mckdan Posted July 17, 2012 Share Posted July 17, 2012 I don't want to come off like some Texan with an ego that is as large as the state. But at some point Troopers are going to have to realize that Wyoming is too small and too isolated to make it an attractive place for the best and brightest staff and members to make the trek to. Either driving for hours or making multiple airport connections just to get to the camps. And all this just to march in a corps that is unlikely to make finals again anytime soon. So maybe it is time to do a Crossmen and go to where their is an abundance of eager kids that would love to march corps, but may not want to travel cross country in order to do it.. Troopers should look into the possibility of moving to Texas. Their look and tradition would fit very nicely here.... plus they already have the hats. You don't have to freeze you behind off during winters camps..... and yes you do eventually get used to the heat. We may have the dumbest governor in the country, but sooner or later he will retire and when does leave the collective IQ of the state will go up significantly. Twenty-five million people are already here and growing by leaps and bounds, so that is a pretty nice sized talent pool to draw from. Just ask Bluecoats, Cavies, Crown, ect.ect. Troopers have already done a "Crossmen"! They have most of their camps out of Wyoming and truely they only seem to keep the Casper part of the Troopers to keep funding. I think that the corps should pull a "Madison" or a "Spirit" and try to return back to their roots a bit more. I think that the Infinity Chord should be a new tradition, but, the sunburst is an absolute necessity! Use more of the western style music but in a different way. Jazzify (is that a word) more of the Troopers standards and increase the difficulty of the marching and music over the pre-2006 era. This corps will always be a part of drum corps and they need to take advantage of the collective memories of 50+ years. Good luck Troop and do your best to shock the world this year! Remember the ghosts of '79 and 2009! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
burgerbob Posted July 17, 2012 Share Posted July 17, 2012 (edited) Mr. Burger, My post is laced with my opinion, but I submit to you here on this day that is more objective than yours. You contend that the judges "want more of the new." I'm afraid they didn't get the memo, so you might want to let them know that this show really should be up around 11th place or so. One of the adorable qualities of the Troopers is that virtually nobody says anything critical about them. The year they made finals there were some who argued that the Colts should have been in that 12th spot, but they did it in a very soft-handed way. Well it's pretty hard to candy-coat it all this year...wouldn't you say? The Troopers have strayed from their identity and it's a shame. You can bemoan this and try to turn this into a "kids don't wanna wear cowboy hats" kind of argument, but the sad reality is that their shows are simply not connecting with people and their scores are lousy. And...on top of it...they're still wearing cowboy hats and kids are still marching. I post this as a challenge to the Troopers: Return to your historical identity. Put some music on the field that is recognizable and that hits people in the face and heart. Do some old-school stuff that harkens back to a bygone era and be America's Corps.! Just be YOU! My posts are also laced with opinion, and a very biased one at that, I just finished marching there. Plenty of people say critical things about Troop, especially on here. That's why we were told not to even get on DCP when I marched. I daresay we get forgotten more in people's predictions more often than a lot of other corps. It's difficult to get back to our identity when we have not had one for years. None of the current staff has marched Troopers (we had one guy on brass staff from '07 until last year). They bring little pieces of the corps they marched, even unintentionally. You could bring in a whole staff of Troopers... but a whole new staff seems kind of counterproductive. There's no getting back to that identity unless you want to tell the current staff to just ignore everything they've taught for the last five years. Edited July 17, 2012 by burgerbob 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kdaddy Posted July 17, 2012 Share Posted July 17, 2012 maybe they just didnt do it well? I think it's more this. Also, worth noting that while the show they're doing isn't a shootem up western, they ARE playing Copland. It's also worth noting that corps in 10th on down are going to tend to shuffle a bit. Spirit has been in and out of finals the past few years, finishing as low as 17th in 2009. Colts, after years of being a finalist corps, have been to finals once in the last 12 years (and have finished everywhere from 13 to 16). Maybe Troopers are similar - maybe stars align and they finish in the top 12 every few years. One other thing... in 2009, Troopers had Dean Westman, Gordon Henderson, and Ralph Hardimon, among others that year (that they lack now). 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
musclebud Posted July 17, 2012 Share Posted July 17, 2012 Troopers should hold winter camps in Denver and get an airline sponsorship from United, Continental or Southwest with comp tickets for members to fly in for camps in exchange for logos and appearances. Unfortunately Continental is no more and United is cutting back on flights right and left and not particularly stable. And as for Southwest ...I would rather walk. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
musclebud Posted July 17, 2012 Share Posted July 17, 2012 Troopers have already done a "Crossmen"! They have most of their camps out of Wyoming and truely they only seem to keep the Casper part of the Troopers to keep funding. I think that the corps should pull a "Madison" or a "Spirit" and try to return back to their roots a bit more. I think that the Infinity Chord should be a new tradition, but, the sunburst is an absolute necessity! Use more of the western style music but in a different way. Jazzify (is that a word) more of the Troopers standards and increase the difficulty of the marching and music over the pre-2006 era. This corps will always be a part of drum corps and they need to take advantage of the collective memories of 50+ years. Good luck Troop and do your best to shock the world this year! Remember the ghosts of '79 and 2009! I didn't want to insinuate that Troopers should give up any of it's longstanding traditions or any of the western roots they symbolize.. But I would rather see a strong and vibrant Troopers than no Troopers at all. Every year I wear my old and worn out Troopers shirt to as least one show. People come up to me and ask if I marched with them ..... I tell them no, but I wish I had. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TerriTroop Posted July 17, 2012 Share Posted July 17, 2012 To address the camps question: this year all camps from November through March were in the outskirts of Houston at an excellent high school facility - much easier weather to contend with than anything near the snow zone, and very easy transportation. A solid core of alumni and parents were present to help with transportation, food and other logistical support. Auditionees and members were able to use the Troopers' equipment as the truck was there the whole time. This process worked very well and I suspect it may happen again. As to the original thread itself: I am a die-hard Trooper fan, and you all know it. I am simply going to say thank you to all who have shown your support of the Troopers by participating so respectfully in this discussion. I will also add on a personal note that I was so excited about the theme of this show. But.... it needs to be sold more to the audience - perhaps by a solo guard member or some other mechanism. I like the music and it sticks in my head, but I've written several academic works on Copland and have an unusual familiarity with the various styles of Copland during his career. So, this music makes sense to me. It is not at all surprising to me, however, that it doesn't connect well with more people. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeerMan Posted July 17, 2012 Share Posted July 17, 2012 Troopers will cease to exist without being competitive. It sounds harsh, but we have literally the hardest time in DCI recruiting. Just look back to the 90s-2005, where the corps wore older-looking uniforms, scarves, and used G bugles. We were bottom of the barrel and membership was at an all time low. If it means sacrificing some of that "identity," then you'd better get used to it if you want to see Troopers survive. I talked to a staff member last year about Troopers history. From the beginning, Troop started the touring drum corps model, invented asymmetrical and curvilinear drill, the rifle for the guard, etc. After a certain point, that stopped. This staff member (who was a soloist for a top corps recently for a few years) said "Innovation should be the tradition." I know everyone (and I use that loosely... plenty of people hate the Troopers look) loves the old uniform and style, but it doesn't work today and will result in the corps dying, again. Take it from someone with experience. Sorry BB, I know we're LBL brothers, but all of this is just excuses. I don't like the new uniforms. But obviously that isn't the problem here. Innovation is fine, but almost never successful when it's undertaken by a bottom feeder corp. And guess what we have become again. So how has this "sacrificing our identity" been working? You don't have to answer that. I think it's pretty obvious. The way Troop is doing right now, they might as well still be playing G bugles, wearing old uniforms, and playing old cowboy tunes. Just think how much money they could have saved. It's not like they would be a lot lower in the standings. BeerMan 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
burgerbob Posted July 17, 2012 Share Posted July 17, 2012 Sorry BB, I know we're LBL brothers, but all of this is just excuses. I don't like the new uniforms. But obviously that isn't the problem here. Innovation is fine, but almost never successful when it's undertaken by a bottom feeder corp. And guess what we have become again. So how has this "sacrificing our identity" been working? You don't have to answer that. I think it's pretty obvious. The way Troop is doing right now, they might as well still be playing G bugles, wearing old uniforms, and playing old cowboy tunes. Just think how much money they could have saved. It's not like they would be a lot lower in the standings. BeerMan It isn't working for one regional. The last few years have all been higher than 16th. I wouldn't call that bottom-feeder. Every corps has a year or two off like this (if that's even what it is) as mentioned in a previous post. I think they'll get better and work some things out this summer. Also, my complaint is that they're not innovating enough... not that they've done too much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doylejd Posted July 17, 2012 Share Posted July 17, 2012 (edited) I think the larger issue isn't straying from tradition, it's just that the design isn't as good as 2009. I have a massive amount of respect for David Reeves, but it's just not feasible for one man to construct a complete musical design as well as a team of people. Especially when that team included Dean Westman and Ralph Hardimon. Edited July 17, 2012 by doylejd 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daave Posted July 17, 2012 Share Posted July 17, 2012 Correct me if I am wrong, but didn't same team that brought them 2009, also bring them 2010? Nobody "Wanted" that season. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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