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CaliforniaDCfan

Did VK fold?

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Hold on thaaaar, Baba Looey!

The Kilts appear to be stable and fiscally responsible. They do what they do in DCA and are liked. Placements, not the best, but they do seem to have a stable structure that keeps them afloat. There's also not the stew of drama, inept management and lack of stable financing that seems to be the issues with VK and the Racine Scouts.

So, pulling them into that categlory might be more a tad unfair, huh?

I'm saying that just as an observer- I have no fingers in the Kiltie's apple pie/vested interest, man. :satisfied:

AND, I must ask, how do you know about this "stew" you mention in your post? or are you just going by whatever everyone here is saying? smart, very smart!! Let it be people and instead of going on here bashing corps, help them out, lend them a hand, or at the very least, clear up any issues you have with any of them, with THEM not in a public forum. I wish VK and Racine only the best in their future! :thumbup:

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VK is mostly remembered for doing silly shows with giant paper mache sharks, not their competitive placements.

Yep; this not very high placing, oops, extremely high placing VK line sure is silly!

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AND, I must ask, how do you know about this "stew" you mention in your post? or are you just going by whatever everyone here is saying? smart, very smart!! Let it be people and instead of going on here bashing corps, help them out, lend them a hand, or at the very least, clear up any issues you have with any of them, with THEM not in a public forum. I wish VK and Racine only the best in their future! :thumbup:

A corps shuts down mid season. That alone in and of itself calls things into question. Don't be so defensive nor as naive as you appear to be, "Mr. see you". Something is seriously wrong with management when a corps can't make it though a tour. I guess you're the 'see no evil' monkey of the trio when a group can't evidently keep membership nor their commitments, nor run things in a fiscally responsible way to competently finish out a season. Help them out? How? Would I trust a corps that evidently can't manage their season competently with any donation? Absolutely NOT.

As for clearing up issues, the corps management of both those corps needs to clear up THEIR acts. I don't care WHAT the cause, it's morally and ethically questionable when corps management can't get things done right enough to manage a tour properly and honor their commitment to their members- no excuses are acceptable.

Don't you even dare to try and pin me with owning the problem and divert blame from those who richly deserve it. I'm not the one who took kids money and then failed to honor my side of the contract. I don't care WHAT the feeble excuse is or the lame reason. It happened with these corps, and that is more than enough to point a finger.

So, what fingers in what pie and vested interest do YOU have in this? Do YOU plan on setting up something similar, or are/were you in on it?

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A corps shuts down mid season. That alone in and of itself calls things into question. Don't be so defensive nor as naive as you appear to be, "Mr. see you". Something is seriously wrong with management when a corps can't make it though a tour. I guess you're the 'see no evil' monkey of the trio when a group can't evidently keep membership nor their commitments, nor run things in a fiscally responsible way to competently finish out a season. Help them out? How? Would I trust a corps that evidently can't manage their season competently with any donation? Absolutely NOT.

As for clearing up issues, the corps management of both those corps needs to clear up THEIR acts. I don't care WHAT the cause, it's morally and ethically questionable when corps management can't get things done right enough to manage a tour properly and honor their commitment to their members- no excuses are acceptable.

Don't you even dare to try and pin me with owning the problem and divert blame from those who richly deserve it. I'm not the one who took kids money and then failed to honor my side of the contract. I don't care WHAT the feeble excuse is or the lame reason. It happened with these corps, and that is more than enough to point a finger.

So, what fingers in what pie and vested interest do YOU have in this? Do YOU plan on setting up something similar, or are/were you in on it?

Well, my apologies indeed to you, I had NO idea you had all the facts of what exactly happened with these corps. I also had no idea they didn't tour at all. I wish them all the best no matter what, and can't wait to see them on the field once again and for many years to come.

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Hold on thaaaar, Baba Looey!

The Kilts appear to be stable and fiscally responsible. They do what they do in DCA and are liked. Placements, not the best, but they do seem to have a stable structure that keeps them afloat. There's also not the stew of drama, inept management and lack of stable financing that seems to be the issues with VK and the Racine Scouts.

So, pulling them into that categlory might be more a tad unfair, huh?

I'm saying that just as an observer- I have no fingers in the Kiltie's apple pie/vested interest, man. :satisfied:

My response was to Danielray. He stated that since VK had not reached the competitive success of the original version they should either make "radical change or pack it in". My sarcastic response pointed out that both the Kilts and Racine Scouts have not had the competitive success as in their history and that maybe they should "pack it in" also. I just wanted to point out that just because a corps does not score as well as it once did, it still may be viable.

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Well, my apologies indeed to you, I had NO idea you had all the facts of what exactly happened with these corps. I also had no idea they didn't tour at all. I wish them all the best no matter what, and can't wait to see them on the field once again and for many years to come.

Enough facts exist that something's not right/competent with management. I repeat- you can't finish a tour and kill it mid-season, something's clearly not right. THAT is FACT enough.

And for you not to understand they went down mid-season, someone else may need to do their fair share of fact-checking in the matter, Hmm?

I've seen my fair share of incompetent/malfesant management out there, including the corps in which I am an alumni-- and what they do to a corps, its members, and to the alumni is inexcuseable. I will not sit back and just "wish people well and hope for the best" when corps management takes advantage of paying members and don't honor their ends of the bargain. I get tired of those cream-of-wheaty kind of posts when something is clearly wrong with the corps management. It's enabling behavior and gives them permission and encouragement to continue down the same path.

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My response was to Danielray. He stated that since VK had not reached the competitive success of the original version they should either make "radical change or pack it in". My sarcastic response pointed out that both the Kilts and Racine Scouts have not had the competitive success as in their history and that maybe they should "pack it in" also. I just wanted to point out that just because a corps does not score as well as it once did, it still may be viable.

It's cool, Don. I wasn't sure of you were being sarcastic or serious. Kindly note my main beef is against poor/inept/incompetent/possibly malfeasant management.

I can see where one could make a strong argument placement could play part of that evaluation. It's not important to me. Here's why.

Where I'm coming from, A World Champion corps went under because of management/lack thereof. If corps management can be responsible in a business sense, make sure fiscally that a corps remains viable and has a future, and also honors its promises/contracts/agreements with its membership, I could care less about placement/how good the field product is in this topic.

And yes, it is a subject I'm extremely strident on. When I see the same kinds of things that happened to my corps- I've hoped lessons were learned and that more people would be on the lookout for flim-flam/incompetence and speaking out against it instead of feebly "wishing people the best and hoping they make it". Weeding out the bad apples might save a corps. And that's problematical and not likely....

Edited by BigW

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Maybe it's time to tell the two Racine corps (Scouts and Kilties) to pack it in too.

Don,

I can't speak for the Scouts, but I can attest to the fact that the Kilties are doing just fine. The corps is on pretty solid financial footing and we're coming off our highest competitive placement (9th place at DCA last year) in several years, so I don't see any need for us to "pack it in" whatsoever.

WWBD

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You got a problem with VK management? Take it up directly with them... I did. The email address is corpsdirector@vkyao.org. In the mean time... the answer to the OP is... No, VK did not fold. They ended a tour early (rightly or wrongly, that is NOT what we are debating here). VK is coming out for the 2013 season.

Thread closed.

Edited by Cainan
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