corpsband Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 The "age of consent" varies state to state and they're all between 16-18 yrs old. So to be diligent, would you have to go by the state you are in, or the state where the corps originates? Plus, unless there is a complete breakdown in the culture of the organization, I find it doubtful anything would happen during scheduled showers. There's too many people and very little time. IMHO, I would be more concerned about situations where a kid is not allowed to march due to injury or illness since they spend most of their time alone/unsupervised while the corps is practicing. Are students over the age of 18 given background checks and segregated from the rest of the student population at a high school? What about summer camps? Do *roles* have something with who gets those checks? Do *roles* define the interaction between members and staff, between members - members, between staff - staff? What's "obligatory reasonable care" ? Just wondering... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Brace Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 Please clarify: Are you saying that the rest of the Board would be curious as to why you would be bringing up that potential issue, and then question you as why you were on the Board in the first place? If that is the case, then you are saying the Board is actually complacent when it come to minors and adults being in particular situations. I think there are/were Board members in drum corps who aren't qualified to be Board members. I also think there are many in management positions who aren't qualified either. I think most of the instructional staff is qualified to do what they do. But, beyond that...I've seen my share of messes out there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 I think there are/were Board members in drum corps who aren't qualified to be Board members. I also think there are many in management positions who aren't qualified either. I think most of the instructional staff is qualified to do what they do. But, beyond that...I've seen my share of messes out there. So, there is a need for board and staff to have open discussions concerning due diligence when the corps is acting "in loco parentis"; correct? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Bad Bari Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 So, there is a need for board and staff to have open discussions concerning due diligence when the corps is acting "in loco parentis"; correct? Absolutely there is a need for both BOARD and STAFF to have these discussions and once policy is reached, then it needs to be delivered to the members. And that is exactly where those discussions belong... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Brace Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 So, there is a need for board and staff to have open discussions concerning due diligence when the corps is acting "in loco parentis"; correct? no. The employee of the Board is generally the Executive Director or...in some cases the Corps director. I believe the Board should never be meeting directly with anyone other than their direct report...Executive Director or Corps Director. Board = Fundraising - Long Term Sustainability - Global Policy Making Executive Director/Corps Director - Reports to Board - Answers to Board - is Responsible to Board. You want Board out of the day to day operations of the drum corps. In fact, by this time of year, they should be working on their season ending and after season fundraising efforts. By know...schedule has been out a month so they know the timing on these events. Also, all the long range planning..where will the activity be in 5 years...in 10 years should be continually discussed. Also banging on the doors for more grant money. Write those grant proposals! In your scenario, this issue would only come up in an annual audit of procedures and practices. That would be timed as soon after the season as possible and with the corps accounting and legal help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim K Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 (edited) This thread seems to be shifting from a discussion about parental advice to legal and moral issues and if the reluctant mother is reading these comments, the poor lad will spend all of his time in the library which is where I spent a great deal of time of as a kid, but that' another story. Because of the ages of the people involved with drum corps, the appropriateness of young people of various ages mixing, background checks, responsibilities of adults toward corps members, and the like have more gray areas than straightforward youth or college activities would. Only Scouting and perhaps church activities would have similar circumstances, but in this day and age, it is expected that any organization involving young people would err on the side of caution. As a matter of policy, anyone over 17 should probably have a background check. Chances are most young people would not have any problem with this since corps can decide what would be disclosed and could eliminate driving offenses, shoplifting, etc. Corps need only to check for drug or sex offenses, and chances are they would never be turning someone away as far as members are concerned since juvenile records are sealed. It is commonly done with Scouting and doesn't seem to be an issue. All volunteers should have thorough background checks, no question. For many organizations this is policy. Any "best practices" manual from insurance companies suggest this and often require it. Some have mentioned age of consent, and I know I mentioned it in one of my posts. I think it is true that it varies from state to state and it's at least 16, but my guess is that in nearly all states it is 18. Even if something happened between a 16 year old in a state where it is legal, if there are any, the older participant may not face criminal prosecution, but the corps could face civil lawsuits and all the waivers in the world will not protect the corps from liability. Anyone under 18 is expected to be supervised at all times, and while no parent could ever do this, that's not to say they don't expect close supervision at all times by an organization acting "in loco parentis" and if anyone in a corps ever said in court there's no way a young person could be supervised at all times, they may as well just write the check and say goodbye to the house. If drum corps as an activity has not learned from the mistakes of the Catholic Church, the YMCA, Boy Scouts, Boys and Girls Clubs, and countless other organizations that work with young people, that those under 18 need to be protected, then no one should march under the age of 18. Now as I say this, my guess is that those who run individual units do take these things seriously, would carefully watch younger charges and would not tolerate those who would violate their safety. Edited January 9, 2012 by Tim K Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soccerguy315 Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 I don't think that corps leadership breaks up summer "relationships" between those over 18 and those under 18. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted January 9, 2012 Share Posted January 9, 2012 This thread seems to be shifting from a discussion about parental advice to legal and moral issues and if the reluctant mother is reading these comments, the poor lad will spend all of his time in the library which is where I spent a great deal of time of as a kid, but that' another story. Because of the ages of the people involved with drum corps, the appropriateness of young people of various ages mixing, background checks, responsibilities of adults toward corps members, and the like have more gray areas than straightforward youth or college activities would. Only Scouting and perhaps church activities would have similar circumstances, but in this day and age, it is expected that any organization involving young people would err on the side of caution. As a matter of policy, anyone over 17 should probably have a background check. Chances are most young people would not have any problem with this since corps can decide what would be disclosed and could eliminate driving offenses, shoplifting, etc. Corps need only to check for drug or sex offenses, and chances are they would never be turning someone away as far as members are concerned since juvenile records are sealed. It is commonly done with Scouting and doesn't seem to be an issue. All volunteers should have thorough background checks, no question. For many organizations this is policy. Any "best practices" manual from insurance companies suggest this and often require it. Some have mentioned age of consent, and I know I mentioned it in one of my posts. I think it is true that it varies from state to state and it's at least 16, but my guess is that in nearly all states it is 18. Even if something happened between a 16 year old in a state where it is legal, if there are any, the older participant may not face criminal prosecution, but the corps could face civil lawsuits and all the waivers in the world will not protect the corps from liability. Anyone under 18 is expected to be supervised at all times, and while no parent could ever do this, that's not to say they don't expect close supervision at all times by an organization acting "in loco parentis" and if anyone in a corps ever said in court there's no way a young person could be supervised at all times, they may as well just write the check and say goodbye to the house. If drum corps as an activity has not learned from the mistakes of the Catholic Church, the YMCA, Boy Scouts, Boys and Girls Clubs, and countless other organizations that work with young people, that those under 18 need to be protected, then no one should march under the age of 18. Now as I say this, my guess is that those who run individual units do take these things seriously, would carefully watch younger charges and would not tolerate those who would violate their safety. corps and winter programs doent even do cecks on staff...some states schools do but I can tell you of several fellons working within DCI as well as WGI programs...YES..I do think they should not be allowed ( if convicted )but I can tell you its not like that let alone checking kids. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perc2100 Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 Are students over the age of 18 given background checks and segregated from the rest of the student population at a high school? I know this thread has spiraled wildly out of control from the original intent, but are you insinuating that the average high schooler's interactions on a day-to-day basis are anywhere similar to a drum corps marching member's interactions on a day-to-day basis?! I think anyone that has marched in a nationally touring drum corps knows that marching member on tour has a wildly different experience than a freshman going from class to class in HS. I get that your point is likely that kids encounter a lot of stuff daily and are probably more prepared for drum corps based on their life experiences than some think they are (and I don't disagree with you, depending on the kid: I know 21 year old students who are not mentally prepared/mature enough for a DCI national tour ). But let's not get crazy with hyperbole... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff Posted January 10, 2012 Share Posted January 10, 2012 I got a red negative for merely questioning if it is proper for a 21 year-old adult who can drink alcohol to be showering with a 14 year-old youth; are you kidding me? I was 12 when I started, my brother was 10. Average age of the corps was 19. We managed just fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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