Incomplete Shows

[84BDsop]

2) I don't know if you ever marched drum corps. If not, it might surprise you to know that immediately following auditions the corps DOES NOT learn the entire show. It actually takes time to first design the show, write the horn book, right the drum book after the horn book, chart out music so the drill designer knows where all of the phrases are, write the drill, learn the music well enough to play it memorized with correct phrasing, dynamics, etc, learn the drill, learn how to play the music while marching drill, write the guard staging, write the guard work, ensemble the entire thing with music + marching + guard work. That's movement 1, maybe 2 minutes of show. Repeat maybe five times. It's a lengthy process that, believe it or not, isn't completed in February.

He's well aware of that... BDB 81, BDA 82-85...I think he knows a little about what it takes to put a top show on the field.

I don't necessarily agree with his solution, but I DO agree that putting out a show that is CLEARLY not complete in any sense cheats the audience. We had a full show when we hit the Evaluation Show in 84...first time out. We NEVER played a partial show...the first time I ever did was 04 Dream. Didn't like it...not the other years we came out and stopped with the ballad, but that was the reality. The only reason I don't think Dream cheated the crowd was MOST of them were in the lot watching the headliners warm up...if anything, THEY cheated THEMSELVES by paying a full rate ticket for 1 or 2 corps....but that's a different argument.

[bluecoats88]

if the show is under the minimum time limit then the corps should get a penalty as stated in the rules. otherwise they just have a shorter show than everyone else, but if the show meets the minimum time limit then they still have a complete show, just a short one.

[Grumpy]

It's a tough call to make... But the incentive should come from the organization itself not DCI.

News flash...the organizations ARE DCI, which is why the OP mentioned a rule change. The corps themselves are the ones that have allowed Bb instruments, electronics and 150 members.

From watching FN, the visual programs this year by most of the corps that were Finalists last year, are nothing short of stunning. If most of them can get their full program on the field by the beginning of the season, there is no excuse for those who cannot. At the very least, as was mentioned very early in this thread, they should play the closer at standstill (which I have seen corps at early shows do, though not for several years). Rewrites are expected, a rewrite means that you took something which already existed and changed it. Part of a rewrite could also involve ADDING things (I think I recall hearing that Spartacus was adding murders as the season progressed), but the premise is still the same-changing something that already existed. I went to a show this past Saturday, paying $40 for my ticket. All the shows I saw were complete. I fully expect that these will not be the same shows I see in the Can in August, but at least I saw complete shows on Saturday. The Cadets show I saw at this show in 2006 had changed quite a bit by the end of the season. One year in the early 2000's I saw BD at this show and absolutely hated their show-when I saw the revised show later that summer, I loved it and it became one of my favorites.

If I had paid $40 to see shows that weren't complete, I certainly would have had an issue with that. If I don't go, that does the show sponsor no good. The sponsor is the Cardinals Alumni and they provide sholarships to a member of each competing corps at their shows-plus local students-and the show sponsor has absolutely no control as to whether the corps will be presenting a complete show. I can't advocate paying them NO appearance fee-the corps still has to feed the kids and put fuel in their vehicles to get down the road, they did show up and they did perform-but paying them a reduced fee compared to those who presented a complete product would be appropriate, IMO.

[amadorj]

I saw a recent post on Jeff Fiedler's Facebook where he noted why SCV show was incomplete this year. The first reason which impacted this year was the conscious decision to have more California kids in the corps this year. Unlike the rest of the country the California school year goes into mid-June which impacts many of the early year mini-camps. Many of the kids didn't get on board with the corps till after the school year completed hence many of the early mini-camps had holes (Memorial Day Weekend). The second reason was the level of difficulty decided for this years show. The corps made a second major decision to go with a difficult show (more so than last year) which meant more practice time to complete the harder show but unfortunately with the late start in getting all the kids there made it not possible to have the complete show by the Stanford Contest. Understand the complete show was put on for the Atascadero show (27June).

Edited July 5, 2010 by amadorj

[rut-roh]

A couple years ago, someone went on and on about how "offensive" it was that shows were incomplete in June. To them, it was "a slap in the face" to the fans. I posted this as a response. Reposted it last year. I suppose I will keep on reposting it every year. I stand by it.

Here's a bit of fun for all you fans of hypotheticals and "drawing the lines"...

Only this isn't really hypothetical.

In 1991 or 1992 (someone please correct me on the specific year), the Cadets of Bergen County came out of the gate in June with several blanks in their drill. Apparently, many members of the corps got food poisoning. Of course, nobody in the stands knew that. They just saw a world class corps with a whole bunch of blanks. Some of them may have even been offended and taken it as a slap in the face. Who knows?

Now, anyone with half a brain would look at that situation in its proper context and say, well, #### happens and it wasn't their fault and I hope everyone gets better soon. They would not be offended. Certainly, I would hope they wouldn't want kids who were not physically able to perform to try and do so. They would understand the situation, hopefully sympathize with it, and appreciate that the corps would carry on to try and entertain the audience in spite of the circumstances they were forced to deal with.

So...

A corps TODAY plans their production schedule around being complete for their first show on, let's say, June 20th. They're a moderately young corps with many high school kids. As such, they have it worked out so that they will finish learning the drill on June 15th and have five days of nothing but cleaning to get ready for that first show. Seems like a reasonable schedule to me, and to them, as they know they will have 95% of their corps moved in by a certain date. They worked it out on paper and it looked like June 15th was the most reasonable and realistic date for them. Even if it rained a few days, they had five days to spare to get finished.

I live in the northeast. For whatever reason, there has been an awful lot of rain and thunderstorms here lately. Sometimes, for several days in a row. A freak meteorlogic occurance? Perhaps. Do the fans in the stands on June 20th know that? Do they care? Or do they just want their 11 and half minutes no matter what? I don't know.

Anyway, back to our intrepid corps. They're in the middle of training, and they've already lost four days to the rain, and the forecast for the follwing week looks like much of the same. They've been getting outside as much as possible to get whatever they can onto the field, but they are clearly behind despite their very best efforts and planning.

A few more problems arise. The sheer volume of rain has saturated their rehearsal fields. Large sections of mud cover the center portion of the field where much of the drill takes place. Kids are getting injured, and the situation at times is not safe, even when the rain stops. The administration of the corps sets out to find a replacement facility nearby to rectify the situation. Every place they call is asking for a fee that the corps simply cannot afford.

Finally, the weather starts to break their way, they get out to the field and manage to finish learning their drill on June 19th. The end of the show is simply a mess. The kids don't feel comfortable with it. The staff doesn't feel comfortable with it. But it has to be learned. It is decided at the end of the day that the corps will get to a certain part of the closer, halt in their set and perform the music portion of the show til the end. In all, about 35 seconds of drill will not be seen by the audience.

This corps did everything they could to deal with the circumstances they were dealt with, the overwhelming majority of which was out of their control. The fans in the stands know nothing about any of this, of course. And here we are...

Do we get upset at this corps and demand our money back? Do we boo? Do we sit in the stands and refuse to applaud because their show is incomplete (even though we're getting a full musical performance)? I know what my answer is.

Afterwards, if we're upset, we find the corps director of that corps and make our feelings known that we don't appreciate being disrespected as a fan like that. He proceeds to explain the circumstances surrounding their training period. All the stuff that we in the stands don't always get a chance to learn about.

Do we remain upset? Do we change our minds and realize that they did what they had to do with what they had? Do we DRAW A LINE? If so, why? Would we draw a line with the Cadets situation from back in the day and not this one? Why?

Just some more food for thought.

When I think of what I expect with the ticket I buy as a fan, I expect each corps to go out there and do their best for me. If their best is 9 minutes of audio/visual and a minute and a half of just music, then I appreciate that...because I know how things go in drum corps, and more often than not, I think these corps deserve (and have earned) the benefit of the doubt. But that's me.

[84BDsop]

A couple years ago, someone went on and on about how "offensive" it was that shows were incomplete in June. To them, it was "a slap in the face" to the fans. I posted this as a response. Reposted it last year. I suppose I will keep on reposting it every year. I stand by it.

Here's a bit of fun for all you fans of hypotheticals and "drawing the lines"...

Only this isn't really hypothetical.

*Big snip*

I would buy that for a corps from an area with actual weather....but for corps from California...not so much. When you can hit the field for drill in January, the weather's a smaller excuse.

[prodigal bari]

I think the solution is simple...all corps must have the full minimum timing on the field for the first show; or face timing penalties, as it used to be. I do not understand cutting this much slack on this and opening an unfair competitive advantage early to those who march short shows..and setting the precedent for short early shows. I do not have a problem with corps marching temporary endings; just let the chips fall where they may according to the products' merits.

Competitve tactics and pacing the development of the show is fine...and is nothing that hasn't been done before; but the corps need to have a full show of some sort on the field when they perform; and if they want to add or change what they have, then that is fine too! Just get rid of the slack judging rules that allow these short shows to have an advantage, and let the products speak for themselves AT THE TIME IT IS PERFORMED.

Edited July 5, 2010 by prodigal bari

[DrinkinOuttaCups]

I think the solution is simple...all corps must have the full minimum timing on the field for the first show; or face timing penalties, as it used to be. I do not understand cutting this much slack on this and opening an unfair competitive advantage early to those who march short shows..and setting the precedent for short early shows. I do not have a problem with corps marching temporary endings AS LONG as they are judged accordingly to its merits.

Competitve tactics and pacing the development of the show is fine...and is nothing that hasn't been done before; but the corps need to have a full show of some sort on the field when they perform; and if they want to add or change what they have, then that is fine too! Just get rid of the slack judging rules that allow these short shows, and let the products speak for themselves AT THE TIME IT IS PERFORMED.

But on the other hand, why waste time on a temporary ending? Why not use that rehearsal time to instead learn the actual ending, but not perform it until it's at an acceptable level as the rest of the show (if that's what the corps chooses to do; they could always perform it once it's learned, even if it's still not clean at all).

[prodigal bari]

But on the other hand, why waste time on a temporary ending? Why not use that rehearsal time to instead learn the actual ending, but not perform it until it's at an acceptable level as the rest of the show (if that's what the corps chooses to do; they could always perform it once it's learned, even if it's still not clean at all).

I do not have a problem with them not performing what they do not want to..or not feel ready to...but there has to be at some point a level playing field of expectations insofar as judging is concerned. That is why there are timing standards....without them; you would have a very unlevel playing field of corps trying to get an undue competitive advantage by using increasingly short shows.

Everyone has the same time on the calendar to put a show together...make EVERYONE play by the same rules; and let the chips fall where they may. Otherwise, it turns competition into a farce.

[byline]

But on the other hand, why waste time on a temporary ending? Why not use that rehearsal time to instead learn the actual ending, but not perform it until it's at an acceptable level as the rest of the show (if that's what the corps chooses to do; they could always perform it once it's learned, even if it's still not clean at all).

I agree with this. I see no point in tacking on a fake ending that's obviously inferior to what's planned as the final product. Time is precious, and I think the most efficient use of time is best devoted to learning, refining and polishing the real thing, not a facade.