When will Eastern corps travel (Mid)West?


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To add to Ws post about Larrys transparency...

Larry: "... and this is a DCA show"

Newbie: "Why are we doing a DCA show and come in last. Why don't we do an RCA show and win for once?"

Larry: <pause two seconds.. NOT a good sign> "Because... we can get more money coming in last at DCA than coming in first at RCA.... THAT'S why". <tone of voice that dropped the tempetature 20 degrees>

I wasn't there but I can imagine that whole scene perfectly, man. :thumbup:

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I completely agree that it's high time corps like Reading and Hawthorne at the very least make a trip to another region. It makes perfect sense for Reading to travel to Minnesota, and for Hawthorne to

Tie it into a DCI regional?

Nope. Not yet, anyway. Maybe your post will generate some of that. Personally, I don't see how one of the top couple DCA corps making a single trip someplace far away will have any impact on DCA, esp

Is it for the "good of the activity" that non Eastern corps travel to finals and other East shows every year? I would say that it is. The expansion of the all age brand throughout the nation has lead to increased exposure and quality of all DCA corps. Do you feel that the Bucs would be as good as they are if MBI wasn't around? Would class A be better without the Govies? Renegades, CV, Alliance,etc. they have all brought something great to DCA. Losing non-eastern corps from finals would hurt the activity.

I would say that it would have the same result eventually if eastern corps perform in different parts of the country. That competition and exposure of the true quality of the all-age activity would lead to increased awareness, financial support, recruiting, audience, and branding for DCA. It may encourage more to take an interest in the weekend model for drum corps, one that I feel may be the future for our activity, and therefore increase the quality and size of our participants.

Sure, when you think on the small scale of what is best for this year, "our corps," or our region, it makes a ton of sense to keep with the status quo. It works well for the Eastern Corps, but does it work well for the future of the all age activity? I think that it would be better to take the longer view. The one that is beyond the one bus bill, or the 200 extra people in the stands. The view that we all get better when we support each other. The view that even though it is a pain, traveling brings the non-eastern corps together. It is a model that can work if there is a priority to growing the activity and not just looking out for ourselves.

Obviously, it takes planning and can't be done every year initially, but shouldn't we be spreading our brand of drum corps in as many parts of the country as possible? We have something great to offer.

I think that if it is an established show with a decent facility and audience at first it might work. Maybe a new show eventually, but not for a while.

I agree with a good chunk of this.....but....here's the thing. Do we know say Bucs or Cabs going out there will draw that much interest? There are still way too many people going to shows in the midwest that blow off the DCA corps. Bringing Bucs or Cabs in isn't going to change a lot of their minds.

:ph34r:/>

Come on Jeff - I would think my buddy "Big Tooz" might tend to disagree with you..The evidence of this in reverse is already clear...Remember how "PO'd" you felt when DCA got Brass to come into the Scranton show a few years back? Partially because you said your self you might not have bought tickets for both nights in Allentown had you known they were going to be in Scranton earlier...Everything I remember hearing is that a lot of other people didn't get enough notice to make other plans...

Granted, the region would be starting a bit behind, but after what Tooz and RonH said about how MBI operates, I would think there is a better than average chance to make it work. Personally, I respect the s### out of your opinion, but unless you've walked a mile in their moccasins(appropriate footwear - geographically) don't sell us outsiders short..But it DOES take two to tango..I suspect that the MBI wizards would know when to "fish or cut bait" if either the money couldn't be raised - or the experiment is a blatant failure..We've faced more and larger obstacles than this..We're still here, dude. :thumbup:

Big Tooz - thanks for the previous post..I still don't see the force field being such an obstacle to everyone..Hang in there my friend..you still have a lot of folks behind you, even if i want to kick your butt every once in awhile.. :tongue:/>

Pat

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I don't disagree that in the short term there would need to be some investment and small gains, but having real competition and more quality would encourage attendance and awareness of the DCA product.

I think even a break even would be a win. BUT, the expenses are pretty daunting. Also, work issues (1$ to Sam S.). Hawthorne to Minneapolis is a 19 and a half hour run non-stop. Racine is 14+ hours.

Reading to Racine is 13 and a half hours. I think Amy's laid out the expense and logistics.

It's a very hard sell. One would, could, and should make a case that money might be better spent on assets to enhance the corps for the long term. It's not easy to make it happen even when the economy is strong. Larry taught all of us to think with the head first when making these kinds of business decisions, the heart later.

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It sounds like you've already done the research! Rather than everyone else duplicating your efforts, is there any chanced you could post your findings here as garfield did for the DCI corps?

Top Five DCA Corps, 2011 (Last year the returns are available for all 5) Ranked in order of Total Assets

Corps / Income / Expenses / Net Assets (Assets - Liabilities)

Minnesota Brass / $326,000 / $258,902 / $575,727

Hurricanes / $154,528 / $183,941 / $38,879

Empire Statesmen / $212,784 / $210,253 / $26,752

Buccaneers / $172,868 / $196,976 / ($18,414)

Caballeros / $143,533 / $153,195 / ($65,443)

Edited by Ron H
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Thank you!

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I think even a break even would be a win. BUT, the expenses are pretty daunting. Also, work issues (1$ to Sam S.). Hawthorne to Minneapolis is a 19 and a half hour run non-stop. Racine is 14+ hours.

Reading to Racine is 13 and a half hours. I think Amy's laid out the expense and logistics.

It's a very hard sell. One would, could, and should make a case that money might be better spent on assets to enhance the corps for the long term. It's not easy to make it happen even when the economy is strong. Larry taught all of us to think with the head first when making these kinds of business decisions, the heart later.

Atlanta to Hornell...20 Hours

Atlanta to Downingtown...18 hours

Atlanta to Annapolis...14 hours

Not trying to rock the boat...just sayin'.

Dan

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I don't disagree that in the short term there would need to be some investment and small gains, but having real competition and more quality would encourage attendance and awareness of the DCA product.

ok.....but......how will it encourage attendance? If people in the region aren't following much DCA action to begin with, what will magically make people appear just because those corps showed up? Those corps are at best names they may see on DCP or the electronic version of DCW.

Think about it...in the Northeast, the region where you do get fans for DCA, you have MBI coming in once a year, and at best you see an added 200 people showing up. I mean this year you had the top two corps the last 4 years together....add in last year at Barnum with Cabs who were number 3....and that show draws on it's own. So if in the hotbed you're getting at most 200 people, what makes you think in a region where DCA is largely ignored it will draw enough bodies to even make a dent in the expenses?

As Amy said, sure they sold roughly 200 more tickets than last year ( i was 2 of them....had a month old baby last year, couldn't go). But expenses went up. Jimmy and the committee at Bucs have done a wonderful job since taking over in the 90's, but they're not idiots......they are not going to willingly lose money "for the good of the activity". And if they were to work a deal that covered their expenses, the host is sure to take a bath. Looking at guidestar no one's really making much on their shows out there unless it involves DCI corps.

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Depends on how you define "loaded." MBI has more money in the bank than the other top 9 DCA corps combined. (Well, you'd maybe have to exclude C2 if you count YEA's resources) MBI has the largest budget. Their assests are greater than Phantom Regiment's. This is all on public record if you do the research. They did it based upon financial prudence, diversification of income and on top of that, they can still afford to go out east twice per season.

THAT's the model that other DCA corps need to follow if this activity has any chance of long-term survival.

Doesnt MBI also run 3 other ensembles (along with the full corps) under that "Incorporated" umbrella?

Could explain the large gap between them and other organizations.

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As Amy said, sure they sold roughly 200 more tickets than last year ( i was 2 of them....had a month old baby last year, couldn't go). But expenses went up. Jimmy and the committee at Bucs have done a wonderful job since taking over in the 90's, but they're not idiots......they are not going to willingly lose money "for the good of the activity". And if they were to work a deal that covered their expenses, the host is sure to take a bath. Looking at guidestar no one's really making much on their shows out there unless it involves DCI corps.

Doesnt seem to stop the non eastcoast corps.

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:ph34r:/>/>

Come on Jeff - I would think my buddy "Big Tooz" might tend to disagree with you..The evidence of this in reverse is already clear...Remember how "PO'd" you felt when DCA got Brass to come into the Scranton show a few years back? Partially because you said your self you might not have bought tickets for both nights in Allentown had you known they were going to be in Scranton earlier...Everything I remember hearing is that a lot of other people didn't get enough notice to make other plans...

Granted, the region would be starting a bit behind, but after what Tooz and RonH said about how MBI operates, I would think there is a better than average chance to make it work. Personally, I respect the s### out of your opinion, but unless you've walked a mile in their moccasins(appropriate footwear - geographically) don't sell us outsiders short..But it DOES take two to tango..I suspect that the MBI wizards would know when to "fish or cut bait" if either the money couldn't be raised - or the experiment is a blatant failure..We've faced more and larger obstacles than this..We're still here, dude. :thumbup:/>

Big Tooz - thanks for the previous post..I still don't see the force field being such an obstacle to everyone..Hang in there my friend..you still have a lot of folks behind you, even if i want to kick your butt every once in awhile.. :tongue:/>/>

Pat

I'm not every fan. I follow DCA religiously and base my summer plans around their schedule if at all possible.But here;'s the thing...of the people that arent coming to the shows out there, how many of them even know who Bucs or Cabs even are?

Trust me I want it to work for you and everyone. But I also know what a pain in the ### it was driving a bazillion miles and playing to a not packed house in 89, and how many #### parades we had to do the rest of the year to make the books balance after that trip. And if you look at our visual scores in 89, you can see the time spent on parades would have been a helluva lot better spent rehearsing to get those scores up.

Here's what I say...talk on DCP is cheap. Make the offer they can't refuse. if they refuse then it's on them.

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