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What you expect from the winter meetings


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Neddy- A couple of the comments were directed at Dutch, but not all- some were towards other corps.

But hey, that's OK.

Tex-

critisism is always welcome. A smart GE-based show, yes it was. High-school like, I wouldn't say so, playing the game and taking direction from drum corps of the past, doing it our own way- yes.

Yes, we made a ship and flew it across the field at 180bpm. It was cool, the crowd loved it, and isn't that what Drum corps about, or should be about. That's what I teach my kids. Entertainment.

But then again, hey didn't BD make a cross a few times on the field a couple years ago- gimmick? Fit the show? or Crown and Phantom using Heart formations in thier shows? The slow-motion stuff in Crown's show last year. The list goes on- Blatent GE is present at all levels, and usually always recieved quite well.

As for "innovative shows", I'm not really sure I saw any particularly innovative shows in Div II/III last year, nothing really edgy and new- a lot of the same style stuff we've been seeing for years- Not that that's bad, because there were a lot of good shows last year.

All the best to everyone in Open Class in 2008! Can't wait to see you on the field!

*edited for spelling/ grammer (I'm sure there's probably some mistakes!)

Edited by ROO
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I wish people would listen with their ears and not their eyes. I never thought Revoluntion's drumline was way overbalanced...I thought they did a pretty nice job, actually. But hey, they were a full drumline paired with a 30 person hornline, so they must be overbalanced, right?

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As for "innovative shows", I'm not really sure I saw any particularly innovative shows in Div II/III last year, nothing really edgy and new- a lot of the same style stuff we've been seeing for years- Not that that's bad, because there were a lot of good shows last year.

All the best to everyone in Open Class in 2008! Can't wait to see you on the field!

I personally believe Teal's show last year and the next to come are REALLY innovative. They are really the first corps to ever field a whole show based off a whole new genre ( A'capella ) that hasn't really been used a whole lot in the DC scene. Plus, thier from Finland, how many Open Class corps have pulled that off? Just saying, its not only because I marched there that I think that, So that it as you all shall.

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I expect them to make the open class activity more competitive. Instead of allowing easy clean shows to win (achievable), they will base scoring on difficulty and achievement. This way corps that don't go past the 30's, play the same music for 6 minutes, make cute drill forms on the field, or play twinkle twinkle off the field get huge GE points to beat out other innovative corps designs.

Here's the scoop...

Judges do, in fact, know how to score. They already do score based on difficulty and achievement. Anything is achievable in time, but the season only lasts so long. That means that a corps should shoot for something that IS achievable, which you argue is the wrong thing to do. If if corps A has a show that is difficult and dirty and another corps B has a program that is above average and clean, corps A should not win. If both programs however are on the same level of cleanliness or rather, achievement, then clearly the more difficult show should be the winner. Judges do understand this balance. Your definition of achievement is skewed.

I see that a few people on here are hacking at Mempho. Fine sirs, that is probably one of the best shows from the Div II/III 2007 season. That brass line was excellent for their size of 29. They were very well balanced and musical. Their drumline also proved to be very solid. Their visual team did an excellent job with those kids. They marched like pros. If any of you are trying to say that an out of blend brass line, dirty drumline, or messy visual program should have beaten them JUST because it was on a higher difficulty level, you are sadly mistaken. Where is the achievement in that?

I know this is World Class but... Scouts 06-Primal Forces, extremely difficult program... should they have been placed higher? Probably not because the corps above them achieved more. They're show was still great though.

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IMO, remember, just my opinion. I think that Memphis and Dutch Boy had easy shows, While Fever, Raiders, Revolution, and Oregon Crusaders had harder (but not as clean) shows. If you watch Memphis sound, I don't think you will ever see a member take more than a six-to-five step, go past the 30 yard line on either side, or go behind the back hash. Dutch Boy had GE because they made a little rocket on the field and "blasted" off, which to me, is a high school thing to do, not drum corps (although their guard was amazing.) Fever was almost clean (few spots here and there) but overall difficulty was shown, enough to beat Memphis. Revolution was dirty, percussion overpowered the brass line, guard was not impressive, but drill and visual was much more demanding than Dutch. Look at the scores, Revolution topped Dutch on brass, percussion, and visual performance, but Dutch killed Revolution in guard and GE.

I'm afraid I'm going to have to disagree there. While I may be slightly biased, I do think you're a little mistaken in both your logic and your observations. Memphis has several places where 6-5 and larger were used, but it was never as an entire hornline/battery because the designers knew how to write for the abilities of the members. Some sections had better marchers than others. In addition, take a look at the Cavaliers. They don't do drill that's as difficult when playing as when they're not. When some section has a particularly difficult musical passage, the drill is easier. It's common sense. Plus, when you've got a hornline of 29 and a battery of 12, it's a little hard to spread past the 30s. If we'd done that, then your complaint would be that the hornline sounded thin. It's not the difficulty that kept us from going farther out over the field, but rather what we wanted the corps to sound and look like (and the audience to hear and see). Keeping within those parts of the field kept the corps from looking puny. And to top it off, there are more nuanced difficulties that are harder to catch on a few viewings or on the DVD that add to the overall difficulty of the show (such as the pit feature at the end of the opener where the entire battery is facing backfield with no conductor. They have to stay in step without any guide for tempo, as they can't listen to the pit, and at the end of the feature, they have to turn and nearly simultaneously come in on a large impact. If they get out of step during anything in that section, the whole effect is ruined). It's not just about the big picture in difficulty, it's about the little stuff too.

As far as musical difficulty . . . well, I'm going to hope you weren't referring to Memphis for those. There was more difficulty in that show than in *most* of the shows I saw from Div II/III last season (and I'm pretty sure of that from having seen and played the book all summer and watching the competition night after night). Perhaps nuance, exposure, and style don't add in toward difficulty in your opinion, but the judges and fans sure seemed to think otherwise. I didn't see Fever's visual program though (and they're not on the DVD sadly), so I can't comment on their visual program. Either way . . . I hope you enjoyed the show, but I don't think I quite understand where you're coming from.

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IMO, remember, just my opinion. I think that Memphis and Dutch Boy had easy shows, While Fever, Raiders, Revolution, and Oregon Crusaders had harder (but not as clean) shows. If you watch Memphis sound, I don't think you will ever see a member take more than a six-to-five step, go past the 30 yard line on either side, or go behind the back hash. Dutch Boy had GE because they made a little rocket on the field and "blasted" off, which to me, is a high school thing to do, not drum corps (although their guard was amazing.) Fever was almost clean (few spots here and there) but overall difficulty was shown, enough to beat Memphis. Revolution was dirty, percussion overpowered the brass line, guard was not impressive, but drill and visual was much more demanding than Dutch. Look at the scores, Revolution topped Dutch on brass, percussion, and visual performance, but Dutch killed Revolution in guard and GE.

I completely agree with you, which sounds biased, but it is true. We had a physically demanding show, and while as happy as I am that we did so well for a corps that almost went inactive, I wish we could've been higher. That doesn't mean I didn't like Mempho's show, but I feel like there could've been more.

Edited by OCcontrakid
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Fever was another corps that didn't make very much use of the field (inside the 25s from my memory, could be wrong). Not critiquing the difficulty and especially not the cleanliness, just saying.

Some math for y'all: a corps that only spreads from 20s to 20s and to the back hash is utilizing 40% of the field.

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1998 Colts - An A Cappella Celebration

Sorry, I spoke without the proper knowledge. Thanks for the correction, I'll have to check that out. Still, Pretty innovative, just sayin. :thumbup:

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Fever was another corps that didn't make very much use of the field (inside the 25s from my memory, could be wrong). Not critiquing the difficulty and especially not the cleanliness, just saying.

Some math for y'all: a corps that only spreads from 20s to 20s and to the back hash is utilizing 40% of the field.

Actually 20 to 20 would be half the field.

20-20 is 60 yards.

Back of endzone to 20 is a combined 60 yards.

You were close though.

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