Oops

[fsubone]

they are on their own - DCI/show sponsors, alumni & their own network are useful

Thanks, that's what I had figured. In that case then they'll have to pay to rent the facility, correct?

[Wadep66]

I don't know who you are but thank you very, very much for your hard work for the corps - all of them. I feel your pain and all these people not getting our angst need to realize that bi*ching about a bad housing site in the South is shooting themselves in the foot.

You Cadet apologists: Try living and going to school at those places you think are "inferior" in the South full-time. Our taxes pay for those facilities, as "bad" as they are. Our kids go to school there - and like us make their memories there that will sustain generations. We volunteer our hours there as PTA participants - at the concession stands on football Friday nights - and at the band contests on Saturdays. Those are our facilities, our gymnasiums, our practice fields...and our kids that we are darn proud of. Fact is we'll run circles around you all week and twice on Sunday.

Actually I DID go to school in the south, went to a public university and then move deeper south. The community here lost the support for the school system with the desegregation law suits that totally destroyed the neighborhood schools. Most that I work with pay an outrageous fortune to send their kid to private school, which looks to me to be a huge waste of money from what I can tell. This has caused many of the "halves" to pull their support for public education and vote against every single tax measure and improvement on the ballot. This coupled with the lack of neighborhood schools has made these systems some of the worst in the country. Then, these are also likely the type of people whining that Hop made a bad comment about their area.

I don't get it. I think he's right. He isn't a politician. He isn't hired to sugar coat things and be sweet to everyone and tell them what they want to hear. You certainly don't win DCI that way. Was it a PR mistake, yes. But the man makes mistakes. Part of his mistake is being so transparent that those who like to throw stones will criticize.

I'm not apologizing for Hop at all. He made a mistake. i respect him for what he does, the number of hours and soul he puts in it, and despite what you might think, has been pretty darn successful at it. Nobody says you have to like him. Or even respect him.

But you do need to get over the idea that everyone thinks where you are is great. Go around the country and get some perspective.

[skevinp]

.

Well, this perfectly ugly thread has turned absolutely normal.

Whoops, never mind.

Edited July 22, 2013 by skevinp

[drumcat]

Thanks, that's what I had figured. In that case then they'll have to pay to rent the facility, correct?

They'd be responsible for rent if there is any, but often the corps that have to stay multiple days will get put with the facilities that won't charge, or minimally charge. This is why you see corps staying at the same sites when possible; the trust is often built up over years. Band directors pull favors with districts, or make sure it's an educational experience for their kids, etc., and the corps pay nothing or minimally with these facilities wherever possible.

The point is it's not always free, and in many cases, shows are moved or dropped not because people don't show at the gate, but because either a stadium or school district gets a higher rate to rent, or a mandatory facility usage fee that's unaffordable.

This is why "burning" a housing site is so frustrating... it is usually a quid pro quo with an educational opportunity and an under-capacity facility, making a show more affordable. The horse-trading is essential for many shows to come out "in the black". Drum corps summer touring would be DOA if you had to do hotels all summer, but school districts sometimes see these things as opportunities to get something for their kids.

Finally, shows usually try to put the "big acts" in their better facilities because they draw more ticket purchases compared to the money they have to give in "show pay". If a corps like the Cadets are on the lineup, the likelihood of tickets sold goes way up, but they still pay them the same as... well, whatever a second-tier name in the top-tier show pay bracket is.

A lot of this goes back to fundamental G7 arguments, suggesting that they should be making more per show since they were the "big draw", and the opposing viewpoint of equal pay for equal costs.... blah blah blah...

Just my experience. I've been a tour director and an operations coordinator, and I've seen all of this first-hand, albeit all was 10+ years ago.

HTH.

[euponitone]

Interesting...if it's "standard procedure" I hope there isn't a statute of limitation on being paid, because I've got a BIG check coming . I (my school) hosted corps annually for almost 30 years. At times as many as 4 corps at once.

Got some free tickets to the show, but not a single dollar.

Our school NEVER charged the corps for using our facilities or for custodial costs. Frequently our boosters would even provide a meal for them.

I would also mention that the great majority of the corps were very appreciative of our hospitality. I can only remember a couple that I put on our "will not host again" list.

And no...I won't name them. The kids were great, but their staff were a PITA. And no...Cadets were NOT one of the PITA corps.

Yeah - you are about 5 pages late. We've been over this, and I admitted that I was wrong...at least as it pertains to show days.

As fast as this thread moves, i cant blame you though

[euponitone]

I wonder what he'd do if a band came to a USBands competition and then complained publicly as he's done...

You probably aren't involved in USSBA are you? Plenty of complaining, and much of it very public. Perhaps its representative of the leadership and trickles down?? ;)

Seriously though - directors, staffs, and parents have issue with all the circuits around here. Discontent with the old competitive circuits is one reason USSBA grew so fast 10 years ago....

[garfield]

You probably aren't involved in USSBA are you? Plenty of complaining, and much of it very public. Perhaps its representative of the leadership and trickles down?? ;)

Seriously though - directors, staffs, and parents have issue with all the circuits around here. Discontent with the old competitive circuits is one reason USSBA grew so fast 10 years ago....

Actually, my brother judges for USBands, so I hear plenty.

But not via FB.

[JimF-LowBari]

I find it very odd that there is a perception that a person can post something on the internet and it should be considered private. No matter what, if it's on the internet, there is no real privacy, nor any right to it. This is something we teach at our school specifically. No matter what "privacy" settings you use, once it's out there it's TOTALLY out there to anyone, even if you think you've covered your privacy bases. Any person in who has access to "private" information on the internet has the ability to copy and paste anything, and there's not a darned thing a person can do about it once that happens. Mr. Hopkins is no internet newbie, and I bet we can all agree that he is fully aware of this aspect of the internet.

So, when he wears his frustrations on his internet sleeve the way he did this time, why would anyone be surprised or upset that there is backlash? It was inevitable, and fully understandable, given the nature of the comments. That's the way this was going to play out the minute that statement went on the internet. Period.

Must be the age Terri as might as well shout it from the rooftops if it's an open Forum like FB. Niece posted something onFB we adults shouldn't have seen and seemed surprised we saw it (But it was just for my friend...). Mebbe GH is hanging with the 'yutes' <$1 to My Cousin Vinnie> too much.

My surprise with GH is he upset people helpimg corps with housing and practice facilities, etc but he apologized to the CORPS and not the people who were insulted. Just so many ways to read that but not going to guess what is going on in his mind.

Edited July 22, 2013 by JimF-LowBari

[TerriTroop]

*snip*

I don't get it. I think he's right. He isn't a politician. He isn't hired to sugar coat things and be sweet to everyone and tell them what they want to hear. You certainly don't win DCI that way. Was it a PR mistake, yes. But the man makes mistakes. Part of his mistake is being so transparent that those who like to throw stones will criticize.

I'm not apologizing for Hop at all. He made a mistake. i respect him for what he does, the number of hours and soul he puts in it, and despite what you might think, has been pretty darn successful at it. Nobody says you have to like him. Or even respect him.

No, actually he is the leader and public face of a highly visible organization in our beloved activity. As such, he shouldn't be engaging in unnecessary public negativity. This IS a political position as much as it is a management one. He's already got a certain reputation among many in the stalwart drum corps fan base, but that base isn't going to affect his organization in any significant way. However, the base of schools and school districts all over the country are a different story. You're right that nobody has to like him or respect him, but in his capacity as the public face of the Cadets he probably should be willing and able to avoid showing public disrespect for certain entities that are offering their considerable material support (housing and rehearsal space, often for free) to this activity, no matter where they are in the country.

[CuriousMe]

People need to get over themselves. This whole incident is just more evidence supporting the premise that people enjoy being "outraged and offended."

What didn't George say:

The south is terrible, southerners are terrible, southerners are uneducated, the town was a dump, the school was a dump

What did George say:

He doesn't like bringing the corps down south because they have problems getting what they need in housing and that on this trip "we do not have the sites we need to truly get to work."

So, they chose to not stay at the brand new 50 million dollar school, to stay at a school that wasn't a brand new 50 million dollar school. It was obviously NOT because they thought the original school wasn't good enough for them.

Additionally, the whole point of the post wasn't to whine and complain, but to use the corps' network of alums and supporters to find an alternative. It's hard to do that "privately" as some have suggested.