How do you want your guard?

[RobH]

I'll have my guard SHAKEN, not STIRRED..............

trying to lighten things up here kids!

b**bs

[deftguy]

Tell you what. I apologize for trying to join the conversation.

How about the three of you have this little thread all to yourselves.

However, do not assume that just because someone has not actually spun a rifle means they can not discuss it. By that very reason alone, Sally shouldn't be discussing drum corps at all.

Before your world gets rocked and shaken, no one said you couldn't join in the conversation. We all have a voice here, hence the word FORUM. However, within this forum I do have a right to point out fact. Especially since you readily admitted it. You by your own admission state that you don't do guard. However almost in the same breath you discount the difficulty of flag and rifle tosses, and claim that everyone did them the same. All I pointed out is that perhaps because you don't or haven't done guard that you couldn't know how difficult it really is to toss(and catch cleanly) and notice the subtle(but noticeable) variations in technique amoug the guards of the 80's. That is understandable and can be expected but certainly not a reason to get your feeling wrapped in a bundle. How about a ice cube and a pancake. Or perhaps a snowcone and a waffle

in other words CHILL yo!

Whether Sally should be discussing drum corps or not is irrelevant. She has guard experience so she can certainly discuss colorguard. And that what this is all about right?

[GMichael1230]

.

And, maybe it's because I have never done guard, but I just don't see the difficulty in it.

Geoff,

In my opinion, he wasn't coming across as condacending or sarcastic, he was just spekaing in regards to your own assumption ......

I for one can tell you it was extremely difficult to get exchanges to work properly, consistently. No twp guards did things the same...not in any way shape or form.......every flag toos or exchange had different set-ups, releases, spin technique, toss style, exchange style, recovery style, intro style...different speeds..etc..etc..etc...

Rockford file

27th Lancers

Spirit

Crossmen

North Star

Guardsmen

Cavaliers

Madison Scouts

..to name a few all did their stuff on different parts of the field, different angles, different formations..etc...

Most looked easy because we were kicking our ###es hour after hour to make it that way...the packed crowds told us we did a great job.

Hate to say it but as good and as skilled as todays guards are....flailing hands, lack of clarity or unity with free hands and prancing out of stepp does not and will not induce excitement, that is the case of the evolution going to far.

~G~

[crazymoflo]

Hate to say it but as good and as skilled as todays guards are....flailing hands, lack of clarity or unity with free hands and prancing out of stepp does not and will not induce excitement, that is the case of the evolution going to far.

Hate to say it, but times change and today's guards DO induce excitement..."flailing hands" and all. Early colorguard and modern colorguard are two different monsters and both have their faults. I can explain why I don't like seeing slams and rifles with ribbons on the ends...but it would be pointless. I'd get flamed, we'd argue, and the rift between our age groups would widen.

So I guess my point is: evolution is happening, get over it or get used to it.

[GMichael1230]

Hate to say it but as good and as skilled as todays guards are....flailing hands, lack of clarity or unity with free hands and prancing out of stepp does not and will not induce excitement, that is the case of the evolution going to far.

Hate to say it, but times change and today's guards DO induce excitement..."flailing hands" and all. Early colorguard and modern colorguard are two different monsters and both have their faults. I can explain why I don't like seeing slams and rifles with ribbons on the ends...but it would be pointless. I'd get flamed, we'd argue, and the rift between our age groups would widen.

So I guess my point is: evolution is happening, get over it or get used to it.

Lol...poor, poor person.........when you take the chip off your shoulder maybe you can actually add something relevant to the conversation.

~G~

[crazymoflo]

Lol...poor, poor person.........when you take the chip off your shoulder maybe you can actually add something relevant to the conversation.

Smart tactic - when you don't have a good reply, attack blindly and hope you hit a sore spot.

Unfortunately for you, what I wrote *was* relevant to the conversation...you made a faulty claim (concerning crowd response and "today's guards") and I corrected you.

So consider the chip removed...

[GMichael1230]

Lol...poor, poor person.........when you take the chip off your shoulder maybe you can actually add something relevant to the conversation.

Smart tactic - when you don't have a good reply, attack blindly and hope you hit a sore spot.

Unfortunately for you, what I wrote *was* relevant to the conversation...you made a faulty claim (concerning crowd response and "today's guards") and I corrected you.

So consider the chip removed...

Ok,

based on fact huh ?? how many shows have you been to since ...say...2000 ???

And, how many shows have you been to before....say, 1985 ????

Crowd response to colorguards in the past three years is nowhere near what crowd response used to be in the early eighties to what colorguards used to do...that is a fact.

Sure, there are many great moments in the current guards, but nothing equals (in crowd response) the "Rockford file" "New country" "Softly as I leave you" "Que sabe & macarena" "Waltz of the mushroom hunters" "Dance of the tumblers" ...etc, etc,etc.

You would fare better if you curbed your "get over it" comments, they only take away from your credibility.

~G~

[crazymoflo]

I don't doubt that the crowd response in the 80's was huge - and in your opinion better than today's. That's not what I was arguing.

prancing out of stepp does not and will not induce excitement

That was my problem. You were implying that what I do has no merit with the crowd. In that case, I must have been hallucinating through the end of my flag feature last year. And through the standing ovation I saw at the end of my winter season this year.

Admittedly, I'm new and young to this activity...but that's just the point. I'm part of the future of the activity, in the way that y'all are part of the history of it. I don't "prance out of step" anymore than you march in a straight line to a ballad. They're just stereotypes.

[GMichael1230]

I don't doubt that the crowd response in the 80's was huge - and in your opinion better than today's. That's not what I was arguing.

prancing out of stepp does not and will not induce excitement

That was my problem. You were implying that what I do has no merit with the crowd. In that case, I must have been hallucinating through the end of my flag feature last year. And through the standing ovation I saw at the end of my winter season this year.

Admittedly, I'm new and young to this activity...but that's just the point. I'm part of the future of the activity, in the way that y'all are part of the history of it. I don't "prance out of step" anymore than you march in a straight line to a ballad. They're just stereotypes.

Sorry, but the majority of todays guards run, in any which way, with NO uniformity or attention to detail....it is done by all the guards, sadly it does NOT induce excitement,a ctually people wonder what has happened to execution. Not my opinion, it is based on what I have wittenesed at dozens of shows, year after year...and more lately.

Two guards this year were literly laughed at at every show I was at and they were at........

I am not discrediting what you do, I applaud you for your time and effort, Im sure I have applauded you...guaranteed.

But the lack of uniformity, precision and execution is a problem with todays guards and there is nothing that can take its palce...not any dance step, not any prop, not any lift.....equipment work, done with flair and with intent, in regards to execution, to generate excitement is what brings people out of their seats.....example: 2001 Blue Devils Rifles in a block up front....pit playing their arses off....that work was applauded , loudly......more than any hat work or dance routine.

~G~

[eemuam]

Hi guys, I hope everyone is doing well. So this topic interests me a whole lot. This is my take on it... I like where color guard is right now. Now with that being said, I also like the color guards of the past. A lot of people point out the faults of "modern" color guards. In my experience that is a very easy thing to do. Yes... there is a lack of clarity in some guards work. OK... I buy that one... now let's define that. Why? How are the demands different to have changed the clarity. Drill. Yeah... there is one, the drill has changed a GREAT deal in the past years. I really don't think that a guard could march around like the guards of old to that drill and attempt to do anything at all. Dance allows the members to cover more ground and also adds a very interesting aspect to the activity. So does this drill/dance combo affect the work? I would think so. Is this a good change? Opinion... there is NO right or wrong. This is actually one of the more interesting ideas to me. The drill has become harder for hornlines/drumlines and the tradeoff that is observed is more widely accepted than the equivilant changes in color guard. I know I know I know.... there is more to the "dance controversy" than that. Many of you argue that dance isn't a result of need but because people do it just to do it and shake things up. I don't argue that point... my belief with that is that it isn't always bad. If it is good and executed well I like it.

Now here is my biggest beef... generalizations.

Not all guards fit into modern or old school or traditional or whatever you want to call it. Example: I know many of you that are posting on this topic admire what the guard from '88 suncoast did. But!!!!!!!!!!! WHAT DID THEY DO IN THAT SHOW!?!!?!?! Dance, props, dance and props. But simply because it is from your era you view it as innovative. Imagine this.... what would you say if a guard did that same show now. What would your response be? And be honest.

Also who are these modern guards? Example: Flo's guard had an amazing show this winter (I know I am crossing winterguard/drum corps but bear with me) and what did they do? They did dance when it fit and they did equipment when it fit and it was beautiful. Sure, there are guards that don't have it together but I am guessing.... and I could be wrong... that there have always been guards like that. Many of you mention some of the great guards of the past but what about the not so great guards of the past. Compare the top hornline now to one of the average ones of the 80's and I am sure you will get a similar finding. You can't compare apples and oranges. So all I am saying is to be fair and don't take the approach that because it is different it is bad. If guard or drum corps for that matter was the same as it was 20 years ago I would say that our activity isn't all that great. Taking a side on an issue because it is the side you were born into never helps anything... drum corps rules! :) Take care guys. Let me know what you think.

Andy