Leaderboard

2007 Cadets was probably the best example of how to ruin a drum corps show using vocals.

Unless Sky comes back :tongue:/>

Ok. But is there any evidence to suggest that a younger membership wasn't inevitable anyway? Empire claims to have had their youngest corps ever, and most rookies since 1983, in 2012 with G bugles and no amplification.

They should come up with an entirely new 'business structure' if there are plans to bring the corps back.

Drum Corps International is proud to present!! Teal? Doesn't sound right to me. They should come up with an entirely new name if there are plans to bring the corps back.

I have no desire to return to Rochester to watch championships. Not saying I won't, but it would have to be a really good year for drum corps for me to go back there as a spectator. I absolutely hated it there as a performer. Only thing that did make me miss it this year was the temperature the weekend of champs. Rochester was in the low 70's while Annapolis was in the 90's with massive humidity.

I'm trying to figure out why someone would walk away from DCI c. 1997. Phantom had won the previous year with a beautiful Shostakovich show, Blue Devils were still very much in the mainstream, Scouts were going strong, Crossmen made top six for the second time... who could leave at a time like that?

My questions is still what passed & failed at the DCA Rules Congress meeting

The cost of participating especially for the younger participants typically relies in the disposable income of their parent(s) and/or guardian(s). Mom and Dad have no additional dough, no one is going anyplace........either to perform in a show or attend a show. And the same holds true for those of any age; but more-so in the evaluation process of a parent and/or guardian when the family budget has to be taken into total consideration. I'm quite sure everyone looks at (or should look at) "value"; inasmuch is the participant getting value for the "investment" (that's government talk for spending). Is value an uplifting positive experience where it's also affordable, the participants are well fed, travel and lodging taken care of, etc. Or does value come from having "keep up with the Joneses" expenditures placing a larger burden on the participants themselves; because it will be a "shared sacrifice" from a bulk of the membership to a lesser segment of the membership. The performing arts activity is (especially now) in a highly volatile financial atmosphere. We have multiple corps (all sectors; DCA, DCI, Alumni, etc.) asking for donations of all sorts from meeting basic budgetary expenditures to even get on the field in 2013, to saving equipment from a creditor, to paying for repairs, to getting new uniforms....and it never ends; it never will..........the intensity may lessen given which way the economy gives it's push, but the needs of some sort will always be there. Most every corps, at one time or another, goes through a rough time (or two, or three, or four)...that's the nature of the beast. But.......... What is value? Maybe offering more meals as part of the privilege of membership, maybe putting the corps membership up in a reasonably priced lodging facility rather than a gym floor, maybe offering bus service rather than carpooling for a gig or two, maybe a nice season ending banquet at no cost to the membership.....what are the participants going to remember, what are the participants (and the parent's of the younger participants) going to appreciate? Examples such as these type of things.........or an electrical outlet?

now that Michael Gray is no longer as prominent a voice on the staff I bet it will be less artsy

I don't blame electronics for the death of corps and exodus of fans. I blame electronics for MY exodus.

Drum and bugle corps was long past "relevant" by the time field competition was organized in the 1920s. That was the charm of it all. Crowds were much larger back when drum corps was like you describe.

They said under-rated and outside of the well known ones in the OP. Madison has always been known for smoking horn lines, no one can question that.

Well yea but what about here on the west coast? We don't get to see regionals and only get to see a handful live in june. It might not be as good as live but if you hear it on my vintage stereo you would still be impressed at least a little.

And THAT is, frankly, what scares a lot of folks.

Yea, we're alike in that thinking. No chance I'll go to Rochester. None. I'll happily buy the best seats again in Annapolis though, and enjoy 2013. After that, it's the live stream until they go anywhere not calle Rochester.

Yup...not the departure I was hoping for...well said. BTW..how can this be a drastic departure with so many people posting this has Bluecoats written all over it...

"Roller Derby of the Century" "A Third Chance" "Spartacus and Juliet" "Between Angels and Hopkins" "The Devil's Stair Lift" "15 Minutes of Fame, Part 2"

Richard Saucedo - Brass Arranger Michael Sharpio - Guard John Mapes and Ian Grom - Percussion Tim Fairbanks - Drill Fred Feeney - Program Coordinator That's quite a team. Lots of WGI experience with percussion, drill, and program coordinator. This is great news! http://www.bluestars.org/story.php?story_id=665

I wish I could up-vote this more than once. I absolutely agree with Kyle on this. Unless I become associated with a corps in 2014, 2013 will be my last as a Championships spectator for a while. man, I loved Annapolis, and can't wait to sit in the same prime seats as this past year.

i find it curious that DCA will be going back to my home town rochester. with the stadium in such a bad area and all the corps complaining why would they go back the last year there i understand DCA made no real money and attendance was down. as far as amps go. well let's just say an era will be gone. DCA is now going to move into something else. but i'm not as progressive as most in drum corps any more. so my interest will be even less so except that i will follow the scores as always but it just won't matter to me. it has changed to much for this old timer. it's for the young just as in my day the old timers felt like me now.

I cannot wait to hear the announcement of the show for 2013!!

I can not remember exact year. BUT, I can tell you "Phantom Regiment" to this day is one of my Favorite Corps. Along with the Madison Scouts. Both every Yesr. (I do watch the Vidio's) Then for some reason I can not figure out, The Cavaliers the year they did "Machine". I am disabled and have to sit low and, all I get to see and hear is the Pit. Then also the Cost of tickets for bad seats does not help.

But Fran, they use G BUGLES don't they? How could they possibly be in tune and so melodic? (tongue firmly in cheek) I agree, they wouldn't win, but they would definitely entertain the h--- out of the PAYING audience, which, in my mind, is not being done too frequently these days. Even my beloved senior corps, yes SENIOR corps ( I don't dwell on PC ) are becoming very boring lately ( read as too DCI for my taste, but that's just MHO) Haven't had a "goosebump moment" in years. Ray

I could live with that. I'd sell a goodly part of my soul for Crown to play it, then. :) Mike

Purchased new 2 years ago, only used for one project then, and sitting in the drum closet since then. Some scratches on the up tubes where the drums attach, and it's missing one of the wing bolt tighteners for the forward support bracket, but that should be easy enough to replace (and the stand is perfectly functional without it). $150 new at most online retailers, this one $85, shipping to anywhere in the lower 48 included (or $70 for local pickup in the Chicago area). Any questions, lemme know.

I know just being a smart ### on a dreary Monday.... Didn't think you were taking things THAT seriously but couldn't resist.

And if it came down to a good old fashioned drum corp donnybrook, they would be the only corps trained in hand to hand combat!

Suncoast Sound doesn't get mentioned here too often, their hornlines in the mid-80's were fantastic.

I'll be honest - I'm agnostic to the change. It's being done thoughtfully and carefully (and amidst MUCH discussion, from what I hear), and the approach taken was the most conservative of the options offered, by far. When I look at the problems offered by amplification, three things stand out - nasty synth goo and horn part doubling (which is just pure, unadulterated ######## IMO), annoying/intrusive use of sampling and/or voice, and managing the mix. The first two of those problems are completely precluded under the rules option that was eventually chosen - in fact, there were two options that I saw before the meeting, one conservative and one more liberal (synths, etc) and the directors made the adopted rule even more restrictive than what was proposed as the "conservative" version. Good for them. The mix issue to me is best exemplified by the SCV 2004 DVDs - one of my absolute favorite brass books, and when I popped in the DVD I couldn't hear the brass over the pit. Ugh. That was, IMO, growing pains. The guys who would actually implement this at the staff/design level have done this for years in the marching band/WGI or even DCI communities by now, and they know what needs to be done to get the proper sound. I wouldn't expect a lot of experimentation here - just expect some more expressive playing from the pit. Yay! Can we all agree that teaching kids to play more musically, and with a proper characteristic sound and technique for their instrument is a good thing??? And that gets me to the good part of this. What we risk is some doofuses screwing up the mix here and there. What we gain is, well, actually, it's a lot. The kids who have been taught the proper way to play the instrument don't have to learn new (and BAD) playing habits when they shift to a DCA corps. If you don't think that affects band directors being willing to recommend DCA corps to their kids, well..... I want some of what you're smoking. I had one director tell me, with a lot of passion, that he spent almost ten grand on new mallet/keyboards a year ago, and in the course of just one season they are all but destroyed. At the same time, he can find a full up system to mike the pit for $5-7,000 that will last for a decade, and will allow his kids to play more expressively and not hurt themselves or the expensive equipment they currently bang the #### out of. Yes, amps are actually seen as a way to CUT costs... DCA takes a position of being more able to readly accept former DCI corps into the fold when appropriate. I'll refrain from editorializing that point too much, but I think you gather what I'm saying. Position DCA to be flexible enough to pick up any slack if need be. Really, I'm personally of the opinion that they took the wisest road here. They're not allowing voice, and it appears that they actually removed voice from the original proposal - and GOOD on them for that. They don't allow sampling, or synths, or any of the other things that I personally HATE about "modern" BOA/DCI pits. They're just saying, "we don't want to teach kids bad habits, which hurts recruiting, and damages our gear." Seems wise to me. They also gave the corps staffs time to thoughtfuly implement this instead of just rushing into things a'la DCI when it came legal (ugh - that year, just - ugh). It was GOING to happen eventually, and it's happened in the best way it could have - and with pretty good timing, too, I think. We'll see. A note about George. Lots of folks have told us, he wasn't in the room for ANY of the talk about rules proposals, nor did Cadets2 submit any rules proposals. Even if he had been there, the vote wasn't his to cast. Personally, I think he probably just got bored with the whole meeting when they didn't hang on his every word during the morning session and bagged ### to go tweet and facebook some stuff.

All my ranting and bias aside, this is my realistic list. 1/2. BD and Crown- They're both amazing and, with the addition of the west coast tour for Crown, it should be a toss up for the title. 3. Cadets- They'll field a #### good show, especially with their repertoire this year. However, I don't think it will get them on the same level as BD/Crown. 4. SCV- It should be another up year for Vanguard. :) 5. PR- Phantom will be Phantom. 6. BOC- The crusaders crack the top 6 after two years of serious growth within the organization. 7. Bloo- Coats will field a kick-### corps, but show design and rep will hold them back. 8. Scouts- They're hungry to be an elite corps again and make babies take flight. 9. Cavies- They'll struggle again in another rebuilding year. 10. Bones- Crossmen are glad to be back and don't look to be departing anytime soon. This is where it gets interesting. 11/12. These two spots could go to just about anybody. BK is down, but is it enough to put them out of finals? SOA is kicking ###. Stars were really close last year. Academy will continue to build with Andre Feagin. PC supposedly has a large number of vets this year. Glassmen is retooling in the wake of crushing debt, but also has many vets coming back. Even Colts or Troopers could sneak in. (Not a knock on those corps, but they're just down IMO) If I absolutely had to pick, it would be: 11. SOA 12. Stars/Glassmen/Academy/BK (It'll be a tight race.) My wish list: 1. Crown 2. SCV 3. Bloo 4. BD 5. PR 6. TOC 7. Cadets 8. Scouts 9. Bones 10. Stars 11. Glassmen 12. SOA

You forgot the rest...."and if it doesn't...PAINT it!"

Don't we all wish they WOULD??

Please allow me to crawl out of the box into which you have me stuffed. Sure, I competed in the days before the pit existed. My last year of competitive drum corps (1974) was the first year in which keyboard instruments (carried) were legal on the field. I will admit that I was not too fond of hearing some of my soprano lines doubled by the tinkling bells. The keyboard usage has come a long way since that time and I think that it often adds a nice texture and counterpoint now. My point is that it is counter and not the point and I believe that over the decades the keyboard instrumentation has become overemphasized to the point that it is planted front and center and now following the DCI model will be further empowered to overtake the primary acoustic presentation. Of course, it all comes down to what you think a drum corps show is all about and for me it has been the beauty and awesomeness of the loudest acoustic presentation in existence. Amplification has turned it into something else entirely. If that makes me a Dino, so be it. I play in a lot of different musical settings, often with woodwinds and indoors, but for me drum corps has always had this special corner on the musical market and amplification diminishes what is special to me.

They are too busy texting and websurfing at shows.

Excellent. And what an impressive thing for him to do. This is reflected in the 2009 and 2010 990s where Compensation of Officers, Directors, etc shows that Mark Arnold was listed as having earned $39,667 in 2009 and zero in 2010. She's probably the one who deserves the thanks for letting him follow his passion. I'd bet he'd say the same. In addition, Mark was awarded the Bonfiglio Chairman's award for 2012. Stout.

Hopkins was there but not for the vote, if I read correctly on FB. And he's not the Director with the vote. Rich Hammond is. Soooo when Bush proposed it LONG before C2 even existed, was Hopkins behing that too? Starting to feel that we have an X-Files conspiracty going on here...Or maybe the vote occurred on the grassy knoll?

Then stop playing music that has dissonance in it...simple I am tired of squinting and wincing during musical statements...I want to have ears and eyes wide open most of the time with most of the drum corps music presented. This clip doesn't feature any ground breaking music...IMO.

The point of amplification is not that you never play at full dynamics. It's that you don't have to just to be heard. Parts can be played with the appropriate technique, dynamics and musicianship and still be as present as they need to be to achieve the desired effect.

The Northstar Youth Organization, the parent company of the Dutch Boy Drum Corps of the past, is coming out with an 80 member unit. The MARCHING BAND will be called NORTHSTAR BAND, using all the instrumentation of a marching band. Although the alumni are disappointed with this move, it is in the best interest of the kids in the community.It keeps the kids in the community busy and it gives the city their own band.

*looks at 2011 BD during the big shout in "Say a Little Prayer"....notes the person on the vibes POUNDING the keys at around the 6:57 mark of the vid. Very end of 2011 Cavies...yep....pounding away. There are certainly other examples. Remember the argument that amping the pit would mean players wouldn't have to pound their instruments into the ground for their part to be heard and contribute?? Remember also when the allowable size was increased, so more corps added brass or drums....thus drowning out the amped pit? So...now you add more pit instruments (I counted 10 LARGE keyboards at one point) in an effort to counter the larger brass/battery...some of them miked (Really, BD??? You need to mike a guy who's parked near the sideline and already screaming a double C???)...you can't turn the amps up or you get distortion...so the only thing to do is to whang the things harder.....which kinda defeats the original purpose of amping them. If you have 10 large keys in the pit, they're amped, and the players -- even at the very top -- still feel they need to beat them to death....there's something wrong here. When it's a soft horn passage, an exposed key passage, etc and they can be heard normally, they CAN....WITHOUT BEING AMPED. Amping, then increasing the wind size, and thereby forcing the keys to he heard over THAT, even with amp assistance, renders irrelevant the orchestral technique argument used to approve amps in the first place. It's happened in DCI....I see it happening in DCA now. Sad.

You can hear us because we're playing up to our ears. This will finally allow us to play with the musical touch required for today's pit books, prevent unnecessary damage to our instruments (and our bodies), and have a much wider range of possibilities with percussion sounds that DCI has been able to achieve since they added mics (but have sadly moved away from with the use of synths...). They went just as far as I hoped they would.

"What is human life? The first third a good time; the rest remembering about it." -Mark Twain

Assistant Director of Crossmen announced the 2013 opener in their November 24th Saturday Night radio broadcast (listen beginning @ 32:00). http://www.spreaker.com/page#!/show/the_crossmen_show_aka_bones_hour The Prophet's Song - Queen

C'mon, man, Cadets 2000 was happy music! I loved the Christmas show, the music AND the theme. And the 2012 Blu-ray really makes the show come alive, MUCH better than all the low level stuff previously available on the VOD from FanNetwork. But I digress. First of all, George Hopkins is the bomb. NO ONE in drum corps at his level has the communication and openness that GH has that involves the Hard Core fan. There is no one else like him, he is one of a kind, and I applaud him for his openness. Second of all, if I were to sit in on his staff meetings THINKING UP all this stuff, my contribution would be limited to sitting there in silence, dumbstruck with awe. The concepts are so far over my head, that's why I go to shows, to take in all that that is being offered. Most of us drum corps fans from the last century have always said that Medea lost in '93 because it was so far ahead of it's time, and we have occasionally wondered if a show like that would be competitive in today's drum corps. I guess we are about to find out.

Sounds good! Please George - don't wreck it with stupid, unnecessary audio clips again, OK?

The Life and Times of the sound board guy

A prequel to 12.25: "Black Friday"

They should do well in Independent World in Dayton