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Showing content with the highest reputation on 01/12/2020 in all areas

  1. As each of you travel back home, I want to express my gratitude for your restraint, and decision not to approve the latest proposal to include marching woodwinds at this time. As I see it, Drum Corps International has seen too many fundamental changes, too fast. Recent changes to amplification, movement, uniforms, set pieces, and judging have placed more than enough on your plate for the time being. Add in concerns over funding, housing, performance rights, broadcast quality and reach, etc. Frankly, each of these items still need work. Particularly the amplification matter ! Better to fine tune/conquer matters already in hand. Now is a time for focus, stability, and calm. Much appreciated.
    27 points
  2. DCI is considering this weekend whether to allow a current member corps to go on tour this summer or not, in part because they’re carrying hundreds of thousands in debt. Anything that puts financial pressure on a corps to keep up with the fill-in-the-blanks in order to stay competitive is part of that process. In terms of bringing staffs into the budgeting process, many if not most WC corps already do that. The problem is that OTHER corps’ staffs aren’t part of their budgeting process, so what feels like no big deal to the Blue Devils’ budget might be a significant strain to Phantom Regiment’s - but PR is in a situation where they realize they have to keep up in the hardware race or suffer some consequences when the judges tell their members that they’re not competitive because their $200,000 sound system sucks in comparison to someone else’s $350,000 worth of mics/speakers/amps, etc. It’s why I said that financially impacting rules changes should be considered by ALL players - instructors being ONE, but not the only, group to evaluate the changes early in the process.
    9 points
  3. And I’m hoping you do the same in 2022
    8 points
  4. Here’s a crazy idea. We’ve read over and over that the addition of WW could only possibly raise revenue if the corps size is increased. Well, how about increasing corps size Without adding WW. Since brass players are being turned away today, I presume the activity can accommodate more brass players. Therefore running with the logic that more MMs = more money (not a theory I endorse but running with Kathy Black’s logic) would that not also increase revenue? Adding WW does not have to be a prerequisite to increase in max corps size. TA DAH!
    6 points
  5. They also have a worse idea of what the financial impact is on their organizations than the people who have to pay the bills. Changing the guard sheets will cost the corps and DCI $0. That's the type of change that falls into the purview of instructors, and the types of rules changes that they should be focused on. Changing rules that require the outlays of tens of thousands of dollars for corps in order to stay competitive with each other is not in the interest of the activity. If they want a major change like that, it should only be undertaken after a thorough review and analysis process that includes ALL of the players impacted, including Board members of the member corps and Exec Directors, as they will, in the end, be the ones most impacted.
    6 points
  6. And there we go again. If there is only one thing we learned this past week, it is that the WW issue transcends age demographics. Even the marching-age group opposes the idea. It would be an enormous miscalculation for anyone to continue holding the stereotypes you characterize in this quote. Why? What difference does it make, anyway? As you would be the first to remind us, the average fan lifespan in this day and age is allegedly only 3.5 years. At that level of retention, who cares if the fan is 16 or 60? What does matter is the depth of their support. How much can they spend? How much will they spend on drum corps? Will they volunteer? Do they have local connections and influence that can help find show venues, housing sites, places to rehearse? Do they have even higher levels of skill, expertise and interest that you look for to populate the BoDs of the participating corps?
    5 points
  7. 2021 - It's only 4 woodwinds in the pit 2022 - it's only a saxophone octet featured in one number 2023 - it's only 19 woodwinds instruments, but the pit's too small, so they're on the field 2024 - we can't hear the 20 woodwinds, they all need to be mic'd. Oh, we can't afford to mic 20 woodwinds? Maybe we need to .... 2025 - increase the size to 200, so we don't have to mic the 50 woodwinds 2026 - hmm....our summer budget jumped $220k last year just because of new members, and there aren't more people in the stands, and now we're broke... That, by definition, is 'degrees'. 😎
    5 points
  8. The instructors shouldn’t, by themselves, be able to pass out of caucus rules changes that have financial impacts on drum corps or DCI. If it’s going to incur additional expenses that will necessarily be passed on to the corps or the members, the adults in the room who have to actually pay the bills should be part of evaluating those changes. Those who are already making unseemly amounts of money designing the shows (and then using their DCI credentials to soak band boosters for even more) should stay in their lanes and create within the financial boundaries the adults put in place. Now that it’s done, can we just say that Ms Black’s proposal was embarrassingly under-considered, to the point where, were she still in law school and presented an argument as weak in a classroom setting, she’d be laughed out of the room. Next time before she stands up and acts as the guts of some corps directors or staffers who are too afraid to propose this on their own, she should at least try to come up with an argument for her proposal that isn’t based on suppositions that bear no relationship to reality.
    5 points
  9. But you’re not privy to anything.... 🙄
    4 points
  10. Entitled? Never said I was entitled to the info. On the other hand, DCI is not entitled to a favorable public response to their WW proposal - unless they can make a credible case for it. And to do that, they might need to share some of that data analysis.
    4 points
  11. But it is not just "legacy fans" that oppose the idea. Even the age-eligible kids (even the WW players) came out vocally against it. Sure, we could discuss age. But more often, people bring it up to discourage discussion. And since no research was presented with the proposal, or even alluded to, I cannot say what data DCI might have. I know they can parse survey data by age groups. But have they asked survey questions about woodwinds? Who did they survey? Are they extrapolating other data (i.e. revenue) that is not traceable by age?
    4 points
  12. In fact, NEAR DEATH EXPERIENCES are often an opportunity to take stock on where you went wrong, such as with amplification, mega pits, trombones, props, over production, emoting, prancing show choirs, et. al. Retailers of laser lights and theatrical foggers are no doubt disappointed that the next logical step won't be taken just yet. All those lost sales - oh, the humanity! Yes, thank you for propping up, at least for a little bit longer, the wall between drum corps and marching bland.
    4 points
  13. Well considering you’re wrong about everything you post I won’t be holding my breath
    4 points
  14. Increasing the size of the corps (brass guard and percussion) while leaving out the inclusion argument doesn’t fit her narrative. However she made a great case that anyone can become a lawyer.
    4 points
  15. Expect a request for sources to support the analysis, a plethora of statistics, even then they may not be viable. There needs to be a collaboration of data. Or so I’ve been told! 😉
    4 points
  16. I think the general consensus from current marching members (granted that's only 5 people this coming season) was that DCI is only DCI sans-woodwinds. I still feel like it's the same as it was in the 80's when I marched, which is to say "If you want to march DCI, pick up an instrument that's part of the existing ensemble and put in the work to learn it." I don't feel like that's a prejudice. Things have rules that make up the framework of the activity. If you play american soccer, you don't use your hands (unless you're the goalie.) If you want to use your hands, choose a different sport or gain the skills necessary to compete within the context of the activity. I would like to think that most kids who would have the skills to march at the DCI level would be able to pick up a new instrument fairly quickly and work their way up into a corps. The kids now seem to have pretty high skill sets already. Just my opinion though.
    4 points
  17. I would be even happier if a rule was put into place to forever ban them and preserve the basic core activity, but I’m ecstatic none the less. Thank you directors. P.S. Woodwinds can always create a series with no brass to make those brass players jealous.
    4 points
  18. And a way to keep instructors from adding more expense to the activity is to have them participate in the budget process. Many schools are finding that saying you have “X” dollars, spend it wisely leads to waste. If instructors have wild ideas, they should be asked “how do we pay for this?” Very often when this is done, more economical solutions can be found.
    4 points
  19. My kid is of DCI age and will be marching this summer. The friend circle, which includes both brass and woodwinds, was opposed to adding woodwinds. In fact, the woodwind players were more gung ho about learning a brass instrument to audition than just adding their own primary instrument.
    4 points
  20. it would from adults, not from instructors, for the same reason that 12 year old boys would never voluntarily turn down the opportunity to have unlimited budget for their toys. 😎
    4 points
  21. Well, in the Scouts thread we have our undies in a bundle over “female drum major” or “majorette” and settled on - call them all “drum major”. In that same vein we are all “fans”. Leave it at that.
    4 points
  22. Well I asked about facts and you told me if I’m not with a corps it’s none of my business. Also I have not called anyone insulting or childish names so don’t use that as an excuse in your previous response to me. I also never questioned the leaders motivations but if that makes you feel better with your non-response so be it....
    3 points
  23. plastic clarinets sound disgusting even if stanley drucker is playing one. wood clarinets that sound good are quite expensive, and they tend to crack quickly, badly, and often when they're outside, particularly when humidity changes are involved. that's a lot more important to me than the reed problem. instrument techs would spend a lot of time dealing with pads for all WW's as well.
    3 points
  24. There are a number of units here in the UK who refer to themselves as “Performance Ensemble” rather than D&BC i still take issue with the I in DCI however given it is nigh on impossible to watch shows legally outside the US.....
    3 points
  25. Now might be a good time to email them directly with thanks, using the list of addresses provided here:
    3 points
  26. Efficiency means you maximize your existing resources. So, if you have empty seats on buses, that's pushing up the per member transportation costs because you can't lease 2/3 of a bus or 2/3 of a driver. Food is the other major cost, The cost of chicken patties for 150 or 200 will be about the same, but if the food truck is maxed out in capacity for 150, then going to 200 means you need a new food truck, more people to prepare e the food, etc. By its very nature drum corps is limited on growth. Only about a quarter of stadium seating is sellable. Nobody wants to sit in the away stands or the end zones and out side of the 30's gets to be less desirable. So Lucas Field Stadium has seating capacity of 63k-70k. I believe that DCI reports three day attendance totals rather than daily totals. Maximum number of seats that are sellable on a given day would probably be around 16-17k ballpark. I believe that lines up with tickets sold, so I don't think that increasing size will lead to more finals tickets sold, maybe some more regional tickets sold. Perhaps more relatives wanting to attend finals would mean more demand for the tickets and you could push up prices maybe $20 each and that would lead to an additional $1 million in revenue. But there's a whole lot of maybes in that "analysis", but it's the only path that I see much meaningful additional profit from adding additional members. As a business model, drum corps really doesn't make sense and I think that's evident that it's dependent on donations, both monetary and in labor, and bingo to balance the books. The business is selling instruments, uniforms, show design, and arranging music. It's like when my daughter was doing competitive gymnastics, the business wasn't cheerleading, the teams mostly broke even but they had to take gymnastics lessons which was where people actually made money and a few of the larger competition organizers. The goal is increased revenue, but you need to weigh increased costs. I will defer to the wisdom of the directors who obviously know the issues and have run the numbers. If they vote for larger member size, I guess they feel that they will increase revenue without increasing costs too much, maybe they're trying to provide an educational experience to people that they have to cut now, maybe they think that a larger corps size will make rising OC corps less of a threat and cement the top 10-12 in place because they'll be the only ones that can recruit 200. Maybe it's a bit of all of those.
    3 points
  27. “Coffin corner” at the old Meadowlands stadium lol
    3 points
  28. Woke up today... the sun was out, the Earth had not spun off its axis. Looking forward now. To the CFP championship game. After that, whatever. LOL
    3 points
  29. The logic seems to be that since some things change, therefore there should be no limits on other things that should be allowed to change. Seems overly simplistic to me. I like a more nuanced approach - step one: know what your identity is, know who you are and what you’re about; step two: consider changes that support step one and can be done with financial responsibility. Changes that eliminate your identity are dumb to consider.
    3 points
  30. That was ripped up at Franklin Field so it never left Philly. It’s probably long gone from the South Jersey landfill
    3 points
  31. Ya know you can be cool when not being rude
    3 points
  32. Let me put this in a way currently being debated in our country. The idea of adding even more expenses to an activity that has expenses spiraling out of control is like Socialism. It's sounds like a great idea until you run out of other peoples money. Oops, I started a political arguement.
    3 points
  33. Interesting. I've run into that in some ways even at my very young 48. But mine is specifically for the fact that Britt is 29 years old. We ran into exactly what was stated here at a place which shall not be named (Yellow Deli) where the waitress basically said "This really isn't a 'your dad' kind of spot." Well guess what kid...I ain't her dad. Most of the coolest people I know are my age or older.
    3 points
  34. Was that a “Pelosi clap”?
    3 points
  35. You might be surprised by the enduring value those walk-always represent. These are not the type fans who participate for the 4 years their kids are involved, and then move on. Many of the walk-always will be “lifers” with money to spend. The ill effects of this move won’t be seen right away. Please indulge as I send all of my Best Wishes to a dedicated, longtime fan and poster, xandandl, who is battling a serious illness.
    3 points
  36. hey you're the first to cry foul, so live in glass houses....
    2 points
  37. And this is definiitely an activity that the cost increases exponentially for every person added to corps, and aside from housing issues. So then they will start screaming for more revenue.
    2 points
  38. The entire discussion was not centered around legacy spending, only a portion of it was. Perhaps people, myself included, are hung up on the nouns you use to make your point. I’m not here to tell you what to say but I will tell you how you say it offends people. Your response? “Whatever”. “Careful, Rude is the word of the day.” Really? That’s the best you can do? How about adding “pompous” to the word of the day? Treat others with a bit more civility and it will be returned in kind. Pfft. Kinda sums it up
    2 points
  39. Jimmy's in North Jersey, with a nice view of the Pulaski Skyway.
    2 points
  40. There's far too much logic in this statement. This is the same in generally every industry that exists. Ideas generally cost money and I've found that ideas that don't cost money, generally don't get much traction and even when they do, they are short term solutions with little true impact. I remember as a very young instructional designer sitting in a big office in Atlanta with Bernie Marcus and Arthur Blank talking through some Tier 1 training for their first Home Depot call center concept. We had a great plan (we thought,) but when the question came to "how much will it cost? Who is paying for it and what is the impact," I didn't have those answers. Welcome to project management 101...the hard way. DCI is a business...plain and simple. And to put an idea out there without being able to show proof of concept is just plain silly IMHO. There...I'm now ready for the 'Ok Boomer" comments...even though I like 25 to 30 years too young.
    2 points
  41. Do you have examples of corps where the instructors’ requests have bankrupt the corps? If this has happened, the problem is not instructors adding unnecessary items to a budget, it is leadership allowing it.
    2 points
  42. I just didn't want to leave it there forever. Easily found online, but why make it super easy for bots that scrape forums?
    2 points
  43. I'm so glad I marched battery. All of this talk of embouchure, horn angles, valves and rotors and such just makes my head hurt. I'll keep my hunchback and hands that look like knurled tree limbs from playing on kevlar as long as I don't have to learn to count past potato. You guys had too #### much to think about.
    2 points
  44. Was going to do something similar and then I realized all I had in the fridge was a left over bottle of Korbel...you know...the Schlitz Malt Liquor of Champagnes.
    2 points
  45. I’ve been supporting the activity for decades. I don’t need your validation.
    2 points
  46. Pros: I wasn't looking forward to hearing woodwinds in drum corps. Cons: Those threatening to stop following DCI will presumably continue to post on DCP.
    2 points
  47. Any Instrument Policy has failed!
    2 points
  48. If "WE" were still in this mess, "WE" would stop coming online complaining and actually try to fix the problem. But instead, "WE" come on to this site and b#tch and complain. Stop saying "WE" when you really mean "they."
    2 points
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