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They should do well in Independent World in Dayton

Donate or don't. If ever there was a thread that needed to be closed, this is it......

I can no longer watch this one-person crusade silently. Stu, you articulate your values very well. Why do you only apply them to some people and not others? Mr. Morlot was kind enough to post here, and admit that there were staff bills not yet paid when he retired. We have no idea how many such bills there were, how long they went unpaid, or what the amounts were. Why do you give him a pass, while holding Bob Gupta to a higher standard? And what happened to those staff payments? For all you know, current Bushwacker management may have avoided multiple legal actions by prioritizing those payments over the loan to Mr. Kapp. But it is easier to jump to conclusions based on a few Internet postings that only tell part of the story. Yes, there was a huge catastrophe. The 2011 corps had very low membership turnout. New management took over in May. The corps doubled in size after that, but was still much smaller than normal. The 2012 corps showed more growth, but was still smaller than what Bushwackers were fielding prior to 2011. So here comes Stu, demanding in Donald Trump style that management be fired. I fail to see why you even ask whether there was a catastrophe, though. After Revolution had their story appear here last year, you were the one saying that all corps should have enough money in the bank in advance to cover the entire year's budget, including contingencies for unexpected catastrophes - or they should go inactive. Why should Bob Gupta plead his case to you here, just to get that response? I just hope that the rest of us reading your baseless attacks on the current Bushwacker administration are even more motivated to help them out as a result. If so, justice served.

The corps placed 13th in 1980 and we didn't see them in World Class Finals for 28 years, until 2008. That is not going to happen this time. The corps is financially solid, has great management, a superb staff (either being retained or coming in), and is used to being competitive at a quite high level. I expect to see a number of corps slipping out of Finals and making it back in over the next several years. There is so much quality out there that fewer corps are "shoe-ins" anymore. And corps that aren't in Finals are pushing those above and below them to continuously get better. It's an exciting time to be a drum corps fan. Blue Stars will be back in Finals. Don't know when...but they're sure not going away.

Stu and everyone, PLEASE can we STOP this?? When I left the corps it was in desperate need of members. Bills were being payed BUT time was running out QUICKLY for the corps. The way I ooperated the corps and how I payed bills was feuld by a certain amount of membership each year. When the membership shrank from bad to worse I was planning on folding the corps, Selling all the equipment and paying ALL the remaining bills and staff bills and retire. A group of alums and staff approached me with a plan to take over the corps, Help pay a few personal bills in my name and try to salvage the corps for the 2011 season. We agreed on everything and the rest is history. The monthly payments on the brass loan was figured by a certain amount of tuition paying members to keep everything current. As many know the Bushwackers have fielded 2 season of smaller size corps, THIS is why things have turned out this way.PUT THE BLAME ON ME, PLEASE and lets move on. Let the corps to continue to ask for donations without all of this finger pointing, Its not fair to me, Dave Kapp and Bob Gupta to have to keep reading all of this "stuff" on DCP. I can tell you that the pledge drive has done wonderful so far and I urge EVERYONE to donate if they can. The alumni have steeped up HUGE for the corps to make sure Dave Kapp is payed asap and the Bushwackers can continue on for a very long time. PLEASE let the "conversation" END and let all the parties involved make it right. PLEASE Jay Morlot ps, I have retired from the corps and im enjoying the time with my wonderful wife and GREAT daughter and son. i have no interest in anything Bushwacker except to lend my advice and help the corps as any 31 year alumnus should.

The person who posted that comment lacks basic math skills.

Syracuse Brigadiers. Gave $$$,$$$ to Magic of Orlando.

Absolutely awesome!

Oh yeah... Putting Bluecoats in the top 3. Disaster.

""

just his rep as the "watchdog" of the activity. funny hearing lots of stories about other corps issues, but Stu isn't out there tilting their windmills

I thought it should be mentioned that all corps should take notes from Brad Furlano on how to handle a staff change announcement. I don't know who is going to replace the departing staff, but as long as a member of the Furlano family is in charge, I have confidence that the Blue Stars will be fine. Z

There is no doubt competitively they could do it. BUT, they should make sure they are financially sound. They have been smart the last few years to do their little tour in Washington/Oregon, take 2 weeks off competitively, and then go to championships. This obvioulsy shows they know how to handle what money they have, and probably won't move up to World unless they are certain that it is a smart move. At least what I think.

I may be reading between the lines of KyleB post but..... I think what he is trying to convey is that the Stadium in Rochester was less than ideal. It was a in a horrible neighborhood and the sound was horrible if you were anywhere outside the 40's. Rochester is and was a great city to have a Venue. DCA and the City did a lot to make us feel at home there. After dealing with the nazi death squad brown shirts in Scranton... Rochester allowed DCA to flourish and party like rock stars. In Rochester they did not care if you came in and out of the gate 100 times. In Scranton you had to purchase a new ticket if you exited. In Rochester you could have open containers up and down the street. Forgetta bout it in Scranton. Rochester was and is a great host city but they need to find a real stadium if they expect to compete with Annapolis which seems to have most everything going for it.

Harrisburg ran the mini show up until their next to last show. Larry brought the mini's in to draw more people for the Sat. Night show and that couldn't save it. Should I be like you and say that nobody would pay to see "Alumni Corps"? Fact of the matter is, Drum Corps in general does not draw like it use to and most people can't afford to go see it. With the line-up that Larry use to put out year in and year out and the Show still couldn't survive....doesn't that tell you anything? Do you think the "Alumni Spectacular" would even exist if it were not sandwiched between the Semi's and the Finals of Championship weekend? My point is, that the majority of people would not pay to see any type of Drum Corps, not just Mini's

The helmets were not a good look - but I would enjoy something closer to their original look

I belong to an alumni Wind Ensemble at Rutgers University. Last spring, representatives from the Bushwackers did a recruiting presentation during one of our rehearsal breaks. A lot of members who are band directors were there to hear about them. They also set up a table in the lobby where the RU student Brass Band was having a concert. A lot of Rutgers and local HS students in attendance found out who they were. So I can testify that they are actively recruiting. I just donated a little via Paypal. A friend of mine on FB said they are halfway to their goal. His kids are in their kids guard and drum groups.

Grumpy, You made some very good points--I just don't understand why the premium seats didn't sell out. I also don't understand not having 15,000 fans in the stands. Scott Smith

A close 2nd to the (in)famous "I'll show you later" from that Cavies tenor during the 04 theater broadcast (oh...how our audience HOWLED when he said that!)

since sullivan has been at blue stars, the blue stars had one of my top 3 favorite music books every year (except this last one), I hope he lands somewhere else, it will be a shame to not hear his stuff any more. same goes for kevin ford, I would love to see his designs somewhere soon!

If there is no high cam, then this isn't a recording of the "show". It's vignettes of individuals within the show. Give us the SHOW

Excellent point. Say the show causes fans to leave. That is a definite reaction. Therefore, the show is very effective? Say the staff claims the show was intended to cause fans to leave, and they did. Therefore, the show was very effective?

It worked in the 70's. You don't get 2nd place at DCI finals by having crooked lines. At least not back then.

Oh and btw...I gave a few $$. I've had personal funds on the line to keep a corps going...I know the pain. I don't want to see Bush go under. At times I have hated them ( aka lost lol) and at times beat them, and other times loved them ( and lost to them too LOL). good luck Bush, and Dave I hope you get every penny

Instead of watching from the sidelines, he redefined the sidelines. Everyone knew about Mr. Moto.

Not quite "unnoticed" but I loved the "Mr. Moto" idea in SCV's '06 Moto Perpetuo show.

What Jay said. Honest to God, this activity really cannot afford to lose another corps. So any of us who can help out financially in this case should at least consider doing so. I also almost can't believe that this thread turned into a "Blue Devils bashing/defending" topic for a while.

Not that you're partial or anything. ;)

They should do whatever they think is smartest for them. For me, I just hope they keep performing at the level they are.

And before Stu makes his next post about how all the reasons he won't donate which take the post into further off topic and how we really could care less about his opinion... Have you donated???? In Stu's world, the world revolves around him, and for some reason we should spend so much time on only 1 persons opinion rather than everyone out there and their generosity to help a struggling historic DCA corps. I encourage anyone to just ignore him. Some facts about the Bushwackers: The first show they ever won was in 1986. It was the DCA World Championship. They won in 1986, 1988, 1989, 1990, 1992, 1993. 1993 was an undefeated season. From 1986 until 1991, the Drumline never lost a show. Their 1992 Prelims performance is highly regarded as one of the best performances by a DCA Corps ever. Up until last year, had performed in every DCA Championship, including their first season in 1982.

They would have been 2nd. It was a great design. A challenging design, that they achieved very well for the most part. Would have beat Crown, because Crown never achieved their drill. Some one said something about 2005 Cadets in 2006? I think they would have blown everyone out of the water in 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012, 2013, 2014,,, well you get my point. I wasn't too fond of that show the first time I saw it in Allentown. But OMG I love that show. It is awesome. And it is the best COMPLETE package The Cadets have ever put together. Actually the best complete package any corps has EVER put together. That show was ####### clean too. I don't know. They were great in all captions. And IMO were more effective than any BD show since then. Especially the visual design. And that ballad. OMG!

You can prove that all of those "pages upon pages" are DCA corps members? (Hint: You can't) In fact, a LOT of the posts ripping BD (specifically) were fans of the corps that they were beating (especially Crown and Cadets... this I CAN prove). "Many drum corps alumni" =/= the Bushwackers or other DCA corps. Your arguments are misguided and spurious. I saw a great many DCA jacket at several DCI shows this year. That's REAL support of DCI. The posts of some individuals on a marching band website are not indicative of the beliefs of the fan base as a whole. But you know what? You are entitled to your opinion. Too bad your closed mindedness will keep you from enjoying another side of the drum corps world.

Maybe it's just me, but I'd much rather see the Cadets pull out "In the Spring..." and "Ballet Sacra" and do a 20-year tribute to THEIR 1993 show.

End of SCV '99, the drill is actually an A and a V, in reference at Art Velarde, (sp?) a member who was unfortunately killed in a car accident before the season started.

The Y-pull! Love that move. Wish they would incorporate that more often. Also wanted to mention Cavaliers 2001, Four Corners. They use all 4 corners of the field, and when they rotate a box, the members on the four corners of the box rotate the opposite way and end up on the corner opposite of where they were before. They do this at least 3 times that I'm aware of. Hmm....what else...Oh! Look at my avatar. Star 1991, when they did the cross to cross, right before they finish forming the last cross, it *almost* looks as if that transition was supposed to make a star for a split second while merging into the final cross. If that is true, then that's genius. Those final sets were put in I think like very close to the end of the season, so I don't think they got it as clean as they'd like to have gotten it, so it may very well be what I mentioned. I also really love when a corps makes a certain shape or set while still moving into another set. The above would be a good example of this. Those are really hard to find in any given year, and when you do find a good one, it's like wow. Certain drill writers for the Cadets have been very good at this. Also, in the Blue Stars' show this year, during the ballad when the corps does the footwork, moves like 4 steps, then does more footwork, moves another 4 steps or so, with the bari/euphs in the middle and the rest of the brass outlining it, the outside brass kinda like "tighten" the group in the middle, as if they were slowly enveloping them - I think it was supposed to have signified the part in The Matrix when Neo digs his hand into Trinity's chest cavity, pulls out the bullet, then grabs her heart and starts it again. That is what I have gotten out of it, anyway.

Hey, I interviewed that bug ten years later for a "Where are they now" segment on DCI.org. His name is Percy and after a stint in the Green Berets, he ended up graduating from University of Kansas with a degree in business administration and went to work with Chase as a financial consultant. Last I heard, he retired to running an Italian ice kiosk at county fairs in Texas.

Only one real Red and Black... Even Freddie knows that.........Lmao..Love Ya too Bro..

if you have a spare dollar. Donate. It's worth it. Losing another corps in the activity. Is not really acceptable. Especially a corps with this history. I know NO ONE involved wants anything bad for the corps. But people do need to be paid back.

Since you asked what I would say to others (for those who are going to blast me for making this about me it is not about me, I was asked my opinion) Tell the BOD: a) Immediately, today, right now, fire the person(s) responsible for making the final decisions for the organization; whomever had final call on axing the payments but decided to go to championships needs to be held accountable because they ran the corps into the ground in one-year where as Jay apparently ran it above reproach for 25-years; even if it is the full BOD and the current director, dump the ones who do not know how to run a business. b) After the formal firing(s), ask Jay to be an interim director for x-months so as to stabilize the situation and bring back immediate credibility to the organization; if he does then make a huge public appeal, with complete transparent honesty, seeking financial help (accepting the fact that the equipment still might be liquidated); if he says no to that interim offer, then the organization should immediately go inactive. c) Within those x-months while Jay is the interim, or while inactive, secure a person who has ran a business successfully in the black for many years as a director; if that does not occur in the allotted time period the organization goes, or stays, inactive. d) After securing that person, make a second formal appeal to the public concerning the firings, the restructuring of the organization, the securing of real business people, and then seek donations from others as an appeal to pay off the remaining court settlement so that the corps can progress into the future. Either a-d, or fold the corps.

And its "Bushwackers.."

All, As "The Creditor" and as the "Past Administrator" in the factual and rumored matters under discussion in this thread, I will attempt to provide some clarification. 1. This is indeed a private matter between me and the Bushwackers 2. Any implied involvement of the Windsor Regiment in this matter is total falsehood. It is inflammatory and totally uncalled for. They are not involved in any way shape or form. The Windsor Regiment will not benefit one penny from this situation. 3. There is no personal animosity involved here. This is the final phase of a business transaction. It is me trying to protect myself financially within the US legal system. 4. The terms and payment schedule for my loan to the Bushwackers were determined in order to conclude all payments this month (September 2011). At a rate that would close out the principal and all accrued interest to date. (Just under 3 years) 5. The terms and schedule were set within boundaries that I could support for that term, not longer 6. The past Bush administration, Mr. Morlot, was very good about making payments on the loan. 7. Regardless of the condition of the Bushwackers organization, they found themselves in a position making it difficult to continue payments 8. I do NOT have the flexibility to extend the loan at a minimum payment level and accrue additional interest for another 1-2 years. This information was shared with the current corps director, Mr. Gupta in 2011. By myself and by my personal lawyer. 9. If I was a financial institution I would have been forced to move into foreclosure on the loan in October 2011. 10. Payments ceased after a 1/2 payment in Sept 2011. 11. My personal lawyer attempted to move things forward, from August 2011 through early 2012, but a resolution did not occur. 12. At that point my lawyer informed Mr. Gupta that our next step would be to move into litigation. 13. A litigator was retained in early 2012 and my case was drawn up and sent to court. 14. All subsequent actions were handled by the courts or Middlesex or Mercer Counties in NJ. According to their schedules and protocols. The timing of any court actions is totally out of my control. 15. I have had to carry the balance of the loan for almost a full year, plus the additional interest on the full amount of the remaining principal 16. Even if I receive a lump sum payment, I am still on the hook for thousands of dollars of interest, because the principal amount is at the ceiling for this type of a "Special Civil Part" court case. 17. Any other past or legacy financial matters or old debts to individuals, businesses or organizations, involving the Bushwackers are not part of this court case. My previous administrative position with the Bushwackers did not include the power to resolve any matters of this nature. 18. This is not a vendetta against the Bushwackers organization, as some folks have tried to paint it on Facebook or elsewhere. This is business. 19. This is not a vendetta against any individual(s) past or present from the Bushwackers. Again, as some folks have tried to paint it on Facebook or elsewhere. This is business. Respectfully submitted, David Kapp

I will have to agree with those who say Bluecoats. I downloaded the San Antonio and prelims soundtracks and the difference between the two is amazing. Not only did they have a great musical book, the worked to improve it. The same is true with Crossmen, I also agree with those who give a thumbs up to SCV. I also think Boston Crusaders did a commendable job with their horn line this year with a book that was not easy to perform and Spirit had some moments that reminded me of 1978-1980 when Spirit was the guilty pleasure of so many fans. I think Cadets deserve credit for making basic music rather challenging and Phantom has to be given credit for performing with both finesse and power what may have been the most challenging score. I've seen a few people mention Pacific Crest and that is a fun show and the switch styles back and forth with ease, or at least what sounds like ease. I would also add Oregon Crusaders to the list and add that Oregon Crusaders are more than ready for World Class competition.

Bluecoats or SCV. Some really consistently good hornlines from them that really don't get much attention. (Outside of 2007 and 2009 respectively). Now if we're talking over-rated horn lines, I can think of a few to put in that category....

Troopers Pacific Crest Glassmen Bluecoats

I would definitely say Bluecoats.

Having played at the Dock twice on Thursday, with Minne-Brass and with MBI, the idea of doing a mini corps contest there troubles me. Minne-Brass fit on the stage with a certain amount of room left over, so it's conceivable that VERY limited drill could be accommodated. Okay, we tweak the gig expectations so the mini corps don't do a bunch of movement. More notes, louder music, cool. From the performers perspective, no sweat. The far bigger problem with doing mini corps at the Dock stage would be that the area available around the stage isn't even NEARLY big enough to accommodate the size of the crowd that shows up normally to watch the mini corps. I'm thinking about the size of the crowd that was there watching Thursday night, the various trees and obstructions that blocked off A LOT of views in that area, and comparing it to the size of the crowd at the contest Friday night. I don't see any way that that number of people can jam into the stage area and have anything like a satisfying listening or viewing spectator experience. I'm sorry to dump cold water here, but I truly don't see the Dock stage as a satisfactory performance space for the kind of crowd that typically wants to be there for mini corps. Perhaps if the parking area right next to it were cleared out and THAT space was set up? I could see that maybe working. Put up a stage on one side, and bring in a bunch of chairs?

Don't think Leon is going anywhere either BUT...if he were, Gaines works closely with the major players on the Crown design team in the winter...

It's been a week and a half since finals, and I decided to wait a while to start this thread, to give myself more time to reflect on the entire season. Is it just me, or was this the most unusual season since DCI started 40 years ago? In the spirit of 93 Star, we had one of the more controversial shows of the season with Blue Devils. Kind of an odd show musically and visually. I personally am hoping this is not the direction BD is going to keep going in the future. They have always been one of my favorite corps, but it didn't seem like this type of show really connected with the audience, although the judges seemed to eat it up. Then we have the Cadets who performed of all things. Christmas music. Nice performance, but it was so hard to get into a show of this nature. Then we have 4 corps this season who performed music from Phantom of the Opera. This includes Music City who had one of the most unusual musical books I have ever heard. The kids performed it well, but most of the people around us were like what the heck??? Then we had the Cavaliers debate of what in the world happened to them this year, even though at the end of the season, they had a very nice show. Over the last decade we have had so many people criticizing them on how every show sounds the same, and one year where they try something a little different, these same people are complaining that Cavaliers just aren't the same. And to top it off, on a year when they seem to be having an off year, 3 different corps play music that is usually associated with Cavaliers. That includes Blue Knights, who had another one of the more unusual shows this year. We also had an unusual year, where a corps not even placing in the top 17, was one of the crowd favorites. Jersey Surf had an amazing show this year, and it was so nice that people who usually don't pay attention to corps placing out of the top 8, actually giving up the love for a corps whose placement 2 years ago wouldn't have even made semifinals. Another example of a lower place corps really seeing love is the Colts soloist for All By Myself. I have never liked that song, but the Colts version this year was amazing. How often have you seen a corps who is placing 17th, and their soloist gets a standing ovation with almost a minute to go in the show. I am not sure I have ever seen this happen prior to this years finals. On the disappointing side, we had 5 corps that didn't even make it to Thursday and Prelims. I might be wrong, but I can't remember a year where that many corps folded, or ended their season early, since either the late 70s or early 80s. And then we take the smallest corps during finals week, Blue Saints tackling Phillip Glass Canyon, and surprising a lot of people with a decent performance of it from such a small corps. Then we had several controversial placements, with BD/Crown, Blue Stars/Crossmen, and Oregon Crusaders/Troopers. I think the biggest shock was Crossmen making finals over Blue Stars. I really loved the Crossmen show this year, but really felt Blue Stars had a better performance on Friday night. And most of the people around us that week were really pulling for a Crown upset, and wondered how Troopers ever beat Oregon Crusaders. And people were split on Blue Stars/Crossmen it seemed like. I think most people were happy for Crossmen, disappointed for Blue Stars, and just thought it was kind of odd how such a big deal was made before Blue Stars even performed their show. It almost seemed like it was set up that way. It also seemed like there was more talk of finances than normal, probably due to the 5 corps ending their season early. And just when you thought that would be the end of weirdness, someone on DCP actually had a problem with DCI having a live blogger during the live shows, and questioned Michael Boo's bias. I have read so many articles by Mr. Boo over the years, and almost laughed out loud when I read that thread. I have never found Mr. Boo to be biased, from what I understand of his live blogs, which I did not read, he just writes about what is going on during the show. And never once in the many years of reading his columns, have I ever heard him say something like, "That corps was simply dreadful, their drill designer/musical arranger should be shot", which are comments I have heard in the stands. He doesn't necessarily favor any corps, and a good portion of what I have seen him writing, is very similar to my own views on a lot of shows. But I think my favorite of the unusual things this summer, was the amount of appreciation shown for the lower placing corps. I think I heard more compliments for non finalist corps than ever before. Jersey Surf, Colts, Mandarins, Oregon Crusaders, Pacific Crest, Academy, Glassmen, Vanguard Cadets, and Blue Devils B all had great comments/response from the crowds, and on DCP. And for the first time, the lower placing corps are finally getting some well deserved recognition. So what did you find kind of odd or weird this season? And can you think of another year where it has been this unusual?

07 BD....near the end when they're forming that block coming at the sideline from an angle...every other line is out of step...on purpose. A very risky move with the pants stripe.

Gynormous Buggus???