Leaderboard

This video brought tears to my eyes ... The Blue Devils Special Needs Winter Guard. They are fantastic! PLEASE READ about them, and WATCH the video on this page: http://bluedevils.org/programs/wg/2013/special-needs.php I am SO proud to be a part of the Blue Devils organization.

What no SCV props? How about the Scheherazade tent? the chair for the Phantom of the Opera shows? the tunnel for the famous change of corps' pants mid-show? etc., etc. You may want to rethink that statement. And yes, I realize that different staffs did populate at different times. Same corps however.

Any and every retreat. All. Those. Kids. Making Music.

I'd argue that the better your musical education is, the more aggravating you find the current WGI/DCI arranging style. Grownup tastes can actually stick with one piece of music for more than 30 seconds before hitting "next" on the iPod wheel.

So, where did all the UNIFORM money go?

I disagree with you... IMHO The Renegades were humble and accepted their punishment... Then a rogue person unfortunately connected to the corps started running his mouth again. That is the point where I decided to distance myself from the organization. Whenever THAT person runs HIS mouth... He hurts the organization. It does however seem that now that, that person blew themselves up (again lol) because of thin skin regarding DCP that The Renegades are now headed back to a positive place. As long as they can keep the fox out of the hen house and not allow stupid arrogant people to speak for them... They will be just fine!

I agree 100%.

The uniform money will go towards uniforms.

Hi everybody. I recently heard about Renegades not fielding a competitive corps this year, and thought I would read the press release here on DCP. So here I am, the guest appearance. Voila. The antagonist for the plot. The bad guy for the scene. You don't have to read much to see many misconceptions and inaccurate statements. For clarity, let me just say a few things, none of which will violate DCP guidelines. First, my time with the Renegades in 1999 through 2008 was one of the greatest, most fun and most creatively rewarding times of my life. I worked with some of the most talented people I have ever met, and the fun we had and chaos we caused was the zenith of my time in drum corps. I wouldn’t trade those unbelievable experiences for the world, including another DCI ring. We were rock stars. Just like getting the phone call that the Renegades were out of DCA, hearing about this season and reading the comments on DCP are not fun for any alumni. Personally, however, I think the Renegades will be around for the next 100 years in one form or another, so I never read this press release as an obit. Looking far back, the mistake I made after the 2005 season was to simultaneously try to pursue an entertainment career in Los Angeles and a drum corps career in San Francisco, when I found that both of which required a full-time in-person commitment to succeed. It was not fair to the Renegades to miss camps and try to run the corps from afar, and it was not fair to my film colleagues and career to miss festivals, screenings and events because I had camp. There was no way to make the two work, although I tried. I eventually made the decision to move focus on film. If I could have figured out how to make a living running a corps, the evaluation might have gone differently, frankly, but I’m not George, never was able to figure that out. No disrespect, Hoppy. To clear up some misconceptions, please note, I was out of drum corps during DCA 2012. It was after the Renegades got suspended and the President accepted the punishment from DCA that I got a phone call to try to reverse that. The then-President correctly points out in emphasis that he was not at DCA 2012. This is true, but the absence is also the problem. It is not a good thing to be absent from the biggest weekend of the year if you’re running a corps, and I have a profound appreciation of making this big mistake myself. When chaos happens, the leader should be there. As for the missed apology that is routinely suggested on here – Jeff did apologize on behalf of the Renegades in writing. Then I did as well -- my efforts then went to multiple phone calls, and about 48-hours of sincere apologies, an offer to make a public apology, and offer to pay fines and anything else that would resolve this situation for the Renegades. I failed to convince anyone of anything, and here we are. I know a lot of you disagree with my methodology or penchant for speaking out vigorously to the point of belligerence on behalf of myself or others. I am not here to apologize for that, that’s a skill set, and a course of action deliberately taken only when all other efforts failed. I am here, however, to tell you I deeply, deeply regret getting involved in this DCA-Renegades situation at all from Day 1. I accepted that call for help out of my love for a corps that I helped get off the ground, and my primary creative outlet for over a decade. Unfortunately, I had no idea the hornet’s nest I was stepping into, and the price I paid for getting involved was too high. I accomplished nothing for the corps by trying, and apparently lost many drum corps friends along the way. I certainly didn't gain any, as you can see. I did get a headache, if that counts for anything. To Gil Silva, Glenn Johnson, and any of my drum corps friends who found themselves on the opposite side of my efforts to keep the Renegades in DCA, I sincerely apologize for stepping into the situation, I should never have gotten involved, and I am very sorry that our friendship was affected and/or destroyed. I wish you all well and hope maybe we can be friends again sometime. To DCA corps and participants – Start supporting one another or the activity will economically fail. To the Renegades – I think the Michael Jordan quote Chris that started his press release says it all quite well. In hindsight, I think the true answer for the Renegades after DCA 2012 was not to go full speed ahead and venture to Europe, or to fight DCA. In my unsolicited opinion, I think the Renegades simply need to find that comfortable warm happy creative zone, where everyone is having fun doing drum corps and loves hanging out together – whatever the gig is, and no matter how many people are there. That’s why the Renegades started, and that’s why I know the Renegades are not done – the corps is bigger than a DCA weekend, it's never been about points or trophies, it's been about the people. Once you get a drum corps in that amazing creative family zone, we once did with two (2) horn players in the arc, the rest will follow quickly, and it will stay fun on the way up. You’ll get there. Lee 7

I admit that I cry too much at drum corps, so I'll just list the top moments from the last five seasons: 2012- the last minute of the Cadet's show 2011- Madison's entire show, especially the end 2010- Phantom Regiment leaving the field 2009- Crown's reappearing company front, the Blue Stars' ballad, and the last two minutes of SCV's show 2008- the last minute of Phantom's show Here's to tears in 2013!

I didn't attribute disloyal to you. I merely referenced your post listing 10 drum majors who switched corps. That said, you certainly implied a lack of loyalty on the part of these DM's with the questions: You can dance away from the implication citing Socrates all you like. In this medium it's incumbent on the writer to be unambiguous. Sure we all fail at that and perhaps this is a case in point. But the obvious conclusion to such a leading question is the notion that those DMs lack loyalty. (And yes OP stands for original post/poster depending on context. As for profiles, what's that? (ie not many really read them. your posts are your credentials here :-)

Cadets Crown Phantom for me. No one else has really stood out. Cadets 07.... holy ####.

Is it just me or are these gigantic logos in the center of the field encredibly distracting? I am aware, for example, when I drop a bunch of cash to catch DCI Championship week in Indy that Lucas Stadium is home to the Indianapolis Colts but trying to block out or overlook that huge helmet, dead center, is a lesson in futility. Now I'm not suggesting we perform our unique art form on a totally blank canvas (after all, it's awful handy to have those hash marks to manage today's complex and intricate drill designs) but I think we deserve better. Is it inconceivable to find a way to conceal this eyesore? Possibly with a mild, washable, paint or a removable powder to match the field color....SOMETHING!

Who's goin'? Watcha playin"? Bridgemen debuting our 13 book- "Free", "Duke" ( Sophisticated Ladies and Don't Mean A Thing"), "Theme from 'Summer of '42", and "Favorite Things". Who will I bump into at the after party?

It was de rigeur to repair to the St. Alban's Diner after every Queensmen rehearsal for snacks and stories, after which somebody would drive the great one to the Subway or Grand Central so he could catch the train back home. One evening, he placed the folder containing all of St. Catherine's music on the roof of the car to take off his overcoat before getting in. You can guess the rest. When the group arrived at the station the mishap was discovered. The corps members wigged out over the loss of all the charts and what a disaster this would be for teaching and cleaning the music. "Naa", said the man, pointing to his temple (with the finger he always reserved for cueing the French Horns). "Don't sweat it. It's all in here".

I am all for mending fences, building bridges and whatever other correlation you would like to draw. That was a very nice, well thought out and heartfelt post and I appreciate you exposing your humanity. Who knows if fences will ever be completely mended Lee, But THAT post from last night was beautiful in both intent and execution. Bravo Lee!

school bus, with original seats and no modifications

THANKS!!!!

What he said!!! This is one of about ten such units nationwide sponsored and taught by various groups. I have seen one at a show in Florida one winter and another one in Ohio. The CT Tigers often give exhibitions at the various MAC championships for MB and winter guard. The BD group seems wonderfully advanced (of course!) I am imagining the patience and diligence of those who teach and the courage and perseverence of members and staff. I like the silks chosen too. First class designs.

Dale, I'm planning on taking still photos and digital audios of all of the performances and as much video as I can. (limited with amount of memory and my video camera doesn't allow adding more...) I had my son with us at the Dixie Stinger last Saturday (my son, daughter in law and grand daughter live in the Baltimore area) so with his help we had more hands. He did the videoing and I had photos and audios... (I'm sure there will be others videoing)

As long as C2 does the flag toss to the DM, I'll be happy :-)

If it's not one of those Bubba Watson hovercrafts, then I don't want it.

For me personally, nothing can compare to the moment on the field when the reunited Star of Indiana serenaded the age outs of 2010 at semi's with "When you wish upon a star", my son happened to be aging out with BD and was standing right in front of them. The SOI members had tears in there eyes as well. What a moment.

LOL, and my first thought was Sky.... Westshore had a lot of youngin's, nothing physical but yelling with obscenities back and forth was the norm when things got tense. But... that's the way we handled it so by the end of the day no hard feelings as long as the corps got better. "What the #### are you doing? That looks like ####" "What the #### am I doing wrong?" "You should be doing....." "Oh... #####... sorry".

As always, eloquently put.

Hey everyone. i am in my 10th year with the Renegades. Yes I am still involved and working hard to get the corps on great footing for the future. There are some others that are working hard as well and where you can state your opinion if you wish. there are folks that really have worked hard for this corps over the years. All of these negitive commits about a subject most of you know nothing about hurts people. I would like it if you would just e-mail me personally. and let's stop this thread. those of you who gave are efforts props...... Thank You very much it's the drama we can all do without. ( i'm afraid that it is beginning to be alot like the junior corps I marched with) not being mean spirited here

yeah Ed, like DCP was Renegade bashing when they blew the doors down in 03-05. Get real. DCP was a virtual ReneLoveFest....with good reason

How did it not work Keith? Easily their most "not the norm" shows.....03-05...had them in the top 6. Most of the shows that followed, while fun, had design flaws and performance issues that led to placements lower than the top 6. In fact, were it not for a penalty, they were sniffing top 3 in theyears I singled out. As for corps in the past...well...the game has changed. Society has changed. What was once acceptable, tolerable etc is no longer. Playing the "well BITD card" further kills your argument. The game changed. maybe others did, maybe others didn't....none of them got caught if they did.

No argument from me re those who leave during the middle of a season. That is the height of disloyalty. Nor do I doubt your experience and observations. And I think your standing message to MMs is spot on. But your OP did not say "If someone wants to march with the same corps for multiple years, more power to them." Maybe you meant to convey such a thought, but all I can go from is the the words on the screen. Your OP said something different, something that characterizes those who remain with a single corps as bitter, lesser talents. That is a brush too broad.

There are plenty people with mind set that if you leave, you are hurting each member you marched with. You are hurting the corps. That is one less vet to give that extra consistency that might give you that extra tenth to move up a spot. or whatever else. I know there are people who are VERY against corps hopping. I know some staff members who were very vocal about it, and took it personally. For me? I don't know. In my marching experience.. I could understand why someone would want to go somewhere else. If I marched the past couple of years in my corps, why would you want to leave that? But still... I can't get mad. I wish people would stay... but ya know what? You have to give them a reason to stay. Obviously if they want to leave that much the corps: admin, staff, didn't do what was necessary to make you want to stay with that corps. Yes it is hard to compete with Crown, BD, Cavies, SCV, Phantom, Cadets. But you have to have to work on raising the level of your product consistently to get people to stay. These corps can't move up, because their product is not consistent, or just not fun enough to march there. I've never marched in finals... but knowing people who have marched in finals... they say semis can't even compare. It's an awesome experience. The crowd is huge for the first corps on, and the energy is great. And within the top 12.. ya know it probably gets old finishing between 7-9 EVERY YEAR. Yeah it's not all about placement... but for some it is a big deal. Not everyone is in it for the great experience and bus wars. Humans love competition! I guess to sum it up, I love corps loyalty. But I can't expect everyone to feel the same way as me about my corps. Everyone has different experiences or they want different experiences. I wish you would stay, but seriously have a great time! See ya on tour!

It's okay all... YEA! can do NO WRONG!

I have to agree with this---wholeheartedly. At 53 years old, it would be easy for me to sit back and judge today's members. But, I have the luxury of knowing many of them. As a group, they are more musically capable and athletic than corps members from my era. Still, they have a great deal in common with those "legacy" members with whom I marched. Dedication, perseverence, and work ethic all come to mind. I am the first person to criticize today's youth in general for being too shallow and tech-obsessed, but by the very nature of drum corps, this doesn't apply to drum corps members. They gladly give up constant cell phone/texting/facebook to spend hours every day in the hot sun, and many of them spend much of their winter actually working hard to be able to pay for the priviledge~ As to the specific reason why kids corps-hop, I suspect that it is an individual choice. Boston generally loses less than a handful of kids to other corps each year (with 2008 being the exception due to an entire management changeover). All each corps can do is provide the best experience possible for their members. For the record, BAC lost 5 kids to the 27th Lancers in the winter of 1980, because those kids simply wanted to win. Then, BD won. Did those others have regrets? I have no idea, but it makes the point that corps hopping is nothing new.

Concur. People are looking for some common thread. I'd wager there are 10 different stories for each of the 10 MMs mentioned by the OP. The attempt to impune the character of today's marchers (by describing them as disloyal) is at best a cheap shot. I suspect most (all?) of the people taking these shots are limited to sitting behind their PC and occasionally showing up at a local contest to ##### and moan the entire time , never interacting with current marching members at all. If you're around the kids AT ALL you'd know that what's truly great about this activity is still alive and very well thank you. DCP at it's finest (again).

Some people aren't satisfied with stagnation, mediocrity, or simply being comfortable. Some people want to excel, and maybe be the best in the world at what they do. They may have reached a point where they want to learn from different people and get a different corps experience. This isn't restricted to drum majors, obviously. It just describes a few reasons why people might want to switch corps. It's not now, nor has it ever been a "loyalty" issue. People that call others disloyal are usually disgruntled because they were left behind.

Phantom is know for everything though

I'd probably have to say phantom and their fleet of buicks.

As of two or three (forget which) weeke ago the show was less than 100 seats away from a sell out IIRC.

when phantom regiment won at the 2008 championships.

How about a MMA cage match between judges and DM's right after scores ?

From what I received (but I don't know the York area) The after-concert PARTY will take place at the Victory Social Club at 471 S. Ogontz St in York, PA. Here are the directions you'll need to get there: Take a LEFT out of YSHS parking lot onto Hollywood Drive At the bottom of the hill, there will be a "Y" in the road, follow RIGHT onto Ogontz St Go thru the traffic light (when green) and proceed almost 2 blocks to the Club on your RIGHT There is a parking lot on the right side of the Club, where the entrance is located, and another lot across the street from the club The party will begin at 10:00pm and run until midnight. There will be ONE keg of beer provided by the Lancers along with snack foods (chips/pretzels), but the kitchen will remain open until midnight for anyone wishing to purchase sandwiches, etc. (very reasonable prices) There will be a "cash-bar" for those not interested in drinking beer, or who would prefer to order wine or mixed drinks. NO CHARGE FOR ADMISSION. This is designed for the participating corps and their guests.

Same here, Mike... I agree. Some year I'd like to see a ballad in which the drum line plays, and the horn line sits out.

John, My source is the Marriage Center at the University of Wisconsin for one (Dr. Sweet's office tracks the numbers each year, state by state, and offers an annual report.) My doctorate (with the research done in 9 countries including US and Canada) is in the field of marriage preparation as education. I am presuming by your reaction that you are not a certified, licensed educator at any level and have not attended the many, many continuing education programs hosted by most supervisory public school districts discussing the life horizons of current student populations. Check the programs available to admissions officers and campus life officials at the post secondary level. It is you who are proposing a moral view. I am merely stating the sociology. You may react negatively in offense, but the sociology at the university and post graduate level consistently backs my statement that the divorce rate and loyalty rate have the same chronology. Almost no university accepts Wikipedia as a dissertation source due to its porous entries. Me thinks the lady protests too much, to quote Shakespeare. I am merely citing that the current cohort age cohort who populate

As one who was a secondary school administrator who helped win the Federal Blue Ribbon at two schools where I taught, I had a great hand in choosing new teachers. Resumes are a tool but so is the great distinction between depth and width. Running from unit to unit (width) to list various instructors who have taught me (as in the "I studied under" citations) never quite matched the depth of maturity and development of character aspects necessary as a music ed teacher. That so many young music ed teachers bail on the vocation within a few years is not coincidental. To develop persons and programs from fledling rookies into champions is tougher than ring-chasing for sure. Unfortunately, too many are seeking the jewelry and not the character development that is requisite and hopefully comes in time, like mastering the scales first.

Last shows - Star 93, Suncoast 89, Freelancers 94 ...

Not sure why, but that moment in Crown's '09 show when the entire corps is still and we hear "Somewhere" being played from the synth. Gets me every time!

After all the complaining about the 21 limit over the years, I am a bit surprised not see a single comment on the the new expansion to 25? Sure is going to help. That is a BIG space for such small groups to connect with. A few extra players is going to help.

Will be in the seats (darn it)... and just got this in the email... 6:05 - 6:25 - Reading Buccaneers 6:30 - 6:50 - Reilly Raiders 6:55 - 7:15 - Park City Pride 7:20 - 7:40 - BSGK 7:40 - 7:55 - INTERMISSION 8:00 - 8:20 - the Bridgemen 8:25 - 8:45 - Hawthorne Cabs 8:50 - 9:10 - Westshoremen 9:15 - 9:35 - Lancers Alumni 9:40 - 9:45 - Combined Horns on "Never Walk"

Or..........."the majority is always wrong!" :tongue:/>

I don't understand why crowd excitement should be the conclusive measure of whether a corps is good or not. The volume and type of chord a show ends with is much more indicative of how a crowd will react than whether what they did was "good" or not. I think there is much more to drum corps then ending a show with a company front, marching in half time, and playing at a triple-forte. Will that get a big crowd reaction? Sure ... but we can be more creative than that, can't we?

I think it would be a travesty if we lost the unique brilliance of the Blue Devils. I understand that some hate them, some don't like them, and that they aren't "crowd pleasers". I would have to say that I dislike more fo their shows than I like (though I loved their 2012 show). But ... what is with people wanting to force everyone into a little square box? I think what they are doing is edgy and brilliant. Losing innovation in drum corps would lead to the death of DCI quicker than anything the Blue Devils are doing. Don't like it? Then listen to someone else until you do like it. The Blue Devils are GOOD for drum corps. Variety is GOOD for drum corps. If their style isn't selling, it will change ... eventually. But you don't grow by rejecting innovation. So dislike them all you want, but don't try to force your tastes on everyone else.