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you would be wrong on all counts,.........there was guard there,.........more than 50 percussion,........my guess is horns numbers in the 30's,..............

Then how come they announced they would not have guard until after WGI season? I question your source - as my source is their website itself.

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Occording to the information I have from someone who was present at their camp, it was more like 70 percussion and only 20 or so brass. There were some guard members in attendance also.

Makes a big difference in ones opinion when you swing the numbers the other way.

I'll admit, I was giving C2 alot more credit right off the bat than what I should have. Either way- I wish them the best of luck. Now they get to play the "try and keep everyone we can game" like the rest of DCA.

Interesting, considering that their website said there would be no guard until after WGI season. If those counts are correct, that's a lot of fricken drummers.

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you do realize corps field every year that know they wont win, but will go out and give their all right?

as for the hype...no one from C2 is doing that hype. The only people doing that hype is people like you because you see YEA doing something that find to be unethical, illegal etc.

God, you're making me defend YEA. Stop that

Making "YOU defend YEA"? I AM the one "hyping C2 up" (yeah, I'll admit it). I'm the one stating that they have the numbers, the vehicle and the name to make them go all the way. After replying to 3 recent pots from you and now this, I wonder if you seriously are mis-reading which side of this debate I'm really on. I'm clearly vouching in FAVOR of C2. Not the other way around.

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OP ....Your point is taken by others. The others don't post on DCP, ( to which they would support you). But they are out there marching in All Age corps and have felt somewhat slighted like you. I will offer some of their opinions in this post-as there are two sides to every coin. I don't agree with them entirely, as I support Cadets2 decision to go DCA. But because I don't see many coming here to defend your thoughts, I thought I would mention some opinions in support of yours. . Perhaps their thoughts will make others think too....

When announced by YEA....Like the OP, I didn't like the concept of Cadets2 going to DCA. This because I felt Cadets2 could help DCI Open Class make a comeback on the East Coast. I wanted something like the Garden State circuit to happen, where, like a "Target in a strip mall", Cadets2 considered themselves an "anchor corps". Thus, Jersey Surf, Spartans, 7th Regiment, Spirit of Newark, and Raiders would have a stronger Open Class audience in the Northeast. When Crown, Cadets, and Boston were not your anchor corps after July 4th.... Open Class corps could hold their own in providing a great show for fans.

I wanted to see the East Coast Open Class scene, become like the West Coast Open Class scene.

The West benefitted tremendously in Open Class when the Rose Bowl was DCI's site for Finals in 07.. 4 corps Open Class corps in the Southern California formed around this time, including two Alumni groups in Kingsmen and Freelancers. Post Rose Bowl- there is a great regional touring model. and a DCI Pacific Open Class Championship.

My bottom line.....I want to see DCI have more regional touring models like California. So why do I agree with Cadets2 decision? .... In the absence of what was the Garden State Circuit, DCE, and DCI South - The reality is the East has DCA to supplement that model. It has experienced a "Renaissance" in DCA corps coming to field in the same way the West experienced it in DCI due to Finals 07.

Windsor, Fusion, Gold, Alliance,, ...and now Cadets2. More corps, more regional touring opportunity. Hence, Cadets2 more than

enhance that model.

The reality is not DCI- but you still have marching opportunity, and that is what we all want to see. So....Win.

Now, in support of other views....When I hear from friends and others who I either march with am fellow fans with- This is what I often hear....

They don't get why Cadets2 will cap their age, and are more importantly, allowed to do so, when all other corps they compete against allow all age to everyone. why are the Directors of other corps not speaking up at the DCA meetings or otherwise to vote against this? Also, they ask why someone must audition for a DCA corps...it's a foreign concept to them. They also see that being able to come in as an affiliate to the " Marching Music Major League World Champion" - presents an unfair advantage in recruiting. This, when many corps

already struggle to find members. And lastly.....the obvious. ...Cadets changed the way everyone marched drill in the 80s and they

believe in Music is Movement. So will they change drill in DCA to a point...where like "pricing out", they " drill out" other corps.? Will those corps die off because they fall behind those that adopt? The result of changing drill begins to force out the "old guard" in many corps Those individuals who were that nucleus that started the corps - quit. They are the individuals who are most loyal to keeping it going,- These are the guys you count on year after year....while some come and go- this "nucleus" comes back. Now....gone

My friends are not afraid to march, over these opinions, as alluded to in a prior post. But what I think they are seeing with this is a point of being "disenfranchised" so to speak. They march DCA and are not in their early 20s.... So they don't feel it's right to be competing against a corps that will for the most part be- for youth. They feel in many ways there is DCI for that- and

that that DCA should be an alternative to that youth mission of DCI. On an extreme side, they feel it's a gray area that needs to be worked out between DCI and DCA,

The worst part about this...they stop marching cause of a feeling of no longer wanting to be there. I think it's like being in a marching

purgatory for them They are not yet wanting to standstill and play as alumni...but at the same time dont want to march 150 to 200 pages

of drill to march against a corps that has an average age of a DCI corps. They are somewhere in the middle.of the current state o things. They would march DCA2 - " The Senior Division but not yet Alumni Division" if there was one.

I will be marching this season. At 34, I am not yet in " marching purgatory.". I look forward to seeing Cadets2 play "To Tame the Perilous Skies" and bring back 92......Well, one can hope.

But what I don't want to see is friends of mine give up, nor others blow up after we see the results in Annapolis. I am having a hard enough time convincing friends to march because they already feel that DCA has gone the way of youth. Now with a corps that has an

age cap...it has become harder....

But, I guess if they don't march,,,,,thats them, Not me.

Great post!

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Interesting, considering that their website said there would be no guard until after WGI season. If those counts are correct, that's a lot of fricken drummers.

Most corps do not have much in the way of guard rehearsals until WGI season has ended. Still- most corps encourage prospective guard members to attend the open house to meet the staff and learn about the upcoming program.

I would find it hard to believe that any corps would turn away prospective guard members unto WGI season ends since not everyone participates in WGI, although it is certainly a factor.

A similar situation applies to percussion during the winter.

Point being- that doesn't mean guard members weren't at the first camp.

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Ohhhh....KAY...and this disproves my point how? I mean, obviously you agree that C2s numbers are higher than most (if not all). Glad you agree with me. What's your point?

No C2's numbers were not higher than most. If anything, they were below average. Most of the Top 5 corps will have upwards of 150 bodies at their first camp. This is usually a well rounded number of 50% brass, 35% percussion and 15% guard.

If C2 had largely percussion there and their brass numbers were low (half of what other corps have) than they have their work cut out for them for now.

Unless they plan on fielding a 30 person battery and 30 person front ensemble, they will have to balance out their numbers.

Look: anyone who has been in this activity long enough will tell you the first camp weekend mean nothing. An open house is exactly that: an open house.... A no commitment required first rehearsal for prospective members to check out the program.

What makes the difference is what their January- March numbers are. Those three months are key to building a championship drum corps.

With all the C2 hype in the region and with the closed recruitment at the large USSBA shows I would have expected a much better turn out. That's maybe the only thing one can take away from the first camp.

Edited by irishbugle
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Making "YOU defend YEA"? I AM the one "hyping C2 up" (yeah, I'll admit it). I'm the one stating that they have the numbers, the vehicle and the name to make them go all the way. After replying to 3 recent pots from you and now this, I wonder if you seriously are mis-reading which side of this debate I'm really on. I'm clearly vouching in FAVOR of C2. Not the other way around.

I learned early on that Jeff Ream crushes most of his competition on here. I know of someone who directly opposed Jeff in a discussion and they ended up on the floor of their bathroom in the fetal position that evening.

(this is a dose of sarcasim mixed with humor)

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I learned early on that Jeff Ream crushes most of his competition on here. I know of someone who directly opposed Jeff in a discussion and they ended up on the floor of their bathroom in the fetal position that evening.

(this is a dose of sarcasim mixed with humor)

That's the point. I'm not sure I'm his "competition". He appears to agree with everything I'm saying. He's literally affirmed every point I've tried to make in his last few posts. Me thinks he's mis-reading my posts and slotting me on the wrong side of the discussion.

But in any case, none of what you said either intimidates me or impresses me. You have not seen me long enough yet to know how I am. I mean look...I'm pretty much standing alone on this whole thread (with like TWO people coming in behind me in defence) and I'm still standing confident and tall. I can hold my own, thank you.

Edited by drumcorpsdrummerman2012
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I just do not see WHY this thread keeps continuing. (Cadets2 question - "Why DCA?".)

The answer is because they want too. They are no different than any other Corps under the Curent DCA Rules. (Not that what they are planning please's me. It does not.) But they do have every right to do what ever they want.

As far as I know there are no "Rules" that say anything (must have or can not have), about an Upper Age limit, Sex, Race, Religon or National Origion of members in any Corps In DCA.

So if you want add, change, remove, or re-word anything. 2012 IS a Rules Congress year. That is where this and any other thing must be done.

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