DCIHasBeen Posted August 31, 2007 Share Posted August 31, 2007 Actually, the more I read this thread, the more I'm starting to think the age limit should just be abolished and corps should be classed by size and/or time committment rather than age and size. The age thing doesn't make sense any more. Junior corps were invented to give kids a fair chance at competing away from the Senior Corps, who had a lot more experience back in the day (I'm talking 30s/40s/50s.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scv74 Posted August 31, 2007 Share Posted August 31, 2007 Gotta say... I don't remember that we were really worried about anyone except Madison. Basically the attitude was that if we didn't lose horns by more than we won drums, we were OK. Really interesting looking at the swing in M & M scores from prelims. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russellrks Posted August 31, 2007 Share Posted August 31, 2007 (edited) Gotta say...I don't remember that we were really worried about anyone except Madison. Basically the attitude was that if we didn't lose horns by more than we won drums, we were OK. Really interesting looking at the swing in M & M scores from prelims. I gotta agree with you on this point. Most people point to Madison's dominance in horns as the determining factor in their '75 championship but when you factor in Vanguard's equally dominant drumline the determining factors which remained were M&M and GE. I had pretty much accepted Madison's victory until I got home and watched the PBS re-broadcast about a month later ( 1975 was the first year DCI was recorded and televised so for the first time I was able to actually see what our show looked like). IMO Vanguard's drill was far more sophisticated than Madison's and was performed as well if not better only to lose to them by 1.3 pts. in M&M. This spread alone almost completely accounts for their winning margin of 1.5 pts. As far as GE is concerned we (Vanguard) were told all summer long by the judges that we had the show to win it all if we could just "Sell" it. Well, a perfect 30 in GE says we sold the hell out of it but in the end it wasn't enough. But I'm not bitter. B) Edited August 31, 2007 by Russellrks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fran Haring Posted September 1, 2007 Share Posted September 1, 2007 That is the exact story I got from both Don Pesceone and Bob Briske. Neither one even looked at the sheets. The previous weekend, the corps was fourth at the finals of the World Open. Consider the scores from that contest: Blue Devils 91.05, SCV 89.05, 27th Lancers 87.40, Muchachos 86.50. I watched the World Open Prelims show that year.... and I remember that the Blue Devils did not win Prelims, but then went on to record that 2-point victory in Finals. Point and placement swings were not at all uncommon that year, or in that era. Heck, look at the Garfield Cadets the following year in 1976. At the VFW Nationals in New York City, they were comfortably ahead of corps such as the Blue Stars, etc., and seemingly had an airtight lock on a DCI finalist spot. About a week later, the Cadets were 14th at DCI Prelims. Go figure. Fran Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danguernsey Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 Gotta say...I don't remember that we were really worried about anyone except Madison. Basically the attitude was that if we didn't lose horns by more than we won drums, we were OK. Yep, that is what it came down to--SCV's drumline versus the Scouts's hornline. The Scouts's drumline was able to maintain about a .6 to .8 distance behind SCV's drumline in most of the major shows. Do you recall the International Open show at Butler, PA? SCV won evey caption except brass. However, the Scouts's drumline was only about .3 down to SCV's drumline. M&M and GE were about the same. The problem was that the Scout's hornline beat SCV's hornline by about 2.5 points!! And, if I recall, we didn't just eck out a victory--we won that show by a comfortable margin, about 1 point. The Butler show was a microsm of why the Scouts dominated in '75. People forget that it wasn't JUST the hornline that accounts for why we won by comfotable margins. It was being solid in the other sections as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GGarrett Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 Wow! Dan Guernsey! Long time no see buddy! I think we were playing "MalaGuerno" last I saw you! Here you are practicing that famous piece: OK... back on topic... sorry for the diversion. Move along, nothing to see here... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roark1 Posted September 5, 2007 Share Posted September 5, 2007 Because we went on last for just about every show, we never got to see any other corps' shows that year, so it's hard for me to understand how we stacked up against everyone else. I hesitate to wade in on this discussion because I believe that our show speaks for itself. It was pretty darn good. Since this whole discussion is subjective, here is something to consider. By some estimates there may have been 20 + overage people marching that year. What happens if you replace them with rookies, as there would be that many spots available in the corps? Can they play as well as the over-agers? Can they march as clean? To speculate on how a corps with overage members would have done against a corps that played by the rules is missing the point. It can’t be an “apples to apples” comparison. The over age people are going to be better players and marchers than rookies. The truly sad thing about this is that it ended up killing a GREAT corps, which is a loss to all drum corps fans. We have all missed out on some great performances that could have been. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jojo Posted September 5, 2007 Share Posted September 5, 2007 What happens if you replace them with rookies, as there would be that many spots available in the corps?Can they play as well as the over-agers? Can they march as clean? To speculate on how a corps with overage members would have done against a corps that played by the rules is missing the point. It can’t be an “apples to apples” comparison. The over age people are going to be better players and marchers than rookies. The truly sad thing about this is that it ended up killing a GREAT corps, which is a loss to all drum corps fans. We have all missed out on some great performances that could have been. That pretty much mirrors my feelings exactly. Their prelims score (and truthfully any scores earned that season) don't matter. You can take home the tropy but you can't truly "win" something you're not competing in fairly. . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dc oldtimer Posted September 5, 2007 Share Posted September 5, 2007 (edited) Everything you need to know about this topic is in this string of posts. Pay special attention to all of Paul Milano's posts who did a lot of investigative work........ and marched back then. http://www.drumcorpsplanet.com/forums/inde...pic=15292&h Edited September 5, 2007 by dc oldtimer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GuyW Posted September 5, 2007 Share Posted September 5, 2007 Some facts here.... http://www.soundmachine.org/dci/forum/viewtopic.php?t=7715 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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