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67madplaid71

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  1. Nobody but the Royal Airs ever referred to the CYO, VFW and AL Nats as some sort of triple crown. I always felt that the World Open was much more of a significant title to win than the CYO, so if there ever was such a thing as a triple crown, in my mind it would have included the World Open and not the CYO which was initially only for catholic corps and usually drew a lesser slate of top corps. Besides, winning the World Open in 1965 probably was more of an achievement than even winning AL Nats, let alone comparing it to the CYO.
  2. Great story. I had the opposite situation recently. I am an alumni of the Kilties and have an original snare drum that the Kilties used in their first public appearance in Racine's 1936 Fourth of July parade. This drum was one in the first set of drums bought for the Kilties in 1935 and was used by them until a new set of drum was purchased in the early 1940s. It's still in wonderful condition needing only new heads. I asked the Kilties if they would be interested in using it or at least marching with it in Racine's 2011 Fourth of July parade as a sort of 75th anniversary of their first public appearance thing and they politely told me that they weren't interested.
  3. The earliest theme show that I know of is the "South Pacific" show that the Racine County Council Boy Scouts did in 1950. All of their music was from the musical "South Pacific."
  4. Hard to get a lot of prize money when admission to finals was only two bucks. 1968 VFW finals had maybe around 15,000 spectators; I think 1969 had a little more. At two bucks a ticket they grossed about thirty grand. After expenses there wasn't "big money" left to be paid out as prize money. You also have to remember that prize money was paid out in other contests too such as band, color guard and drill team; the VFW didn't just hold a drum and bugle corps contest. These other convention contests didn't draw what the finals of the drum corps contest did, so I would guess that the prize money paid to these other contest winners was siphoned off of the money made at the VFW drum and bugle corps finals. I also believe that prelims at VFW nationals was free for spectators; maybe the band, color guard and drill team contests were free too. I don't believe that the VFW was all that interested in putting a lot more time, effort and money into their national convention contests. One has to remember that in reality the VFW staged "The Million Dollar Pageant of Drums" contest as an entertainment event for their convention attendees, not to do the drum corps activity a favor by holding some sort of a drum and bugle corps national championship. Also the VFW was mainly interested in having a large, colorful and entertaining convention parade. To lure drum corps, bands, color guards and drill teams to march in their convention parade, they had to hold a nice contest for them. In other words, in my opinion, "The Million Dollar Pageant of Drums" contest that was held each year at the VFW national convention was the carrot that drew in these drum corps and other units to march in their convention parade without the VFW having to pay them to do so. The VFW didn't make much money holding these contests, but as long as this plan worked and these units marched their parade for free I think the VFW was very happy and content. As a further incentive, the VFW presented an award at each national convention to the best drum and bugle corps in the parade.
  5. Unforunately your memory is bad as this didn't happen. If this was the case you'd think that by nationals you guys would have known your drill! The reality is that the Kilties won 1968 VFW Nationals out right. Since then you Royal Air people have dreamed up all kinds of excuses and penalties. First it was said that it was announced during the score announcements at nationals that the Royal Airs would have won but for a two point penalty (It was a one point penalty and without it you would have finished in second place). Now we have the score announcements on tape (uncut by the way) and that announcement never took place. Now, 32 years later we are introduced to this bs. Come on guys, your attempt at revising history isn't working. There are no contemporaneous reports or articles in any publication anywhere which in any way substanciates anything you or any of the other Royal Air Alumni have said. I'll say it again no matter how distastful it is for you, the Kilties won 1968 VFW Nationals out right; without your penalty the Royal Airs would have only taken second place. If by chance the Royal Airs fell apart during the closing portion (exit number) of your drill then by all means you didn't deserve to win nationals. But the Royal Airs didn't lose because of a penalty.
  6. Don't keep feeding us DCI's Kool-Aid, greed was the primary reason DCI was formed. The drum corps activity as a whole had nothing to do with the organization of DCI and accepted and lived within the rules at the time. It was 13 corps who belived that they were better than the activity and sought to go out and make their fortune together. That's the truth! Also in the pre-DCI era rules were discussed and decided at the American Legion Rules Congress held each fall (which is also where the organization of the Combine was announced at in the fall of 1971). As far as glock's go, I marched in that era early 1960's) and most felt that they were stupid and had no useful purpose anymore in drum corps. Back in the real old days they helped make drum corps more "musical" along with fife's because of the limited capabilities of the bugle, but with the introduction of the rotary and especially G-F bugles later on, glock's and fife's became unecessary. I guess one just has to look back at the era of the VFW and American Legion and compare it to the DCI era. Obviously Tony Schlecta was right! More corps, more fans, more shows, more sponsors and the activity actually grew then. DCI put a screen door on a submarine and then kept telling us that we needed to take music appreciation classes if we didn't like what was going on. Fans and sponsors left the activity in droves, not to mention the almost the total disappearnce of the junior corps activity.
  7. My absolute all-time favorite was 1965 Symphony in Brass recorded at Chicago's Civic Opera House. I wore out the volume with the Kilties, Cavies, Royal Airs and St. Kevin's Emeral Knights. What a great recording! This was also my mother's favorite drum corps record as she also played it all the time which, of course, helped to wear it out quicker. My father's favorite record, however, was the 1965 Midwest Dream, the volume with Argonne Rebels, Norwood Park Imperials, Kilties and McHenry, IL, Men of Brass Seniors on it. He loved the musical arrangements and soloists for the Men of Brass.
  8. Were there any photos of the Kilties or Boys of 76 that I could get copies /scans of included in your treasure trove?
  9. The Ambassa"Does" were the feeder corps for the Ambassa"Dears." Both were All-Girl corps and both were from Racine, WI. In the fall of 1972 they merged with the Citations Color Guard, also from Racine, and became the New Day All-Girl Drum and Bugle Corps and their feeder corps then became the New Dawn. The New Dawn no longer exists, however, the New Day still exists as a co-ed parade corps with a competing winter guard.
  10. The Kilties sold the rights to market their 1972 recordings to Fleetwood for $5,000. In my opinion, whether or not the Kilties organization still exists or not doesn't matter as Fleetwood paid for the exclusive rights to market all recordings of the Kilties made during 1972 and the marketing rights still belong to them. It was a one-time payment for exclusive rights forever. The damage incurred by someone selling a 1972 recording of the Kilties is to Fleetwood, not to the Kilties. With regard to the Kilties having a "very down year" in 1971 all I can say is that the Kilties Small Corps was undeafeated that winter; the Kilties winter guard won the 1971 Badgerland Association Color Guard Championship in addition to winning or placing very high in color guard contests throughout that season; the Kilties full corps won the 1971 North American Championship in addition to winning the following contests during the summer of 1971: Northwest Festival at Milwaukee, Des Plaines Vanguard's contest, Woodstock, IL, contest; National Preview contest at Salamanca, NY; Racine Scouts contest; and the annual Labor Day contest at Janesville, WI. The Kilties also took many seconds and thirds that summer. The Kilties just had a very slow start that summer. With regard to going to Dallas for the VFW National Championship, yes, the Kilties did in fact go to Dallas, however the Kilties never got there. After taking fifth at finals of the Mid-America Open in Overland Park, KS, the members of the Kilties voted to turn around, save the money and go back to Racine. The Kilties were not real flush with money at the time so the idea of spending additional money by continuing down to Dallas without being in contention for the national championship just didn't seem to make sense. The survival of the organization mattered more than an 11th or 12 place finish at finals - on the way to Dallas the Kilties beat the Belleville Black Knights who took 12th place at VFW Nationals by almost 2 points on August 12 at the Argonne Rebels contest and beat the St. Paul Scouts who took 11th place at VFW Nationals by almost 4 points on August 14 at the Mid-America Open. Yes, I believe that politics did indeed play a very important part as to why the Kilties were not included in the original group of drum corps that organized DCI. Being privy to some private information all I wish to say is that it is my understanding that some of the founding Midwest corps did not want to include the Kilties and so they weren't included. I don't believe that it was an oversight or an accident that the Kilties, who won three of the previous seven VFW National Championships prior to the organization of the "Midwest Combine" in the fall of 1970, were initially excluded from the combine and later from DCI. Some rivalries are very bitter! I would expect that the "official" reason from DCI would be that they didn't want to have too many corps from the Wisconsin - Illinois area included, that they wanted to have the DCI member corps spread out over the country and not have an area really saturated with them. The other "official" reason I would expect to hear from DCI would be that the Kilties didn't have a very stable management team in place at the time.
  11. I agree. I too believe that the Blue Stars folded after the 1982 season and that the current Blue Stars are an out growth of the Blue Star Cadets. If this was the case, it was very smart on their part in my opinion. This has been much discussed among Kiltie Alumni because our organization was in a very similar situation at the exact same time, buy the late 1970s the Kiltie Kadets were still a very viable and stable organization while the Kilts as a DCI Corps was pretty much destroyed financially. (Kilties 1969 budget was $29,500. Kilties 1973 budget, their first season in DCI, just 4 years later was over $150,000.) After the Kilties folded for the first time in the spring of 1980 the Kiltie Kadets went on to have a very successful year in 1980 including winning the CCI Championship. The discussion always centers on what would have happened had the Kiltie Kadets continued on without the Kilts being reorganized in 1981. For the record, the Kiltie Kadets folded after the 1981 season and the Kilties were reorgainzed for the 1981 season but folded for good after the 1982 season. The resources and members taken from the Kiltie Kadets in the fall of 1981 and used to reorganize the Kilts caused the demise of the Kiltie Kadets and wasn't enough to ensure the continued existence of a the Kilts as a DCI Division 1 touring drum corps. 1982, the tenth anniversary season for DCI, was not very kind to the activity. Some very popular DCI drum corps folded after that season including the Blue Stars, Kilties and Memphis Blues Brass Band. I would have to say that today's discussions are about 30 years too late about how the DCI business/touring model doesn't work. We knew that back in the 1970s already that it wouldn't work for the vast majority of drum corps. By 1983, Brian Tolzman can help me here, probably close to 75% of the actively competing junior corps which were alive when DCI began in 1972 were gone by then along with almost all drum corps circuits too. It didn't take very long, just 10 years, but the activity was pretty much "toast" by 1983. If I as a prospective franchise/business purchaser was looking to buy a franchise/business today, I certainly would not buy one in a business sector that saw 90% of its franchises/businesses fail over the past 38 years and the business sector now had little to no prospects for growth. A business sector which also saw the vast majority of its past repeat customers leave in droves due to the franchises/businesses in this business sector's inability/refusal to meet their customer's expectations. We don't hear from them because these "lost" fans are long gone and could care less about posting comments on DCP.
  12. Racine's New Day has been reorganized and is active again as a parade corps. I believe this past summer was their second summer back, maybe their third. I talked to their corps director two summers ago and she stated that they have no desire to become involved in competing again except for Winter Guard. Also the Racine Junior Scouts still exist as a parade corps. I think they're now known as the Troop 205 (I might have the troop number wrong) Drum and Bugle Corps. I also heard that there was some sort of reorganization of the Boys/Spirit of 76 Drum and Bugle Corps going on this past winter/spring. I think their goal was to become active in the SCDA. If that's the case, Racine (Population 70,000) has five active drum and bugle corps right now including the Kilties and the Racine Scouts. I don't know if Milwaukee's Midwest Legends are still active as a senior/all-age drum and bugle corps. I didn't see them in any parades this year but I did see them last summer in a parade in Elkhorn along with a couple of American Legion Bands which ironically are still doing fine after about 90 years in existence. I know that the Midwest Legends never competed but they were quite active as a parade corps around SE Wisconsin for many years. Composed mainly of drum corps alumni from the Milwaukee area.
  13. In our case you are right! We went to Bloomington 2 years ago and had a great time, thought it was a nice venue and area to vacation in. Last year we went to Indy and again we had a great time on this vacation but we felt the venue was poor not only accustically, but also the NFL concession prices were a concern for us. I paid $18.00 for nachos, a coke and M & M Peanuts. We, without regrets, decided to go to Minneapolis this summer instead of back to Indy. Unfortunately some of the show was rained out but we liked it so much that we will go to Minneapolis every year that it has a comprehensive lineup rather than Indianapolis. We had a great vacation there and found that it's a very nice venue - plus we don''t have to drive through Chicago!
  14. Custer's Brigade from Illinois. I always thought that was a real different name for a drum corps even when they were in existence back in the 1960s. I don't remember them faring much better in the drum corps activity than the original Custer's Brigade did fighting out West. Also, I think it would be quite shocking to see a Klu Klux Klan Drum and Bugle Corps today. They did exist early in the 20th Century. Not a good idea today!
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