TROOPERS! Where are you?

[Martin I. Zing]

I couldn't hum (or recognize without prompting) anything Lady Gaga has ever recorded, so clearly those two aspects of music aren't that related.

I think you've proven my point. In 5 years, the same number of people will be able to hum Lady Gaga's Medley of Hit(s) as can today hum Star of Indiana's. But you see there are probably a thousand people on this Forum who can hum tunes from past Troopers shows with a tear in their eye. Are you capable of understanding the bigger picture?

Edited July 17, 2012 by Martin I. Zing

[ecamburn]

Granny,

Let me begin by saying that I respect your thoughtful, well-reasoned, articulate posts. I also very much appreciate your wry sense of humor! I also agree with your argument in a broad sense that the Troopers shows of the last couple of years lack excitement. Drum corps after all is a very dramatic, dynamic art form, and of course we expect that excitement would be a natural outcome. Personally, I wouldn't go so far as to say the Troopers have "failed" the past two years though.

Watch out Troopers! Grannies knickers are on fire!

[crest99]

The underlying dynamic in this thread, which is surprise and disappointment that the Troopers are not more competitive this season (filed under "needs more sunburst"), actually points to the enormous success of the corps since its reorganization. Back when I marched in the early 2000s there wasn't much question of the Troopers' competitiveness because, put simply, they weren't. Now the assumption is that they should be competitive, and that's pretty cool.

Creating, conserving, and adapting a corps' identity is about more than putting on a scarf or charting a drill move. Think of other old and venerated corps that have climbed out of the ranks of the also-rans with a more contemporary look and program while still preserving their traditions: Blue Stars, Boston, and Spirit, to take more recent examples. No, they don't look like they did in the 1970s. But most of us would agree that they are still clearly the same corps. And if you talked to the members, staff, and board, I'm sure you'd still find that they have the same values as those that came before them. That's even more crucial than a look or sound.

The other thing about identity is that it is a dynamic and ongoing process. What the Troopers have (by all appearances) gotten right recently is their financing, staffing, and overall quality of experience provided to the members. That's what will ultimately keep bringing old members back and new recruits in the door, more than the repertoire or superman suit or placement. Finding a clear, appealing, and competitively successful identity on the field may take some more time, and yes, perhaps this year they missed the mark. But it looks like the corps is healthy and will be around for a bit, so be patient while they figure out what works for them.

[GUARDLING]

The underlying dynamic in this thread, which is surprise and disappointment that the Troopers are not more competitive this season (filed under "needs more sunburst"), actually points to the enormous success of the corps since its reorganization. Back when I marched in the early 2000s there wasn't much question of the Troopers' competitiveness because, put simply, they weren't. Now the assumption is that they should be competitive, and that's pretty cool.

Creating, conserving, and adapting a corps' identity is about more than putting on a scarf or charting a drill move. Think of other old and venerated corps that have climbed out of the ranks of the also-rans with a more contemporary look and program while still preserving their traditions: Blue Stars, Boston, and Spirit, to take more recent examples. No, they don't look like they did in the 1970s. But most of us would agree that they are still clearly the same corps. And if you talked to the members, staff, and board, I'm sure you'd still find that they have the same values as those that came before them. That's even more crucial than a look or sound.

The other thing about identity is that it is a dynamic and ongoing process. What the Troopers have (by all appearances) gotten right recently is their financing, staffing, and overall quality of experience provided to the members. That's what will ultimately keep bringing old members back and new recruits in the door, more than the repertoire or superman suit or placement. Finding a clear, appealing, and competitively successful identity on the field may take some more time, and yes, perhaps this year they missed the mark. But it looks like the corps is healthy and will be around for a bit, so be patient while they figure out what works for them.

I think that was a good assesment...people want to see their fav corps progress BUT if it involves change, a change that may be diffrent from what they remember or relate to then many dont like this. it wasnt that long ago that Blue Stars were getting bashed page after page for going to an un recognizeable shako...Well guess what..not a discussion anymore

Edited July 17, 2012 by GUARDLING

[mizportis]

The underlying dynamic in this thread, which is surprise and disappointment that the Troopers are not more competitive this season (filed under "needs more sunburst"), actually points to the enormous success of the corps since its reorganization. Back when I marched in the early 2000s there wasn't much question of the Troopers' competitiveness because, put simply, they weren't. Now the assumption is that they should be competitive, and that's pretty cool.

Creating, conserving, and adapting a corps' identity is about more than putting on a scarf or charting a drill move. Think of other old and venerated corps that have climbed out of the ranks of the also-rans with a more contemporary look and program while still preserving their traditions: Blue Stars, Boston, and Spirit, to take more recent examples. No, they don't look like they did in the 1970s. But most of us would agree that they are still clearly the same corps. And if you talked to the members, staff, and board, I'm sure you'd still find that they have the same values as those that came before them. That's even more crucial than a look or sound.

The other thing about identity is that it is a dynamic and ongoing process. What the Troopers have (by all appearances) gotten right recently is their financing, staffing, and overall quality of experience provided to the members. That's what will ultimately keep bringing old members back and new recruits in the door, more than the repertoire or superman suit or placement. Finding a clear, appealing, and competitively successful identity on the field may take some more time, and yes, perhaps this year they missed the mark. But it looks like the corps is healthy and will be around for a bit, so be patient while they figure out what works for them.

As a former Troop parent, this explains my daughter's reasoning for marching Troop in 2008, 2009, and aging out in 2011 with Troop. She knew that marching Troop in her age out year wasn't a guarantee to march Saturday night in Indy but she wouldn't even think of jumping corps and marching Crown in 2011. (We are from NC and her peers in her World Class Winterguard were trying very hard to get her to march Crown with them). She loved the experience that she had with the Troop family and wouldn't have it any other way. As a parent, I loved the way they took care of her through her various injuries and needless to say the bus accident.

This is a first class organization and I feel that the people who are running it are trying to return it to the corps many of you remember.

[MisterA]

I have to say, I really enjoy their music this year, compared to last year. I think it is a much better musically written show. The drill could definitely use a little work, and cleaning, and the colorguard would maybe benefit from a new perspective possibly. But guard has been an issue for the last 5 seasons as well.

Troopers have managed to do what very few corps have done though, they have taken a year off, and have come back to the activity, and managed to last 5 seasons. With very few exceptions, this has hardly ever happened. For that they deserve the ultimate respect. Let's hope they can continue, and with fan support, they probably will. So let's all support their souvie stand this summer, and drop some $$ into the bucket as well.

Now to address a few comments from earlier in this thread. Personally I thought the comment about them not getting talented members at their auditions was kind of sad. They are getting some very talented musicians and performers. However, the vehicle which they are given to perform is what is lacking, in my opinion. I think the members are performing it very well.

Granny also mentioned some people on the forums who disagree that Troop should have made finals in 2009. I am sure I am probably one of the people on here who have mentioned it at several points. For this I have been called a Colts parent(my children are in their 30s and never marched corps), and a Troopers hater. It is funny, because I don't have any ties to any of the corps that placed in the 12-17th range that year. I just honestly believe Troopers should have been in 16th or 17th place that year, based on their show and the performance. It was a very good show from the Troopers that year, but there were shows that were better written and better performed. But sometimes the storylines get in the way, it wouldn't be the first time DCI has scored corps weird because of politics, storylines, and other odd things. My wife and I love Troopers, and hope for the best for them. We have bought souvies from them in recent years, and have put some money in their gas fund as well(as we do with as many corps each season as we can). But personally, sometimes I think an overscore or placement one year, can come back and bite them in the rear in the future. I remember the next year, people predicting them as high as 8th place. Unfortunately, their show once again was written in the level of a 13-17th place corps. And then when they don't place place at the level as the year before, people start to get a little bitter/antsy/upset/frustrated, etc.

I think Spirit is another really good example. They made finals in 2002, after being out for many years. Then after a few years, fell out again. There were several years where their shows lost focus and the drill design was just very weak and searching for something. Then last year, something once again connected, and this year, they have really built upon that. And the fact also is, that the corps that are placing from 13th-18th this year, are all very good. Troopers could slip even further this year, once Pacific Crest gets into the mix. Or they could end up cleaning and adding, and go up a few placements. But honestly, sometimes I think too many people put success on the placement. I would much rather have a Troopers corps that places 20th, as opposed to having a summer like 2006, when they weren't even out on the field. I mean seriously, this is their 6th season back out. I haven't heard any horror stories that the kids aren't eating, and that they aren't getting water breaks, or that their busses are in horrendous condition.

I do hope they continue to improve their program, and in years future try to stay as close to their roots, while performing great shows. But for the first time since the late 70s, I can honestly say I like their music more than 2 of the top 3 corps in the Minneapolis show. Maybe I should rephrase that a bit. I definitely like it better than the Cadets music, which I have a hard time listening to after hearing it the first time. And at least they don't talk over 1/3 of their show like the Blue Devils do this year. So yes, people are going to complain about everyone, including the corps that are placing in the top 5. But just remember, there are worse alternatives than being 16th, or 18th, etc.

[Granny Smith]

I don't know of anyone who has said anything negative about the front office for the Troopers. Clearly they have done a great job of reorganizing and providing a solid foundation for what happens on the field.

The only reason placement is an issue for me is because recent scores/placements serve as a rebuttal to those who claim that the Troopers need to change their persona in order to compete.

The entire thrust (can I use that word on this forum?) of my post is that the Troopers need to embrace their DNA. Buy into their label of being "America's Corps" and strive to be the fan favorite.

[GUARDLING]

I don't know of anyone who has said anything negative about the front office for the Troopers. Clearly they have done a great job of reorganizing and providing a solid foundation for what happens on the field.

The only reason placement is an issue for me is because recent scores/placements serve as a rebuttal to those who claim that the Troopers need to change their persona in order to compete.

The entire thrust (can I use that word on this forum?) of my post is that the Troopers need to embrace their DNA. Buy into their label of being "America's Corps" and strive to be the fan favorite.

embracing your DNA is very cool being a slave to it isnt

[Guardguy89]

I agree with the fact that the show this year just isn't connecting - and it does seem to be a recurring theme in alot of 13 to 20th place corps. It's like they purposely come up with esoteric themes, cool program names that just don't translate into a coherent show or cliched ideas (enough with the color shows!!!)

But I have to say I absolutely loved Troopers show last year - it completely mesmerized me when I saw it live in Allentown. I really thought they should have been 12th!

Later,

Mike

[Tim K]

I won't be seeing the Troopers until Allentown so I cannot comment on this year's show. I do know when they march on the field they'll have a fan in me, because, well they are the Troopers. I will also say I like the current uniforms and will give the corps credit for performing difficult shows, but at times something is missing. Though the Troopers can still have their moments, like the original poster, I may be applauding as much from nostalgia as anything else.

I can understand why Troopers have a hard time recruiting. I know the current membership hails from all over the country and has camps outside of Casper, they are still perceived as a local corps. I think the fact that they did reorganize and continue to field a corps is a credit to the organization. Comparisons have also been made to Madison as far as musical tradition and identity are concerned, however there is a major difference. When Madison pulls "oldies but goodies" from their past such as "Slaughter" or Malaguena," they can be updated to sound fresh and new. I'm not sure Troopers could do that with their historic repertoire. I do think they could add the sunburst to their drill. Their look, even though it's been updated, also lends itself lf to a certain persona, but without the look they're not the Troopers.

I'm not sure I have any advice for the Troopers, but I do for competitors. In 1972, 73, and 74, no one questioned Troopers making finals. In 1975 they would not have placed if Muchachos had not been disqualified. 76, 77, and 78 many wrote off the Troopers as all but dead. In 1979 they had a rough early season but made finals to everyone's surprise. 81 was iffy but they made it. In 1985 they easily placed but in 1986, many predicted it would be 27th who would gain the 12th place spot, not Troopers. Even in 2009 it was very close. If history repeats itself for one of drum corps' historic icons, Troopers could be stronger by the end of the season, because with the Troopers you never know.