, drum corps is basically a co-ed college fraternity. They have regional alumni chapters, why shouldn't we? It will be a great way for alumni to get together (relatively) easily, and I'm sure the corps proper will notice a financial impact, as well!

George Hopkins.

and then be bored out of your mind with every show they design for the rest of your life anywho... Brass: Arranger: JD SHAW Caption Team: Team consisting of Van Dorens/ Harloffs/ and Martins (as in Freddy) Percussion: Paul Rennick (writing and teaching) and whoever he wants to help him out Guard: Whoever was responsible for fantasia WG in their prime a few years ago drill design:Takaesu Sensei (Nishihara Marching Band) Visual Caption head: Todd Ryan (blue devils)

www.scvanguard.org There is also a video talking about the show. It also states that they are planning on having the show complete in time for the TOC tours that starts in June.

Since Omaha (I'll still attend the regular show July 10) is no longer a Tour of Champions show, I bought a $27 Rockford ticket last night, row 24. I love being in small stadiums - Michigan City's Ames Field is one of my favorites. I've been to Rockford's Show of Shows just once before - several years ago. Looking forward to returning! If the August 7 TOC show winds up being at the Meadowlands, there may be high ticket prices for the venue, and high parking prices too. The Rockford show on Sunday, July 17 will be one of the best drum corps value of the summer. Venues like Allentown, Michigan City and Rockford have great prices since the intimate stadiums are not at all NFL-caliber. Secret best parking at Allentown: behind the grandstands, past the cemetery, on Chew. It's terrific, free, curbside, and easy walking distance through a peaceful alley. There is usually a cat in one of the neighbor windows as you meander to and from the stadium.

I like to have both..shows who actually has the better horn line.

Is that how SCV pulled off "Adagio for Strings"? Or how Star managed "Music for Strings, Percussion and Celeste"? I think we're on to something here. HH

It's no secret I have been one of Hop's more vocal critics going back to the RAMD days. That said, I think this is a great idea. Sure being the lightning rod he can be, it could lead to some...um...interesting...meetings. But I think it's a great idea to not just hit them via email or mailers, but to go out and be there and talk face to face.

Then... what WAS it ?

Nope. They can play tuba, mello, trumpet, or anything else that is currently used in drum corps instrumentation.

My take... 1. Blue Devils I didn't like the show. Not one bit. That doesn't mean it wasn't the cleanest, best performed show I've seen in a long time. 2. Bluecoats A pounding, loud, amazing show that has stuck with me since the first time I saw it. Currently my favorite show I've ever seen. 3. Cavaliers Why Bloo over Cavies? Simple. I only remember certain moments and pieces of "Mad World." I can't get a single second of "Metropolis" out of my head. Bloo made a more lasting impact on me, and that gives them an edge. 4. Cadets Why Cadets over Crown? See Bloo over Cavies. Also, a fun fact: the guard member who gave Geoffrey his shako at the end is a DR at a dorm at my college, and I march with a Cadets mello in said college's marching band. 5. Crown Pass 6. Phantom I've listened to "The New Moon in the Old Moon's Arms" and must say that Phantom did great justice to the source material. The most emotionally powerful show I've ever seen. 7. Blue Stars Not much to say. Liked the show, and our bass line was always jealous of their line's drums; a beautiful red shell with great heads (foam-dampened, not PowerMax like we used at Surf). 8. Santa Clara Just a shocking turn-off of a show for me... A stark contrast from "Ballet for Martha," a favorite of mine. Not that I don't like Bartok, but it just didn't work. T9. Madison Scouts T9. Boston Crusaders I can't decide between these two. Power vs. Finesse, Theatrics vs. Storytelling, Green vs. Red. These two corps are almost polar opposites. I loved both shows, and thought they were both executed brilliantly. 11. Blue Knights Would have been a third tie for 9th, but not as much reaction out of this show as the other two. Still, I never thought I'd say that BK had a streak of shows that I enjoyed. DISCLAIMER: The rest of these placements are placed mostly on hearsay, since as a marching member of a corps I did not have a chance to see most of these shows. 12. The Academy Who should go here? Certainly not the Glassmen, who I will discuss later, but from what I hear this was the most enjoyable show of this tier of corps. 13. Colts The Colts may just buy a lease on this spot, since it seems like they never leave it. 14. Glassmen Wanna know how boring this show was? At Atlanta, the thing my group and I noticed the most was how often the bass drums dropped their puffies during the show. Naturally, they were at most of our shows in the second half of tour, so it became a running joke among us. I'm trying to remember ANY Glassmen show I've ever seen. 15. Troopers The gap spacer between the top 14 and bottom 8. Much closer to the 14 than the 8. 16. Spirit Our touring buddy in the 1st half of our tour. A solid show that was solid, but unspectacular. 17. X-Men Watched them on a TV screen in Atlanta. The circle drill wasn't too circle-y, but the music was good. 18. Pacific Crest Don't know anything about this show. 19. Mandarins Surf coulda beaten them in drums (they did in Allentown, IIRC) 20. Jersey Surf Ah yes, my show. I will argue to this day that we should have beaten Teal Sound. Our biggest downfall this year (and -spoiler- next year at this rate) is that we had a VERY small horn line. It's our catch-22... we need more horns to be competitive, but we need to be more competitive to get more people to join our horn line. 21. Teal Sound Guard outfits for the pit... electric guitars as a primary instrument... god, I do not like this corps. 22. Cascades Ironically played "The Sun Will Come Out Tomorrow" just before a large rain storm in Fairfax, VA once... that's all I know about the show. 23. Pioneer Below Cascades only because I have an idea of what the Cascades' show was like.

Who hasn't seen True Lies?....at least a few (hundred) times?? Do it again.... slowly....

I think what a lot of people are overlooking is the difference between SOUNDING LOUD and actually BEING LOUD. In a perfect world, the perfect musician would sound no different when "sounding loud" and when "being loud." But, realistically, there is always a timbre change. Even Herseth and Kleinhammer and Jacobs sound different at fff than at mf (this is the fundamental reason, I think, why the Cavies sounded the way they did for so long). I think many fans equate this "loud timbre" to actual volume. I'm pretty certain they would be SHOCKED at the (actually quite minute) decibel differences between "loud" corps and "not loud" corps. Often, it's not really the decibel difference, it's the fact that they are encouraged to play with a "loud timbre." In my opinion, Blue Devils, Cadets, and Phantom play with this loud timbre. Phantom especially...even when they play mf, they still sound like they're playing loud (this is NOT a good thing!). Crown and Bloo, however...they're doing some good thing. I'll give the Cavies another year or so to gel before I decide what road they're traveling.

No good deed goes unpunished.

As far as I know, this tour has been on the books for quite a while...way before the uniform drama. Will that stop the speculation regarding motive?...probably not, but I thought I'd throw it out there...

how silly....i can't imagine that your fabulous show could offend anyone except for perhaps a bitter competitior or the biggest prig however i understand WGI's need to maintain and protect their wholesome image!

nope...not Bridgemen

Should trombone players have to learn baritone? No. They can learn mellophone, trumpet, tuba....percussion....auxiliary....drum major....

Brass- Jim Elvord, Wayne Downey, Gino Cipriani Percussion- Fred Sanford, Scott Johnson, Rob Carson Visual-Steve Brubaker, Todd Ryan, Greg Clarke Guard-Jim Moore/April Gilligan Tour Director- Jack Bevins Corps Director- Jim Jones Head Cook- (very important) Dawn Christianson Corps Mom- Ginger "Go get em kids" Smith Head Bus Driver- Allison Lendman and her her ability to navigate the narrow streets of Montreal Drum Major- Daniel Veerhusen and Al Go

I'd go get people who may not have become "names". they'd be hungrier and willing to learn what works and what doesn't.

For those who may not have been around, in 2002, Bluecoats' show was titled "Urban Dances," (not to be confused with the orchestral selection of the same name performed by Carolina Crown in the 2006 show, "In.trance.it." In the Bluecoats show was a selection by Chris Brubeck; "Paradise Utopia" from "Concerto for Bass Trombone." Okay, I guess that really doesn't mean anything other than I'm bored at the moment and counting down the days until June.

Brass: Jim Prime, Donny VanDoren, Van Matthews Percussion: Colin McNutt, Lee Beddis, Jim Cassella Guard: Scott Chandler, Adam Sage, Jim Moore Visual: Pete Webber, Todd Ryan

If you are a trombone player, you should learn to play baritone regardless. It's not difficult.

well, I guess ANY issue can be controversial in drum corps, so I'd suspect this to be no different. Trombones are cumbersome to march around with and visually they don't match with the rest of instruments so it probably wouldn't be good to have a whole section of trombones in a drum corps. But if there was a trombone soloist, or even maybe trombone trio for a bit of the show, I could get into that! Just for a different effect in drum corps, it could be fun.

funny tho: did the uniform hold back West Side 84/94/09? App Spring in 87? Les Mis in 89? bernstein in 90? 93 When the Kings Go Off to War? Stonehenge? Disney Celebration? no. so in some ways, the whole "we need it to make the show work" is, well, kinda lame. because clearly, that uniform did not fit several of those shows, yet it worked. I mean really, it didn't fit 83-85, 87, 90, 93, 98 or 00, but yet those shows won. Again, I'm not pro or con, but some of the justifications do stretch credibility some.

Would like Glory to buy up a section on the 50 to make this happen.

And it was NOT cut from the PBS finals broadcast, either--I have a copy of the performance. I remember Drum Corps World had a recap of finals that made mention of it (and not in a good way).

Sorry if I killed this thread's thunder, but that yell pretty much ruined that part of the show for me. -- Back on topic, I did not realize that Barber's only work containing non-original material was "Die Natali". Fun fact! Much appreciated. And if anyone from SCV is reading this: The 2000 arrangement of Agnus Dei would be an absolutely killer encore piece *hint hint, nudge nudge*

the city slickers loudly yelled "oh ####" in 1984 during "little afairie on the prarie" as the indians surrounded the cavalry!

Is this why G bugle hornlines sounded WAY louder but with (what most would consider) less quality?

Anything from 1996 to 2002 SCV, Especially Copeland the Modernist and Fog City Sketches, good God those are demanding and well performed shows. Probably my 2 favorite drum lines ever.

Yes she is using physics, and I understand the point. However considering many college bands never play in tune, an 80-90 top tier brass line will out play them any day of the week for the simple fact that they sound as one continuous sound.

I'm confused about why you are complaining. The tickets on the 50 I just purchased cost me $27 each. I'm very happy with that price for any eight corps. Thanks, Phantom.

How about I let you pay 27 to sit on the 50 and stop complaining. Ill even throw in free parking if you promise to stop bringing negativity in a thread simply advertising the release of ticket sales. Oh wait....they already have both of those things as an option. hmmmmmmmmmmm........Top 8 corps all in one place for 27 bucks AND sitting on the 50 - SURELY THERE HAS TO BE SOMETHING ELSE TO COMPLAIN ABOUT THAT WILL HELP BRING ABOUT THE ULTIMATE BOYCOTT AND DESTRUCTION OF THE G8.

$13 dollars LESS than a $17 seat????? I dont see anything like that on the Allentown ticket page. I dont see ANY Allentown seats for under $30 per night! ALMOST ALL of the Rockford seats are under $30 WITH FREE PARKING! Very, very few seats are $60 plus - maybe 200 to 300 at the most. I certainly havent called you 'stupid' but get the FACTS straight. Over 80% of the Rockford seats are UNDER $30 and about 25% of the seats are $17 with the worse view being at the goal line - no end zone seating here! WHERE can you see 8 of the top drum corps for $17 (SEVENTEEN dollars) and get free parking?????? Luckily there are less than 90 of the $63 seats left as I see it online. The majority are already gone....

Wow, welcome to the land of "nothing is ever good enough, ever".

More than almost any year I can remember, I was never wowed by anyone being clearly #1 last year. All the top 6 had weaknesses. The entire top 4 from 2008 was stronger, in my opinion, than anyone in 2010. 1. Bluecoats - I just felt like this was the most polished, well executed, visually and musically demanding and audience engaging show of the top 3 - a complete package 2. BD - Undeniably well executed, but the connection was just missing to me, and the visual demand, while hidden by the mirrors to an extent, was just not there for me - just my preference 3. Crown - May not have been the most effective visual book, but it was demanding, the hornline was stellar, and the guard very complimentary. The new ending propeled this show up my rankings 4. Cavaliers - this show has slipped for me the more times I've listened to it and/or watched it. The music book just had too many weaknesses, and the hornline was just not on par with the rest of the top 6 in my opinion 5. Phantom - As others have said, they took the emotion and connection to another level for many (not for all) and while different from their normal "sound", I thought this was solidly a top 4 corps musically. Also felt the guard was under-rated by the end of the year. 6. Cadets - I can't put my finger on it, but there was just something missing from this show. Trying to hard to be cute & likeable. Clearly still closer to 2nd than 7th. 7. Blue Stars - I felt like they nailed their performances in Indy. Powerful show, well played & well marched. 8..SCV - Not everyone's cup of tea but pulled off very well. 9. Blue Knights - I felt like this show should have scored better. Very demanding show executed reasonably well. Inspiring show, good audience connection, and I'll never get tired of hearing how Jim Prime arrangements close a movement or a show. 10. Madison - what a great step forward for them! Nice power, vastly improved guard, good show concept all in their favor/ Pedestrian drill held them back, but what a great building block. 11. Boston - Such a tight grouping between 9th and 11th for me. All around one of Boston's better recent shows. 12. Glassmen - Some nice moments, but not one of my favorite shows 13. Troopers - probably a better performing corps than 2009, but the vehicle was not nearly as strong 14. Academy - on the verge of top 12 in everything but a sub-par guard program 15. Colts - maybe one of the most solid 15th & 16th place corps ever 16. Spirt - Vastly improved in just about every way. 17. Pacific Crest - also a step in the right direction. Some nice musical moments 18.. Crossmen - this show just didn't do it for me. Hated the arrangements. 19. Mandarins - A show with some real highs & lows. Some great moments, though! 20. Teal Sound - great to see & hear such strenght in horn lines in this scoring range 21. Jersey Surf - just didn't like this program after a nice, innovative debut in World Class the previous year 22. Pioneer - Best show from Pio in years 23. Cascades - good to see them back on the field Just my personal opinions, and I'm always a bit biased to the music side of things. Harvey

This is hilarious to me. I put this in the same category of people who freak out over a 5-10 dollar cover to see a band play in a bar. A night out with your friends is likely to top a 100 bucks easy and be half as fun with a hangover at the end of it, and lets face it, 63 dollars is for the best seats, pretty sure there are more affordable ones if the cost of 3 large pizzas is going to break the bank.

I'm guessing you didn't or wouldn't go to the website to see what you got for the money???? Lets see: VIP $63.00 These are the best seats in the house. This VIP ticket includes: an extra-wide seat; a seat cushion; preferred parking; program book; lanyard with a VIP badge; and a fabulous pig roast BBQ dinner with beverages before the show! Dinner is from 5p to 6:30p. Let's see - the reserved parking is about 30 yards (at the most) from the entry gate. (check) Food IS included. The pig roast has been a hit for years. (check) Program book. (check) Souvies (seat cushion and lanyard) (check) I'd say a place to sleep and transportation is your ONLY cost at VIP level. .....and VERY FEW SEATS are at the $63 level. MOST are $27 or LESS - with no frills and very good FREE parking. IF you chose to spend just $17. WHERE would you find anything close to this lineup for $17?