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DCI finals review


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You didn't highlight my post so I'm not certain you're referring to me. But....just in case, I obviously wasn't referring to EVERYONE who has posted on this thread. Gimme a break. You know what I mean. And you know, we BD fans have two choices: put up with the kind of baseless criticisms that this great corps has been getting or say something.. and I said something. By the way, the corps members are back home now and will occasionally read these posts and I wanted to voice another view so that they know that some of us get it!

wah. you're the new Cadets. guess what...as much as some of us give the Borg a hard time, they took it a lot better.

signed a guy who liked BD 76-90, 92-99, 01-04, 06

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Yeah that was me, and it is a fair comparsion. Some people said that DCI should be in CA for BD to get a proper reaction. BD needs to go where a lot of BD fans are located to get a proper crowd reaction, while SCV can come to IN can get a standing ovation just as loud as it would be in CA. I enjoyed BD's show a lot more live, but the truth of the matter is SCV put on a more fan-centered show than BD, therefore they got the reaction. It's not because the collective midwest is constantly bitter at BD.

I disagree completely. There's a prejudice against BD in the midwest, BD knows it, they even know the stadiums in advance that are generally cold, although this year there were a few surprises. SCV had a great moment this year, they deserve all of the accolades, and my comments are not to deminish that in any way. Just a recognition that these two corps (today) are viewed differently.

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You didn't highlight my post so I'm not certain you're referring to me. But....just in case, I obviously wasn't referring to EVERYONE who has posted on this thread. Gimme a break. You know what I mean. And you know, we BD fans have two choices: put up with the kind of baseless criticisms that this great corps has been getting or say something.. and I said something. By the way, the corps members are back home now and will occasionally read these posts and I wanted to voice another view so that they know that some of us get it!

Someone above called these posts " therapy sessions "?

I agree , I have never seen folks seemingly associated with the winners exhibiting such aungst over the opinions of others.

Why don't you guys write a review and express your opinions that way.

Once again , thanks to all who wrote reviews this year, some of us cannot be at every venue.

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Spot on!! :unhappy:

First off, I know this has been mentioned by others, but this is NOT A REVIEW thread. It is simply yet another Therapy Thread (disguised as a review) designed to help those BD haters cope with their angst. A soap box for the losers gallery if you will..(and by losers I am NOT referring to the awesome competing corps, just the pathetic DCP posters that think they understand it all). The OP's (and others) rants are symbolic of the total lack of understanding of quality design and demand today. My guess is that if they sat down with the other corps show designers and said the kind of nonsense criticisms of BD they have been foisting on DCP over the last few weeks, that most of those designers for the other corps would tell them that they are full of beans. Those designers would speak at length about BD's designs (this year and last year) and speak about the quality and complexity of their design. In fact, Crown and Cadets used several of the nuances BD used last year for their shows this year.

Also, concerning the crowd reaction there are a few things at play here:

1) They're BD and the midwest wants someone else to win for a change! As was said earlier, if this was held at the Rose Bowl the response for BD could be measured on the Richter Scale. At Lucas Oil "some" people sat on their hands because they wanted their corps to be seen as better or they just wanted any winner other than BD. BD could have brought out Osama Bin Laden in handcuffs during their finals performance and that "certain bunch" of attendees would have reacted the same. IMHO the roar from the stands for PR last year would have been far less if BD would have place 4th or 5th...it would then have been purely about PR and not "thank God it ain't BD". Last year they had a vent (raucous applause)... this year they just had to "boo" and/or write "reviews" :thumbup: like this thread.

2) Someone mentioned that the crowd loved SCV and showed it....we all loved SCV but that's not a comparison that works as far as the crowd reaction is concerned. SCV has not won for some time and certainly was not in contention on Finals night...so the crowd could feel free to love them as loud as they wanted. Bottom line: It's not a California thing....it's a BD thing...period!

3) By the way, speaking about applause...you may be interested to know that BD was the ONLY corps on the field that applauded Crown when they won the Ott Award for best brass. THE ONLY ONE!!!! Obviously NO ONE on field applauded for any of BD's Caption Awards (including Crown)...it was sickening to watch. That speaks volumes about the lack of poise and sportmenship both on the field and in the stands. By the way, BD knows this..and fully expects to be treated like this as long as they continue to win at Lucas Oil Stadium! A small price to pay.

4) Finally, before any of you experts feel qualified to know enough about demand you may want to get with someone who can speak to the difficulty of BD's show(s)....like a show designer or choreographer. Instead, the montra of the uneducated on DCP have found several buzz words that they like to use this season to discribe BD such as "simple", "not playing much", "sitting in chairs", "cluttered", "distracting", "uninteresting", etc, all the trite comments that help sooth their hurt because the judging community doesn't agree with them. Most of them would not care to learn the truth, but if any of them would (again) sit down with someone who really understood drill and show design they would explain at length how BD's show was not only off the charts difficult but demanding in terms of individual skill.

Since I am the original poster, I will give you an example of my "hatred" toward BD.....at 2003 finals, I jumped up and stood when they won, because I felt that their musical program, and especially their brass/percussion sections, were far superior to Cavaliers, yet it took nearly all season for that to be recognized.....I also wrote a review on another site in 03 and said that their win was well deserved.................believe me, since I don't know %^&%^ about visual, I will be talking at length to some visual adjudicators so that they can explain in detail how the "what" in the "chair show" was deemed to be deserving of a perfect score....

PS: and I absolutely LOVED the Devs when they played charts such as Channel One Suite, 'Ya Gotta Try, Pegasus, Legend of the One Eyed Sailor too name a few............but I have only heard musical "snippets" (other than pit) out of their brass in recent years.........

GB

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Since I am the original poster, I will give you an example of my "hatred" toward BD.....at 2003 finals, I jumped up and stood when they won, because I felt that their musical program, and especially their brass/percussion sections, were far superior to Cavaliers, yet it took nearly all season for that to be recognized.....I also wrote a review on another site in 03 and said that their win was well deserved.................believe me, since I don't know %^&%^ about visual, I will be talking at length to some visual adjudicators so that they can explain in detail how the "what" in the "chair show" was deemed to be deserving of a perfect score....

PS: and I absolutely LOVED the Devs when they played charts such as Channel One Suite, 'Ya Gotta Try, Pegasus, Legend of the One Eyed Sailor too name a few............but I have only heard musical "snippets" (other than pit) out of their brass in recent years.........

GB

Now we're talking. I promise you that if you did that, you would be astonished (as would many of the posters that are quick to judge BD's design this year) at the level of complexity and risk they have been taking these past two years. Just as a quick example, the chairs are stationary and can't get out of the way or adjust to a passing performer, in addition a guard throw from a chair is a zero tolerance situation (no adjusting for an off throw like on the ground). There are many, many other examples that are not obvious, but a trained choregrapher or drill designer could walk you through and it would blow your mind. In fact, I would be willing to bet that Crown (who is paying attention) is going to use more of BD's nuances in the future (it paid off for them this year, big time!).

Finally, I used the word "BD haters" because everyone else does on here, it's not my word, but I must say that your review seemed like a set up for the punch line which was all about your take on BD.

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Where is the " crowd caption " on the judging sheet ? Look, the Blue Devils accomplished precisely what they set out to accomplish. Probably more. It is rare when the " crowd ' favorite wins the DCI Title ( 2008 being one of those rare years ) Out of the last 20 years, you can count on one hand where the " Crowd " favorite was also the DCI Champion. You, me, and some others may wish that was different, but don't blame the Blue Devils for understanding the judging captions and knowing what it takes to win a title, and being able to execute that in such a fashion that they ran away with the Title in such convincing fashion. DCI is NOT primarily a musical medium anymore. And it's NOT weighted toward the musical side on the judging sheets. It's weighted toward the VISUAL. I'm guessing the frustration lies in the fact that some fans are simply not aware of how DCI scores shows regarding the musical and the visual. And this explains the frustration.

OK, I'll chalk this post up to not reading what I was responding too.

Never once did I mention that BD didn't deserve to win because they weren't the crowd favorite and shouldn't have gotten any GE.

Was responding to the fact that the poster I replied to was stating BD got no crowd love because they weren't on the West Coast.

Not to be a huge jerk, but please read what was referenced before making a post.

I for one agree that GE is not a 'crowd' caption.

That being said...still think it should have been a different result, BUT that has nothing to do with my 1st post at all.

Edited by Kyle B
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1) They're BD and the midwest wants someone else to win for a change! As was said earlier, if this was held at the Rose Bowl the response for BD could be measured on the Richter Scale. At Lucas Oil "some" people sat on their hands because they wanted their corps to be seen as better or they just wanted any winner other than BD. BD could have brought out Osama Bin Laden in handcuffs during their finals performance and that "certain bunch" of attendees would have reacted the same. IMHO the roar from the stands for PR last year would have been far less if BD would have place 4th or 5th...it would then have been purely about PR and not "thank God it ain't BD". Last year they had a vent (raucous applause)... this year they just had to "boo" and/or write "reviews" :unhappy: like this thread.

By far and large you are just wrong. Sure there are some fans who won't cheer/applaud out of hatred for corps. I will admit to being one of those people in the past. But, generally speaking, most drum corps fans reward excellence/excitement when deserved. BD got mild applause based on how clean they were, and I'm sure some who really dug their show, but the masses Saturday night just did not get into the show, not because of any bias, but out of the design not eliciting a response.

Again. . .the crowd went nuts for plenty of other corps that are not from the midwest. I am also betting most of the crowd there were not even from the midwest.

So, what's your next explanation for why everyone doesn't love BD 09?

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By far and large you are just wrong. Sure there are some fans who won't cheer/applaud out of hatred for corps. I will admit to being one of those people in the past. But, generally speaking, most drum corps fans reward excellence/excitement when deserved. BD got mild applause based on how clean they were, and I'm sure some who really dug their show, but the masses Saturday night just did not get into the show, not because of any bias, but out of the design not eliciting a response.

Again. . .the crowd went nuts for plenty of other corps that are not from the midwest. I am also betting most of the crowd there were not even from the midwest.

So, what's your next explanation for why everyone doesn't love BD 09?

oh....cause of Hopkins!

oops wrong corps :unhappy:

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Now we're talking. I promise you that if you did that, you would be astonished (as would many of the posters that are quick to judge BD's design this year) at the level of complexity and risk they have been taking these past two years.

Seriously?

Sitting in row 11 less than 100 ft from the performers in those chairs Saturday I am going to call you on this. There was hardly no dril in and around the chairs. LOTS of posing, sitting, standing, cross/uncross legs, etc. . .but very little drill passing through the chairs. From then on the chairs get placed and drill continues. Yes, visually appealing to some, but no, not high on the compexity meter if you ask me.

Cleanest corps out there Saturday. I don't see anyone disagreeing with that. But can we stop with this charade that it was up there in terms of difficulty with most of the other top corps? Not even close.

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