Leaderboard

I get that people are mad and upset. But the - she got what she wanted - they got their pound of flesh- stuff is ridiculous. What “she wanted”, I’m pretty sure, was to not be sexually molested. And then have to live with the stigma and victim blaming over the past 40 years and even up to this minute. So, yeah, let this be a warning to all those corps that still exist. DFTK. Perhaps this is the message that’s needed. Have you corps received it loud and clear??

All organizations take on the attributes of their leaders. By the time the cancer was diagnosed in 2018, it had long since metastasized. It is incredible the corps was able to survive another 6 years in retrospect. Make no mistake, this is not some random arbitrary incident from 40+ years ago that has unfairly taken the corps from us. This is a sick, rotten culture that finally caught up to itself. It's even sadder that along with this terrible culture of abuse, hazing, emotional trauma, physical trauma, and sexual assault came innovation, incredible performances, extraordinary education, life-long friends and family, and literal magic on the field. I think that's why it stings so bad. It's all of those things. It makes for a messy grieving process for us, especially alumni. The good can never erase the bad. That doesn't mean I don't get to cherish the good. I do and I always will. But i'm not blind. I was there. This was inevitable. It doesn't matter how old demons are. They stick around how ever long it takes for there to be a reckoning. Sometimes the reckoning is fatal.

Sigh...I've seen many drum corps fold over the years. But this one is a real heart breaker. Thanks for the memories, Garfield Cadets. Where ever the winds blow me until that last day I will always remember watching the Maroon & Gold take the field over the decades. It was an honor to see this corps live. Many thanks to all the alumni out there who worked so hard and thrilled audiences all over the nation. The memories this corps gave us will last a lifetime and then some. Peace!

Former marcher here. I work in Torts for a living and have for 22 years. I’m the administrative guy, the paralegal attorneys hire to get everything done. I have NOT done tort work in New Jersey and the rules vary from venue to venue. However, the general processes and meanings are identical from state to state for how they tend to go forward. To provide context for the discussion: 1 - DCI "Answer to Complaint" - do not read much into this response. All Answers to all Tort Civil Complaints are exactly the same. You generally answer a hard no to every allegation set forth against you in the complaint, even if you may reverse or concede later. This is a timely filed required document and that's all. The real nuts and bolts of DCI's position will be laid out in their discovery responses to the Plaintiff (Answers to Interrogatories, Production of Documents), and none of those will be available online as the Court doesn't want discovery documents on file - they are too voluminous. They can only store so much at the Courthouse/records departments. 2 – Notice of Dismissal against Garfield Cadets: Actions against a Defendant don't move forward unless that Defendant has been formally served the appropriate papers of the lawsuit in question (a Writ of Summons to Court, and a Copy of Complaint/Lawsuit are required to be served on the resident agent for companies/non-profits, etc.). A notice of dismissal due to lack of prosecution is generally issued because the Court has no proof on record that the Defendant has been served the paperwork. The Courts won’t let a case exist in limbo against a Defendant, so per the rules every “x” amount of days, the Court will give Plaintiff 30-day notice that they intend to dismiss the Defendant in question because there is no proof/affidavit of service filed with the Court. Plaintiff usually has 3 options in response to this: a. Let the 30 days expire and the Defendant in questions will be dismissed from the suit; b. File a Motion with the Court showing good cause as to why the Defendant should NOT be dismissed yet; c. If the Plaintiff has exhausted all avenues of potential service and it is appropriate, file a Motion with the Court for some form of alternative service on the Defendant. At the end of the day it’s possible they can’t serve Garfield Cadets since technically it no longer exists. Lord only knows who the last listed resident agent for service of their non-profit set up was (or if they are even still alive), so they may be flat out "un-servable" at this point. This potential dismissal is for Garfield only, not the entire case. 3 – The Plaintiff in the Cadets suit is likely incurring zero attorney fees at this time. Plaintiff Tort Work is done on a contingency fee basis and the average around the nation is 1/3 if you can settle short of litigation (the filing of lawsuit) and 40% if you file a lawsuit. At 40%, if they recover $10,000 for the Plaintiff, the attorneys keep $4,000.00. If they recover $0.00, the attorneys get $0.00. Because math. All torts are inherently risky for Plaintiff counsel because it can never be guaranteed an attorney will get a fee. From a standard auto accident or slip and fall, to a medical malpractice case, this is the reality of the nature of the action against CAE/DCI right now. The Plaintiff attorney has to pursue every potential avenue of recovery (money) to do their job appropriately AND to get paid at the end of the day. They leave no stone unturned, and if there is no blood to squeeze, there will be no recovery and the attorney makes nothing on the case. 4 – For a tort, in settlement or in judgment, insurance is what pays Plaintiff 9.99 times out of 10, usually in lump sum fashion. I would wager that the attorneys for this Plaintiff did not know the realities of the dead-end they were facing when they took this and filed suit, nor could they. They would only discover them as they moved along the process. If they are doing it right, they are methodically exhausting every avenue of a potential insurance policy that could cover the damages (example - DCI being added in). My office flat-out does not bother to pursue claims where we know there is no insurance because there is no point. Again, it's blood from a stone. Sue me for a million dollars and win, you’ve just wasted time and effort. You will literally never get it, even if you garnish me through eternity (garnishment is a HUGE PITA). Some cases eventually turn out to have zero route of recovery and in those cases, we don’t get paid per contract. Again, all tort involves risk from Plaintiff’s attorney side. 5 – Defense counsel for torts do not work on contingency. They bill hourly rates. When an organization is sued, they turn the paperwork over to their insurance carrier and per their contract of insurance, the insurance company assigns an attorney to represent them. The insurance company usually pays all costs associated with the Defense including the hourly rates and costs. The org being sued is usually not paying the legal fees themselves. They may have their insurance premiums increased, but outside a few outliers under the rules, the org’s assets are usually not directly on the hook if they have the insurance. 6 – Speculation: this particular case against CAE is an instance where the org likely is having to pay out of pocket and any assets are potentially on the hook as a result. When CAE was established it would have purchased the required liability insurance. However, I would have to imagine their insurance refused to be involved in this claim because the claim predates the insurance contract. If you get in a car accident with Allstate insurance coverage today and switch to GEICO insurance coverage next week, GEICO will not cover the subject incident from last week. It predates their contract. Whatever insurance CAE has likely denied any coverage as the scope of the claim is outside the date range of the contract. So CAE has likely had to directly pay ALL defense hourly billing for the claim against them. DCI on the other hand, actually existed as a business entity and theoretically would have had insurance at the time this incident happened, so they may have insurance coverage for the legal fees.

Victim blaming is not okay, guys. Quit doing it.

93 - Only experienced watching videos of this performance as I didn't know anything about drum corps until 1995. 96 - Guard was incredible. 97 - First time I'd ever seen Cadets live and first year I was able to march a DCI drum corps. I thought they were robots. 98 - This is the show that made me want to march there. Drill and marching were absolutely magnificent. 2000 - Obviously, since I marched this year. Funny thing is I HATED this show when we first came out, but it grew on me throughout the season. 2011 - A visual masterpiece. I am such a huge Cadets fan that they used to call me SuperCadet when I was in Cadets. I'm going to miss this corps deeply. The tears in my eyes as I type this can't express how much I hate this news.

Once I read/ heard in the Fall that The Cadets pretty much sold off every asset they owned, ie including transportation and kitchen vehicles, and all the way down to printers, fax machines, office furniture, office supplies, Corps sales merchandise, etc..it seemed clear to me that this was not the actions of a temporary suspension for a season, but likely the end for this Iconic, Drum Corps. Later on I saw their name removed from the DCI website. It had been scrubbed, and without any public notice that I'm aware of regarding the Corps being stripped of DCI membership. So the end for the Cadets seemed complete when I saw that removal. Nevertheless, its still hard for me to have this fully sink in yet. I wish the victim a sense of justice and most importantly healing for her moving forward . I have no idea how the plaintiffs lawyers will be paid. I assume they took on the case Pro Bono. But unless they can settle something financially with DCI, its a mystery at present to me from where that pay for their services will come from. As for the Cadets, I am very saddened for all the alums, volunteers, instructors, marchers, sponsors, etc that were with this Corps over the decades and had no knowledge of these unsavory things going on. My guess, thats a lot of very good, decent and honorable people since the Corps founding in 1934. that came through their ranks. 90 years worth. So its hard to lose something that has been pretty much a standard fixture for all our lives in our memories if we think about it. And it was for the most part, happy memories, great shows, entertaining us on the field with performances that will now have to last us our lifetimes. Lots of great shows over the decades to replay again and to enjoy. But not now. Not yet. This will take some time to get over the supreme sadness of learning the finality of this with this Iconic Drum Corps.

Cadets 1993 - In the Springtime When Kings Go Off to War. I saw this show and knew this was where I wanted to march. Star was important that year, but I will gladly die on the hill of Cadets deserved to win. There has not been a show with this much physical demand since IMO. Half of this show was at 208 bpm. Watch the drumline when they put this section on the move - absolute insanity:

Apologies - this isn't really aimed at you, but it absolutely did not come out of nowhere. There were literal decades of people alleging abuse, but everyone continued this weird social media "can't name names or provide details, or I might get sued" code of conduct. I remember reading this stuff on RAMD, pre DCP. The allegation was literally sent to DCI, who essentially responded with "well, what do you want us to do about it?" It was sent to the Board, (IIRC), who took the settlement request as a threat. The abuse was systemic and pervasive, and it absolutely defies belief that no other single adult, including some that are very much mandated reporters, ever saw a thing until it became national news. The only reason this all didn't happen sooner was because these women were almost all convinced that they didn't want to "hurt the organization" at the expense of their own welfare. Mike

First of all, you haven't gotten a response and you are jumping,ping to a huge conclusion here Alumni groups are ALL ADULTS. Soundsport groups DO background check staff, but the participants are all KIDS. DCI doesn't;t background check the performers either because they are kids. They all complete safesport. What else do you expect DCI to do? Do you have anything to do all day rather than stir up drama here? And what does any of your post have to do with the cadets bakruptcy. Why do you insist on turning every thread into a "DCI isn't doing enough and doesn[t care". In Keith’s defense, I did remove my posts because I’m kind of tired of getting beat up all the time when I chime in about this stuff. We’re also Facebook friends so he knows I’m not the demon some would make me out to be. The members I’ve met are pretty great people. I’d just like for them to have a good time marching without having to deal with a lot of other stuff. That’s all.

This is 100% accurate. There was no oversight from the board, not just when it came to show design, but for the organization as a whole. How is a woman supposed to feel safe reporting sexual misconduct when emotional abuse in broad daylight was accepted and met with ‘well that’s just GH’. I have zero faith that if it was brought to their direct attention, they would have done anything other than ignore and sweep under the rug. If a victim is told ‘I have to stop doing this, I’m already in trouble with the board’ I’m betting they were not willing to make changes. There was a lawsuit filed, that was later withdrawn because the victim didn’t want to hurt the corps. The board did nothing, which in turn allowed other women to be sexually assaulted. For the ‘it happened 40 years ago’ crowd, the culture that allows this to happen then still existed well in to 2009 (the last I had direct contact with the organization) and maybe beyond. Is it ‘fair’ to alumni, fans, future members etc, well no, but life isn’t fair. The years of improper management caused this outcome, not the victim seeking justice. You can’t expect to allow this type of abuse and poor management for this long and never pay a price. This happens to be the price. It’s not the same for every group, but these are the cards the cadets were dealt. The victim is well within the law to pursue this type of justice, if you don’t understand why she would want this, be thankful that you or someone you love wasn’t hurt to the degree that they feel they need to pursue this path. It seems a lot of fans forget this is a youth activity with large power differences in unusual situations. The protection of the performers should be of utmost importance, even if that means it comes before performance objectives.

So many iconic shows in their history that will live on forever, but for selfish reasons, my favorite was 2023. I followed them closely all summer and got to see my son on the field in his rookie DCI season. When the last formation hit on Final night in Indy as a large part of the crowd erupted, there he stood. Right on the 50 yard line. Nobody knew at the time that it would be the last brass release of one of the most storied corps in the history of the activity. It brings a tear to my eye now just thinking about it. Yesterday was a very tough/emotional day for my son and our family. We'll all move on but as I told my son, he'll always have last summer and those memories. I'm eternally grateful that he had that opportunity. Thank you, Cadets. FHNSAB

Don’t blame the victim.

Imagine, for a moment, that you are a kid auditioning for your favorite corps. You take look around as you stand in the horn arc, drumline or guard line and realize you’re the only kid of that ethnicity standing in that hornline; no one else there with whom to talk about your background, no one else who identifies with the struggles you’ve had to get to the point where you can actually AFFORD to march; hardly any instructors, staff members or caption heads who identify with your background. This isn’t exclusive to one demographic; in fact, this exists with many different people. THAT was what it was like for me. I truly believe those who are against diversity or who claim initiatives like DEI are “political” do not have a full understanding of the entire history of this country and why it is important for all of us to have representation in many different aspects of life. There are many historical events in this country that we HAVE to learn and other parts of this country's history that is put on the back burner. That needs to change if we are to truly have a better understanding of EVERYONE'S struggles, triumphs and successes. Kudos to corps like Bluecoats for delving deep into this and contributing to make drum corps a much better experience for EVERYONE.

I’m actually the designer of Walmart Health virtual care! No kidding! Telehealth does not include any store-centered services, including pharmacy, vision or store products. It does include on demand doctor visits, on phone or computer. It’s a really good service and I am really proud that somehow I am connected to DCI.

I agree with you. But on the other hand it's infuriating and it sucks that so many people that did nothing wrong have to suffer because of the actions of a few (the few in this case being the predators) I say that because if we went this route, it would suck for the 18-19 year old that wants to march drum corps but maybe can't do a full world class tour because of other commitments, so a local open class corps fits more of their schedule. Not to mention goodbye Blue Devils C. But I get it and I agree with you. Just sucks that it only takes a few "Bleep Bleep Curse Curse"........ to ruin it for others. But if it has to be done, then so be it.

Finally, a positive Cadets thread - one that is highlighting and honoring the legendary stamp they've left in the activity. The other Cadets thread is a super buzzkill 😡 I didn't start in the activity until I was 15 and I would have never made the cut for Cadets 1994 guard but that's the show that showed me just how clean a guard could be. 1996 was another WOW factor when it came to the guard so I made the jump in 97 - my years with the Cadets were AMAZING! It was hard - they pushed us HARD back then but it shaped the person I became. 1996 Cadets just had it all for me and will forever be my favorite show, even more so than winning in 1998.

My screen name, almost as old as DCP, is in honor of the corps. Their performances consistently ranked the corps in top positions with me, with only a few exceptional years. The alumni I know are at the same time crushed and unsurprised. The G7 Thank GOD for the O-13 (the Other 13), led by a big, affable, and tenacious Italian corps director in Jersey and his friends, who had the ball-bearings to fight back in the most creative of ways to derail the DCI coup and takeover. My appreciation of their corps' performances aside, I would appreciate a word from the humble-pie-stuffed mouths of the other six corps of the notorious group who held the G7 document and its (half) creator above their heads like a proverbial Will Smith at the Spartacus opener. At this time, poignantly, the rest of the activity's "leaders" would show considerable humility, direction of focus, and unity if they were to proclaim to be ever vigilant against the potential damage from a too-powerful ego. That Sparta-Hop's has now been all but killed leaves the door open for a new concerted effort to root out the rot and pledge activity-wide to DFTK. His involvement and his corps' demise permit the survivors to build anew on top of the foundational bones of the old, just the same as in Spartacus' Rome. My hunch is that DCI is next (see below) and, when it itself becomes part of the rubble foundation of the drum corps' history, the remaining leadership of the activity will want the trust and patience of the fans while they rebuild the "show producer" function of DCI, the organization. They'll go a long way toward earning that trust, IMO, if those remaining corps now become the real nails in the Cadets/Hop coffin by pledging to never again let such hubris by one or two beguile others into a coup mentality. DCI's "deep pockets" DCI has $12mm in the bank? Seriously? I haven't paid much attention in recent years but, back when I was active pre-2021, I don't remember accounting for a single year where DCI has a 5-digit balance in the bank. In fact, their ultimate stated goal for years was to build a $500m cushion in their budget; to the best of my memory, they never attained that goal. So, where'd this cash come from? Ahh... Covid Cash. I remember the talk at the time: DCI needed funds to keep a tour operation going even though there were no shows to pay in to keep it going. Huh? So, DCI needed to sustain itself when it had no job to do for two, frightful summers? So they took gratuitous tax dollars, got it. So many thieves, IMO. The corps created DCI to promote shows so, if the corps couldn't perform shows, what was DCI needed to do? I understand paying a staff or two to maintain relationships, etc was important but, otherwise, it should have been shut down and stripped to the bones, 50th anniversary or not. This kind of financial foolishness is exactly of the type that has the activity as a whole but a few coffin nails away from demise. I can kind-of justify the corps themselves taking free taxpayer stimulus (kind of: no tour = few expenses) but I've felt from first hearing it that DCI was gaming the Covid system to the detriment of taxpayers and it smelled as bad as socks at the end of the season. The irony is that by taking the money and finally getting their "cushion" (about one year's tour expenses) DCI has made themselves a target in a deep-pockets lawsuit looking to reimburse attorneys for expenses (and hoped-for payday) if not for restitution to the actual victims. Karma, truly. It makes me chuckle that their cushion could be so short-lived and the remaining corps will be right back in the same position of having to fund a tour company to organize their shows even while they claim every dollar is needed to design, write, teach, and perform them. Their reliance on "someone else" accomplishing the cushion goal might well leave them in exactly the same position of having no cushion at all in DCI. Again, on bended knee, they should swear an oath to the Jacobs-idol to never again let the ramblings of a known lunatic drive their decisions or egos. It never ends well. Insurance to Cover Ream has made the apt point twice now and it can't be skipped (because, I'll say it: if Jeff and a few others spotted it, you know the sharp insurance company attorneys will, too): the event at the center of THIS case happened at a non-sanctioned, non-sponsored event where a group of like-minded corps participants gathered for fun. It wasn't a "company event", reportedly. Liability insurance covers the insured's events, not casual gatherings where attendance was optional and spontaneous. Estoppel laws would prevent overlapping liability and, obviously, insuring against the antics of 128 high-school aged knuckleheads while on official corps business is hard (and expensive) enough. I've watched enough insurance scam YT videos to think that, in all likelihood, DCI's liability insurance didn't apply and, instead, it's the accused's personal liability insurance (if any) that would protect an accused while not on "company business", not the coverage provided to the company for when he/she was on company business. EDIT: If DCI's liability coverage won't pay for litigation or damage settlements, then that $12mm bank balance has a target on it. So, I see the Wiley-Coyote-eyed attorneys focused in on DCI's bank balance and smelling blood. I won't be at all surprised to see the next marching shoe to drop being DCI's "cushion" significantly eaten up by defense and settlement costs. In a double irony way, if I'm right and, if DCI survives the attack, it will be left penniless, wholly dependent on the gate revenue produced by the remaining corps performing shows with no financial cushion against calamity. IOW, exactly as it's been for mostly every year of DCI's existence prior to the pandemic pennies from heaven. It will again be left up to the leadership of performing corps to craft the new DCI into the image it needs and wants to produce a tour. Let's hope they keep the G7 debacle, and my hoped-for humility, front and center of their minds as they do. Lastly, to Cadets2000, your disgust and exasperation at the whole is just like that which drove me away from active participation a few years ago. Let it happen. It's OK to walk away and even fashionable now to proactively stop buying products from companies whose actions turn your stomach. As a very good friend of mine said as I was headed out the door, "There are other things" that will fill the hole left by finally calling the spade and walking away. You'll broaden by the action more than the feeling of the loss of something precious. I, and many others, can attest to it. And, at the same time, don't cancel your DCP account but, instead, reduce your drum corps habit down to a few times a year to check in and see if anything has changed (in drum corps if not in DCP). One never knows: three-peats happen, (We Are) The Future wins and, sometimes, Angels defeat the Demons after the bloody battle. It's worth checking in now and then.

Let’s not over glamorize Hopkins. He ran a summer marching band. Brought in top talent who designed championship shows for him. Drove them away. Tanked the band. Assaulted girls and was convicted. Now he sets up tee times for you. A dickish loser with a psychopathic personality. Not worth anybody’s time of day.

I’m more mad at this point than anything

Narcissism is a hell of a drug.

This is very true. In some ways you might say the Garfield Cadets were lucky to not have folded in the late 70s or early 80s. Being one of the older corps they were never setup for modern drum corps travel, education, and funding like many non-profits were that began in the 70s, 80s, or 90s (and this is not to say those groups were all setup perfectly either). The Cadets were essentially a church corps established for parades. Like many neighborhood corps of the 1920s, 30s, and 40s most of those groups do not exist today. I'm not sure if Madison and Cavaliers are the only two left. I don't think Racine Scouts are around anymore...or are they? But there is a reason most corps that were founded in the early 20th Century are no longer around. What kept them afloat (Garfield)? It was not GH as some might say (despite all his criminal behavior off the field). I think they got lucky that Zingali, Sylvester, Hannum, and Jim Prime Jr came in and designed some shows (with the creative help from Cesario) that pushed the activity forward. This brought them popularity and brand name and many of the older alumni started giving again. This is what really saved them temporarily...the alumni/fans/donors and the instructional team. And even with GH robbing Peter to pay Paul (cooking the books) they managed to thrive in donor contributions and also changes in instrument deals and other spnsorships. YEA never really panned out to be the "educational" org they said it would be. To me it was more a front for money collection. But by 2017 and 2018 -- when everything comes to light with GH and others -- we all knew that should have been the knockout punch. As much as my heart is bleeding due to the loss of an iconic and historic drum corps my head says this is the way it has to be. They had chance after chance after chance to make changes. They lacked the whistle blowers who may have known what was going on and who should have stepped up back in the 80s, maybe even the late 70s, and put a stop to the methods of operation and people within (no matter how high their rank) who were commiting crimes and/or who were engaged in behaviors not conducive to safety, education, and a positive learning environment. The Garfield Cades were one of the few corps that somehow crossed the divide between the early days of drum corps in America (the neighborhood corps, Scouts groups, CYO, AL, and VFW days) to modern DCI days; BUT...that transition was frought with error that would make it difficult for them to last unless someone with real forsight and a progressive look at education, funding, safe travel, community involvement and real purpose were to redefine the corps mission statement and not just the design of a show. So even without the criminial ongoings of the corps' leader it was always going to be difficult for a corps from 1934 to navigate the modern DCI environment.

Agreed- even the press release is riddled with gaslighting and victim-blaming.

Just an update on the recent march camp they had. After becoming a recent alum, contracted in 20, 22, and 23, I decided to drive to the camp site to see some old friends and see what the corps was doing. I was only able to make it to the end of camp but, luckily, I was able to listen to all of the music they had up to this moment. They only had 2 parts for the camp which went up to the ballad surprisingly which makes me suspect that the son lux residency will be the star of the back half of the production obviously. Part one is in your face and guns blazing with great energy due to temp AND technique! This book is already miles harder than 23 and I'm a little jealous I aged out in 23. The second part of part 1 gives me the feeling of Kinetic noise with its intense rhythmic challenges. Part 2, the ballad is just gorgeous. It reminded me as a brass player why I wanted to march this Line in the first place. Doug Throwers chord progressions and focus to writing as close to the source music as possible is just amazing. The lines tonal accuracy is phenomenal and dynamic shaping is just as strong. I am truly pleased to be on the other side of the field and once again be a fan of this organization and wish them all the best for this season!

Shout out to the Troopers for making preseason show content announcements and building excitement for the season. Tim Snyder announced the other day that they have found a vocalist that sounds nearly exactly like Johnny Cash to sing “House of the Rising Sun”. Brilliant. Look it up on YouTube. So sad and soulful. Troop are quickly becoming my favorite corps. Just get the guard on point and 😘

I see comparisons to a tragic Shakespearean figure or a Greek tragedy to be glamorizing. Maybe that’s just me. I see a snake oil salesman who finally got caught.

As we’re continuing this discussion, we need to keep in mind that the lawsuit was the final nail in the coffin, but even without the lawsuit the chances of Cadets taking the field again were slim to none. Remember we’re talking about years of serious financial mismanagement, not to mention a number of crazy decisions along the way. After 2019 it looked as if there might not have been a 2020. Covid and a year off gave Cadets a chance to regroup. The corps had revolving leadership, two significant leaders in particular who never had full support. I know one was beloved and one was a bit controversial to put it mildly, but personality issues aside, both were qualified and would have been able to put another corps back on track. Then there’s the move from Allentown to Erie. Don’t forget some one time insiders were predicting the end of the Cadets in the fall of 2017/winter of 2018 when it was rumored GH was leafleting cars of people auditioning for Bloo, Crown, and BAC while their winter camps were in session, hoping they’d march Cadets. Most of us would have loved to see Cadets take the field again, and I will miss a corps I have loved for years, but if it hadn’t been the accusations and potential aftermath of a legal settlement, it probably would have been something else.

It's not much now, but I'm sorry what never should've happened to you both did. Thank you for sharing this, as it will be instructive and inspiring for someone out there that you spoke up.

So blame the victim?

If The Cadets had simply folded due to the cost of fuel, housing, insurance, food etc, I could live with that. Sad but hey, them's the breaks and life goes on. The fact that this was instead 100% self inflicted, it kinda pisses me off to be honest. I see lots of comments about He Who Shall Not Be Named... well, these actions pre-date him. Looking at the big picture, I can now see how he did what he did as the culture was already there. FOR THE RECORD... I am in NO WAY excusing the actions... I think he should be in prison right now. Just that this stuff was happening BEFORE him. As much as I hate to say it, the corps SHOULD have died back in 2018. We simply got a bonus five years on life support. This is sad, perplexing, anger inducing and TOTALLY unsurprising I'm afraid.

i think they wanted money, thats why they kept adding people and organizations. but let's be honest....as we continue to learn, it was a toxic place. eventually it had to catch up with them. everyone thought 2018 would be what killed the corps, but amazingly it lasted 5 more years. i do wish board members that came on here inviting questions had been less dickish when asked the questions last fall. but in hindsight, my questions were answered.

Thank you, Cadets, for the wonderful shows and performances you brought to drum corps fans for so many decades. I will always remember you for the high standards you set on the field. My heart goes out to the countless alumni and staff and supporters who brought us this positive legacy of education and excellence. My heart goes out as well to those who suffered abuses within the corps. Let us hope and work for the dsy when the drum corps can be experienced and enjoyed without the fear of suffering of any MMs or staff or volunteers. Peace to all.

One of the most storied corps in the history of our activity died today and this is what you care about? Good Lord.

I agree with you. I think it's time we all just say our goodbyes. All we have left are the memories of the great shows and the tremendous work put forth by the alumni of the corps who gave us so many wonderful performances. It's a sad day in Drum Corps History. 😞

I believe GH was in Cadets management by 1982. And the Tricia Nadoly articles clearly established that the GH assaults were happening at that time (I know several survivors). So, by then management had set the tone allowing such behavior to occur. And, as some in Cadets management in the 2010s said to a later victim- ‘GH will be GH’. Cadets could have stopped it if they had the cajones to. But they didn’t. Reap what has been sown. My favorite all-time show is Appalachian Spring from 1987. I will miss them.

Apparently someone zoomed in on an image from Mackey's social and re-entered by hand into a score program to try to get early access to Mackey's work for Crown. Mackey saw it and just posted a bit of the full score!

BD 2012 exuded excellence. There isn't a theme a corps has done that isn't pretentious and silly even if it happens to be your personal favorite. It's all just marching band that takes itself way too seriously. People in crowds who try to make their opinion known to people around them are even more pretentious and silly. Real weirdos. Your opinion isn't that special no matter how many fellow weirdos get onboard with you. Every finals I went to there have been people like that. Every adult rolls their eyes and tries to ignore them.

For years people have been saying corps need to get in bed with corporations to stay afloat. So DCI goes and does that, but now we have to be overly picky about what, who, how, when? Without being able to see the agreement we can’t know exactly how much benefit there is for the activity, but if we want this activity to survive, thrive, and provide more safety and this agreement does provide a net benefit, I’m all for it.

When we were 15, we thought we had life all figured out. But when we were 30, we knew that this wasn’t the case.

You can’t convict without due process. But you can absolutely make allegations. That’s what makes them allegations. And there is an entire range of social behaviors — including many forms of bullying, especially online — that the police can’t really do anything about. It’s not a cure-all. Victims fail or are slow to report for plenty valid reasons that even the police and lawmakers have grown aware of. So it’s more complicated than “tell the police.” Anyway - people want to feel like these organizations have their safety and best interests at heart. That’s what’s at stake. The police aren’t going to help you with that. DCI apparently can’t even help you with that.

I long have held in my heart that the art can be separated from the artist. I still believe this. In the Cadets' case, however, after being reminded of the perpetual culture of the board/admin that fostered an environment conducive to all that's happened... ... the tarnish is real. It's really hitting home today. How can I watch a Cadets show with joy in my heart with the knowledge of what was going on behind the scenes? Or share with my students? Or wear my corps jacket? In the abusers' case, the artists used the art to abuse. Used us all. The art can stand alone, can stand the test of time. Generations of young people can watch YT videos of Cadets shows forever, and it will mean something to them. But the joy, for me at least, is darkened. They destroyed the lives of so many victims, and used the Cadets, all of us Cadets, to do it. ... Now that it's official, I'm glad the Cadets organization is done. At least today. I don't know how I'll feel tomorrow.

Careful - that might be enough to make you the next co-defendant.

Well, this is what happens when you put your hands on people you're not supposed to. Though I'm extremely sad about this outcome, I'm more ANGRY at the adults who committed these crimes and put the corps in this position. The HATE I have in my heart toward those people is beyond any measurable order of magnitude. No amount of innovation, influence on the activity or World Championships excuses putting your hands or other body parts on CHILDREN or adults who do not consent. Let this be a lesson for STUPID adults who consider committing these types of crimes. I hope you're punished to the fullest extent of the law. This will probably be my last post on this site as I really see no more motivation to be here. I'm grateful for the way Cadets have changed my life, as well as the lifelong friends I've made from marching there. But the anger I have in my heart right now is taking over the excitement of participating in any type of drum corps discussion or watching drum corps again.

TRacer, i am sorry you have had to live with this. And I absolutely understand being ok with knowing your abuser is dead. Mine is not, and lives near by. I wouldn’t wish him dead, but would not mourn his passing. when we all think about what this plaintiff wants from this action, obv none of us can know. What i DO know is that, in a civil action, she has final say in moving forward. She likely knew when she filed that there aren’t deep pockets here, but she filed anyway. When she was advised that this would necessitate shutting down the Cadets permanently, she could have said “no, don’t let that happen”. She did not. To me, that sounds like wanting justice above all else. Would i do that? Probably not. Do i begrudge HER for doing that? Absolutely not.

I’m for justice for victims of sexual abuse etc, but it seems to me that the only outcome in this lawsuit and going after any entity with the Cadet's moniker would only result in this and thus they get nothing monetarily. This is not like going after a mogul or the Catholic Church with deep pockets. It’s a newly formed organization that technically had nothing to do with the very unfortunate events from 42 years ago.

It is like pulling teeth to get them to talk about their experiences. I didn’t even know my father had served in Korea until after he had passed away. I knew he’d been in (West) Germany but he never talked about Korea. I can only surmise that he saw a lot. God bless your Grandfather.