BRASSO Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 I love seeing Debbie Torchia's scores because they tend to be all over the place. I don't have any corp favorite but I am a fan favorite of her because she always goes out one a limb and doesn't really bother with much of the politics. OK, now hate on me. Debbie Torchia had Boston 2nd in Visual Ensemble tonite topping both Bluecoats and Madison Scouts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shockkwavvv Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 I couldn't tell from that if you agree or disagree with what I said? (sometimes I read sarcasm when it's not there, or read something straight up that was meant as sarcasm...) There was quite a mix of sarcasm and seriousness at the same time lol (I will try to mark things as such next time... I know better than to be a mix of the two through text). Everything in the 2nd paragraph was serious. I was trying to say that, while I think it is a good thing to have a judge who does not slot (wish we had more), it's still just as bad when one is that far-fetched with their scoring, consistently, to a point where bias starts to seem highly plausible. I was agreeing with you. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liahona Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 It's one thing for a judge to disagree with the other judges... that's fine! (That's the whole point of having many different judges, and I believe that is a good thing!) However, being so far off on a different planet is another story. For the record since nero14 didn't think I was serious...I was as serious as a heart attack (thanks craiga)...Historically Debbie Torchia has NOT liked Boston all that much. Tonight was another matter. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Boo Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 I love seeing Debbie Torchia's scores because they tend to be all over the place. I don't have any corp favorite but I am a fan favorite of her because she always goes out one a limb and doesn't really bother with much of the politics. OK, now hate on me. Fans often say they want the judges to react to what they see on any particular night. Debbie is a pro at doing that. She isn't predictable because corps performances aren't predictable. Fans also say they don't want judges to live by and memorize some other judges' recaps. You're not likely to see that from Debbie. The only time some fans get upset with her is when she calls it as she sees it and their favorite corps slip on her sheets compared to those of previous judges. But when their favorite corps jump on her sheets over the sheets of previous judges, then she's proclaimed a visionary who sees things the prior panels have missed. So, I'd prefer to have what some consider inconsistency, which I consider a concerted effort to not be locked into scores that other judges have given. This is not to imply that other judges don't have minds of their own. I think the Judges Coordinator does a great job of keeping everyone on their toes and directs them to reward the corps as they see fit. That's one reason I personally don't buy into the concept of slotting. Yes, as seasons come to a close, certain spreads become much more consistent, but that happens as certain corps and certain sections also become much more consistent. When judges have one's favorite corps doing well, they are praised. When they don't, they are scorned. You've got to have a pretty thick skin to be a judge, and an even thicker one to be a good one. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N.E. Brigand Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 Debbie Torchia had Boston 2nd in Visual Ensemble tonight, topping both Bluecoats and Madison Scouts. Based on the Akron show, I can believe Boston over Scouts in this category (it's close, though), but not Bluecoats. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Boo Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 So is she really here or not? Yes Madison had 4 banks of speakers, at least 2 synthesizers and a plethora of electronic sounds throughout the show...I was HERE, I know, having stood next to one of the FOUR speakers they use. Give me a break! She has lost a lot of credibility in my book.... One must remember due to her advanced age, sometimes she's got floaters in her eyes that obscure everything that's in front of her and her brain takes over, substituting visual memories from two decades ago. In this case, I suspect her brain filled in the blanks and the speakers magically disappeared. That's why Granny can watch Tom Arnold on television and her brain replaces his body with that of Tom Selleck, her favorite stud muffin from years gone by. It's also why she's been scammed in poker by walking away from a winning hand with Monopoly money. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liahona Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 Based on the Akron show, I can believe Boston over Scouts in this category (it's close, though), but not Bluecoats. This was not the Akron show 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonW Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 Ah, what a splendid day for a show. I'm a lousy reviewer(ist?), all you get are notes, hehe! A hawk circled the field and perched on a tower during National Anthem to watch. Was great to see the Kilties again, even if only in exhibition. Both Legends and Colt Cadets were impressive, great solos, no amps or mics needed! Troopers stole the crowd - they had to wait a moment for people to settle down to finish the performance! Colts had many fans in the stands, put on a very enjoyable performance. New unis looked good! Boston has a mighty intriguing show and guard looked absolutely stunning. You gained a new fan this evening. Bluecoats have a real nice, full throated sound. Gotta listen to that one again - made me go buy a t-shirt. Even if wasn't a home show, Madison still would have raised everyone to thier feet. Cavs... whew! Last year was insanely good - this year was insanely even better. There was so much good stuff going on with every corps, I was beaming with pleasure to have been able to attend. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
azul Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 Anyone else notice that Bluecoats are closer to Cavaliers now than the last time they met? This season is freaking intense! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shockkwavvv Posted July 10, 2011 Share Posted July 10, 2011 (edited) Fans often say they want the judges to react to what they see on any particular night. Debbie is a pro at doing that. She isn't predictable because corps performances aren't predictable. Fans also say they don't want judges to live by and memorize some other judges' recaps. You're not likely to see that from Debbie. The only time some fans get upset with her is when she calls it as she sees it and their favorite corps slip on her sheets compared to those of previous judges. But when their favorite corps jump on her sheets over the sheets of previous judges, then she's proclaimed a visionary who sees things the prior panels have missed. So, I'd prefer to have what some consider inconsistency, which I consider a concerted effort to not be locked into scores that other judges have given. This is not to imply that other judges don't have minds of their own. I think the Judges Coordinator does a great job of keeping everyone on their toes and directs them to reward the corps as they see fit. That's one reason I personally don't buy into the concept of slotting. Yes, as seasons come to a close, certain spreads become much more consistent, but that happens as certain corps and certain sections also become much more consistent. When judges have one's favorite corps doing well, they are praised. When they don't, they are scorned. You've got to have a pretty thick skin to be a judge, and an even thicker one to be a good one. So then, according to your theory, on all those separate occasions where Debbie had Bloo much lower than normal, you are saying that she "scored what she saw fit on those nights." Therefore, on three different nights, with her judging a different caption on each of those nights, the Bluecoats just so happened to not do as well in HER caption only. "Darn! That is so unlucky of them!!!"(<-sarcasm) You are missing the point. Nero was pointing out that she is constantly scoring Bloo low no matter the night NOR the caption she's judging. It is not a matter of what happened on a particular night, as you say it is; we aren't talking about one night. Her judging them low in any caption is consistent and starting to become predictable. As I said before, "while I think it is a good thing to have a judge who does not slot (wish we had more), it's still just as bad when one is that far-fetched with their scoring,consistently, to a point where bias starts to seem highly plausible." If the other judges do, in fact, have minds of their own as you say, what then are they consistently missing that Debbie is seeing? OR PERHAPS, is Debbie missing things that the other judges are rewarding? Seeing as though judging is SUPPOSED to be based on achievement these days and not ticks, I would venture that the second question is more appropriate, no? It just seems quite difficult to believe that those fine judges who have minds of their own and experience etc. all agree fairly that Bluecoats are in one ballpark while one judge thinks they are completely in another. And it's not me "scorning" a judge just because "my favorite corps didn't do well." It would be equally ridiculous if Bluecoats were ahead of Cavies by more than a full point in visual ensemble alone. Would I be happy? You bet! Praising Debbie if she did that? no... I would still say that's a little far fetched (along with a crowd of others because of Cavies track record of visual excellence for that matter). Edited July 10, 2011 by shockkwavvv Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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