camel lips

Nailed it! Sad part is I feel certain Hopkins has a bunch of sock puppet accounts and uses them to glorify himself on these social media sites and forums and he has lackeys that do his bidding for him that think just because of the creativity he created that THAT is what they believed in and followed is WHY they want to follow him into the hounds of hell.

I had forgotten about that stunt. How crazy was it to think they could just gloss that over and pretend like it never happened?? Sorta like all these sock puppet accounts and dreamers that think that somehow belive that they keep on victim shaming the victims they are going to worm GH back on the podium or in a position of leadership at DCI? I could totally see once he gets off probation that he becomes a ghost writer. BOA, DCI Winter Gaurd you name it. Butnif it was ever found out who the real author was those units would either get black balled or pay a heavy price . Or not. It's a fickle industry that's hell bent on self destruction apparently.

Makes me wonder how he squirmed his way into DCA and how he stayed in DCA for as long as he did with Cadets2 ? We will probably never know the details of that.

So what is the educational model? What is the one for TSA and how do they differ?

Its what is done in the corporate world . They hope to lower the damages at trial by demonstrating to the courts that they separated themselves from the employee that instigated the lawsuit. In this case DCI separates itself from The Cadets demonstrating to the courts that they are no long affiliated with The Cadets and no longer condone that behavior and hope to get off with a slap on the wrist.

So many organizations have had their fair share of perverts in leadership capacities. Hopkins and Vogt were both Authority figures the same as any of these other staff members that have been accused/convicted of misconduct and sexual perversion with minors but you gotta admit being in the director's seat and carrying as much weight,clout and light that was shown on them as they had sure made The Cadets that Corps that will ultimately be associated with what goes wrong with sexual abuse/perversion. No iff ands or butts about it.

I mean at this point for them what does it matter really? They are bitter and sour and taking their ball and going home and at this point really don't care one way or the other who they offend. Its done and over for them and they are not coming back from it. One would think they would consider the victims in this and consider the future they have professionally moving forward with other organizations but in the moment that does not always translate when you are so passionate about what you have spent years pouring your life into to. Perhaps that was not the intent but it is what it is I suppose.

Sex offenders yes. I understand. But how deep are they diving into these background checks? Are they excluding people from the activity with say non violent felonies such as tax evasion? Low level drug offenses ?

He is named specifically on line 36 of the Complainant Westenberger Lynn Vs The Garfield Cadets. At least the amended version. I have read other versions where its on different lines. But you get the point. He is named specifically. I would post a link but I doubt it would stay up for long. Google is your friend here.

I think most people see these top units in the public eye . SCV , CADETS [INSERT NAME] And think because of the polished appearance on the field, the flashy costuming and they large amount of field presence in terms of personnel, props and amplification that they have it together behind the scenes. Truth be told many of them [most] of them are holding on by a thread , thrown together in a blender and if examined under a microscope would be jailed and fined tomorrow.

Yes, he was the Catalyst

Maybe not

The G7 Vision coming to life ?

https://www.wkrn.com/news/national/i-was-just-doing-my-job-alabama-band-director-says-about-football-game-arrest/?utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=socialflow&utm_source=facebook.com&fbclid=IwAR1knsXHpyA_6k3BKZOC1Kls3NgBLzndNS8xhhK2EE0JT6wZRl3nrYOqnk8 This guy is my hero! Party on Garth

While I totally agree with you... you are never going to get people to change their way in thinking on this. Even at the DCI level you have lot watchers that don't even make it into the gates till the top 5 units hit the field or till their unit hits the field. The years I was at DCA I saw a bunch of this as well at finals. Steve Rondinaro and Dennis Delucia were guilty of trumping up the top 5 Corps when the shows were on at the theaters big time. The way they would phrase it was that there was a clear level of execution difference when you reach that top 5 Corps. I heard them say this time and time again. While I tend to agree with their analysis that there IS a level of execution difference in those top 5 corps over the other competing units (and the scores reflected it) it also served to speak down to the lower units to say your not deserving and to the fans to say those units are not worth watching. So in the end. It is what it is.

Let me Guess. His last name starts with a A ?

Not sure your example is very good. Fans going to a D3 school Pretty much know what to Expect and are going to root for their school, kids and homers. They are going to get into the hype of the the pomp and circumstance of the game no matter how bad the football is because they know what they are buying into when they walk through the gate. . Its not like you have Some of the TOP SEC or PAC12 Fans dropping in on a random game on a Saturday morning at a D3 school saying lets go wander in here and check out these guys and see what this is all about.

I think Indy years ago had the potential to be a great thing for DCA and DCA finals when you had corps like Empire Statesmen, Renegades Kilties and Cadets2 , just to name a few off the top of my head . Next year you are going to have what????? Maybe 4 units that are really competitive at the top? DCI fans are going to go to this show for the first time because they have nothing else to do and buy a ticket and see this as a reflection of what DCI All Age is suppose to be and get completely turned off by it. Understanding of Course what the DCI audience is use to by this point in the season. A good many of them have been to several shows by this point in the season. Seen many of the units on the big screen. Followed them extensively. Full and complete shows and many participants on the field. When they see some of the starting line ups with maybe 50 members on the field early on they may not even stick around till Cabs or Buccs hit the field. I don't want that to be a knock on some of the lower tier units but its just a harsh reality and reasonable expectation of what fans will typically encounter.

Here lies the problem with what is being presented today. Too much of the programming is being written for a judging panel and NOT for the audience members. Band Directors and designers of these shows are writing this material to play to the judging panel and to the sheets. Its a one upmans every season to see how can create a more complex and bizzaro show that plays to these sheets that they have left the popcorn eaters in the stands out. So you are left with the golf clappers and lost your core audience. The mothers and fathers and family members of the kids marching the shows and a few people that are willing to stick around the circuit no matter what. Someone said it best. If you can't leave the stadium humming it or tapping your toes to it when you leave. It was probably garbage. You just don't have shows like that anymore.

I'll bet all the yapping and sober stories at retreat taxed the nerves of the bean counters and curfew police too !

SoundSport has gained a LOT of ground on the units outside the NE. I am not sure how the units that have made the move will feel about coming to DCI All Age. Alot will depend on how the changes really are. Who is really running? Will DCI really have full operational control over everything? And if its really a departure from the Same ole Same ole its a NE activity BS we have all heard from year to year. Probably a wait and see approach by many on the outside looking in to see if there are some real changes. Or if its just more of the same BS dressed up in a new costume.

Wow you have eloquently summed up in a single paragraph what many of us have been saying for years here. Very well said sir. Only thing I might add is I think I think they are pretty much there. Just maybe 7 or 8 units looking around wondering what the hades happened. Because those corps that they thought were expendable? They were NOT expendable. They were very much needed and now they are no longer around. I saw some idiot posting on one of the social media pages that the thought this was some sort of 2 year buy out agreement with DCI and in 2 years it was going to be business as usual for DCA. I sorta laughed because as much as I said "boy that is the stupidest idea I have ever heard of" It would be just like DCA to let DCI come in and clean things up and go right back to doing things as usual and bring championships right back to Rochester and hold them again on Labor day and say well that did not work. LOL Might have to refer back to this post again in two years if DCA jumps the shark and does the stupid thing (AGIAN) and goes back to Rochester after DCI bails them out. LOL

To me it feels a lot like what they (DCA) is doing is filing Chapter 13 VS Chapter 7 . They are admitting they finally need help but don't want to Liquidate completely. So they are hiring the "courts" in the case DCI to step in and "control" their assets for them and tell them how they are going to spend their money, manage their money and pay off their debts. for the next XXXX years. There may be a plan in place where DCA can take it back over completely if they can show solvency and get back on track. There may not. No one has really said at the DCA level. Or DCI may hold onto it forever.

I would imagine the early times are in order to get the stadiums security adequate time to clear the stadium in order to clear the building in order for the nights show. I would think most of the competing units that are NOT use to travel such as yourself will have to have some sort of adjusted break down with the membership dues to reflect the cost of travel. I would think a fair and modest amount will be in the range of $300-$400 more per member for most of those units that have not been burdened by travel in the past. THAT or find some sort of outside revenue streams such as fundraising , donations or pursuing grants that they have not otherwise utilized in the past.

Exactly what I said at the time. You have to spend money to expand the regions. They basically "tested" the waters with Annapolis and went back to bidness as usual without even realistic options. People keep talking about this DCI All Age Activity at the Oil Can but i doubt by the time it rolls around there will be enough units left to make a go of it.