Who would win based on pure entertainment value?

[shawn craig]

Scouts easily had the most and best response in Allentown over the weekend.

GREAT SHOW!!!

Sorry Blue Devils but those mirrors are way to distracting; as the show goes on they really become way to much. I really don't remember a single drill move or anything visual other than the mirrors.

I want to enjoy what the MEMBERS are doing; what the DESIGNERS can do is less important to me.

Edited August 10, 2010 by shawn craig

[Plan9]

Please, please don't try and equate Star and BD. Star did some of the most crowd-pandering shows ever, (see 85 and 92, Disney and America.) I mean, come on, how do you not get into that. And you keep making the same argument about the placement. IT'S NOT ABOUT THE PLACEMENT!!!!!!!!!! Look, other people said it much better. It's a polarizing show. It could be in 9th place, doesn't mean I'd like it or dislike it anymore. It's a show that just doesn't do it for me. I've given it many chances, gone in with an open mind again and again, but it still doesn't float my boat, sorry. I do have tons of respect for what they're doing, like always, no one does what the Blue Devils do better than them, which is make whatever they're doing look simple and easy, but I could have lived without this show. Just one opinion.

Bone, The equation I was making didn't have to do with specific show design or performance, I'm not making that linkage.....but it's more about the position both corps find/found themselves with relation to the DCI population. Both had/have a great following and fans that love their shows and both had/have a measured population of those that dislike them and consider them a threat to the activity. And I am absolutely correct (IMO ) that the buzz about BD's show would be much less if they weren't winning (actually dominating).....that simply burns some DCPer's ##### and they are beside themselves. So they try to brush it away by saying, they are performing that piece of #### perfectly. That way, they can rationalize it all and come to some closure. This is the same environment that Star faced...exceptional shows and performance and tremendous push back by the fuddy duddies that were stuck in the past. They wanted/want both punished for their insolence of not doing drum corps the way they think it should done....and when that punishment doesn't happen...they are left to boo or rant about how screwed up the judges or DCI are and going to hell in a hand basket. What a pile! And In fact, I wish Star Alum were playing on Finals night so that they might run into BD in the tunnel and shout as the passed......."We've been there, got that T-shirt!"

[frankdave]

I think this thread might just be the MOST IMPORTANT thread of 2010 !! :worthy:

It clearly states what the general audience thinks of DCI shows as far as design and crowd appeal is concerned.

I really hope that some corps directors will be reading this thread as well as DCI's top dogs.

[soccerguy315]

Well, I think BD is the most entertaining this year, and I'm certainly not a "honk". (If by honk you mean BD is my favorite corps year in and year out..... actually I was a little dissapointed in their show last year). And I really don't feel like I'm the only one in my position.... I can't be that special.

all I'm saying is this (favorite shows):

Person 1:

Corps A

Corps B

Corps C

Corps D

Corps E

Person 2:

Corps A

Corps B

Corps C

Corps D

Corps E

Person 3:

Corps A

Corps B

Corps C

Corps D

Corps E

Person 4:

Corps B

Corps C

Corps D

Corps E

Corps A

Person 5:

Corps B

Corps C

Corps D

Corps E

Corps A

Corps A is the most popular favorite show. BUT, if you look at all of the rankings, if you assigned points 1-5 for each person's preferences, with least liked getting 1 and most liked getting 5, then you will see that Corps B is actually more popular (22 to 17), and that Corps C actually also has 17 points, even though Corps C was never voted in first place. This means that in a poll like the one in the OP, the corps that people like the 2nd most might actually get ZERO VOTES.

[fsubone]

Bone, The equation I was making didn't have to do with specific show design or performance, I'm not making that linkage.....but it's more about the position both corps find/found themselves with relation to the DCI population. Both had/have a great following and fans that love their shows and both had/have a measured population of those that dislike them and consider them a threat to the activity. And I am absolutely correct (IMO ) that the buzz about BD's show would be much less if they weren't winning (actually dominating).....that simply burns some DCPer's ##### and they are beside themselves. So they try to brush it away by saying, they are performing that piece of #### perfectly. That way, they can rationalize it all and come to some closure. This is the same environment that Star faced...exceptional shows and performance and tremendous push back by the fuddy duddies that were stuck in the past. They wanted/want both punished for their insolence of not doing drum corps the way they think it should done....and when that punishment doesn't happen...they are left to boo or rant about how screwed up the judges or DCI are and going to hell in a hand basket. What a pile! And In fact, I wish Star Alum were playing on Finals night so that they might run into BD in the tunnel and shout as the passed......."We've been there, got that T-shirt!"

Okay, I get your point. I feel differently on this, but we will just have to disagree on this one, and we're going to be civil about this one. I get some of the Star references, especially in relation to Star's last year. Part of their problem also was the extreme switch in show design between 92 and 93. (Almost like SCV these past two years,,,,). I actually think that's BD's show this year isn't as far from conventional drum corps as most people are trying to make it. There's fast drill, loud music, a perfect guard, a clean drumline, and last time I checked, that's drum corps right there. not like they came out there without a hornline or anything, just a synth. No, their music is different, and their visual program is slightly changed from the norm, but it's still a drum corps show, so I'm still going to enjoy it.

[BRASSO]

For everyone who questions the judging system...... let's examine this poll even further:

As of now (1:51 a.m. EDT on Aug 10), the top 4 in this poll are:

1.Madison (30.4%)

2.Cavaliers (13.8%)

3.Blue Devils (12.4%)

4.Bluecoats (11.5%)

No other corps has more than 8%......... And what are the current "rankings" of those four corps?....... yes Madison is in 11th, but the other three are ranked 1st-3rd. To me, it seems the judging system does a pretty good job of awarding what entertains the fans.

The Corps show that is MOST different than all the others this year is the retro show of the Madison Scouts. This Corps that probably will not finish in the top 8 at Finals is more than DOUBLING the 2nd most favorite Corps show for 2010. No one can possibly spin this that the audience and the judges are on the same page regarding " what entertains the fans " when the complete and utter runaway fan favorite for 2010 is likely going to finish somewhere between 8-11th place.

Edited August 10, 2010 by BRASSO

[Tez]

all I'm saying is this (favorite shows):

Person 1:

Corps A

Corps B

Corps C

Corps D

Corps E

Person 2:

Corps A

Corps B

Corps C

Corps D

Corps E

Person 3:

Corps A

Corps B

Corps C

Corps D

Corps E

Person 4:

Corps B

Corps C

Corps D

Corps E

Corps A

Person 5:

Corps B

Corps C

Corps D

Corps E

Corps A

Corps A is the most popular favorite show. BUT, if you look at all of the rankings, if you assigned points 1-5 for each person's preferences, with least liked getting 1 and most liked getting 5, then you will see that Corps B is actually more popular (22 to 17), and that Corps C actually also has 17 points, even though Corps C was never voted in first place. This means that in a poll like the one in the OP, the corps that people like the 2nd most might actually get ZERO VOTES.

Yes I understand that....... I know BD is not that entertaining among the general audience... I would even bet that if everyone fully ranked each show, Blue Devils would be around 15th in popularity.

But, I do want people to understand that BD is extremely entertaining to some people... even "the most" entertaining. And if you completely changed the judging system so a show like that would not be ideal (like some people have called for), then you would be taking away what is most entertaining for a significant portion of the fans. I certainly don't want the system changed to take away what the Scouts are doing.

I just wish people had a wider variety of acceptance. Some would have you believe the Blue Devils' show is the worst thing on earth and no one in their right mind could ever enjoy that. Additionally, some people believe the Blue Devils' show designers created it solely for the judges and did not think of the audience at all. Both of these notions are wrong... just look at this poll.

[Tez]

The Corps show that is MOST different than all the others this year is the retro show of the Madison Scouts. This Corps that probably will not finish in the top 8 at Finals is more than DOUBLING the 2nd most favorite Corps show for 2010. No one can possibly spin this that the audience and the judges are on the same page regarding " what entertains the fans " when the complete and utter runaway fan favorite for 2010 is likely going to finish somewhere between 8-11th place.

So where do you think Madison should finish?

I'm not saying the judging system perfectly line up with what is entertaining..... I just think it mirrors it more than people think because of the top 3 ranked corps getting 2nd, 3rd, and 4th in most entertainment.

[BRASSO]

So where do you think Madison should finish?

I'm not saying the judging system perfectly line up with what is entertaining..... I just think it mirrors it more than people think because of the top 3 ranked corps getting 2nd, 3rd, and 4th in most entertainment.

I don't really care where the judges put the Madison Scouts in scores and placements. That's up to the judges. They are looking at it through the prism of" the judging captions". I'm looking at it through the prism of" personal enjoyment".

[Jimisback]

Bottom line !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! OLD SCHOOL BEATS NEW SCHOOL> !!!!!