BushDad1213 Posted September 17, 2013 Share Posted September 17, 2013 (edited) So why don't you provide an example of one time YEA shut out DCA corps from performing at one of their shows in the last two seasons, one where C2 did perform. Go on, we'll wait. Seriously? Did you see the word IF? It was stated before me that YEA PROBABLY wouldn't allow it, and it reminded me of the recruiting thing. There was no precedence and I never inferred one. Well, it very easily could be a logistical limitation on vendor space, in an area vendors actually have to pay for there, even for independently-run events. But if it's that huge a deal, Bush could always start it's own band circuit... And it's not a vendor space limitation thing. I was there last year. YEA won't allow it. I was stating that it bugged me, not Bush. Edited September 17, 2013 by BushDad1213 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigW Posted September 17, 2013 Share Posted September 17, 2013 I can't speak for appearing at Cavalcade of Bands, but Bush has been at ACC's for TOB on many occasions. I don't know how I'd have missed them. Then again, don't ask me what I had to eat two days ago. You did bring up something important just now that's kind of been skirted around but never really nailed, and I've been forgetting to do it on this thread: One of the main reasons DCA was founded was to give member corps a lot more leeway and freedom about how they ran their operations. The last thing a DCA corps wants... believe me, is anyone holding guns to their heads for that very reason. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BushDad1213 Posted September 17, 2013 Share Posted September 17, 2013 (edited) I don't know how I'd have missed them. Then again, don't ask me what I had to eat two days ago. You did bring up something important just now that's kind of been skirted around but never really nailed, and I've been forgetting to do it on this thread: One of the main reasons DCA was founded was to give member corps a lot more leeway and freedom about how they ran their operations. The last thing a DCA corps wants... believe me, is anyone holding guns to their heads for that very reason. And I do understand this. With all the talk about "the good of the activity", I, personally, think it's not a fair practice. As far as the corps I'm involved with, we do hit Cavalcade and TOB shows just about every week, but there are many each week. TOB has 13 shows this coming Saturday, alone. And we did get in a local USBANDS show yesterday. TOB didn't allow ANY recruiting tables at Class A ACCs and that's fine. Last year Surf had their trailer out in the parking lot in Harrisburg with a flag flying and that was it. USBANDS doesn't allow any recruiting at Championships except Cadets and C2. I don't like it. I don't think I'm alone in that opinion either. And I think I'm allowed to have that opinion, last time I checked. Edited September 17, 2013 by BushDad1213 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigW Posted September 17, 2013 Share Posted September 17, 2013 And I do understand this. With all the talk about "the good of the activity", I, personally, think it's not a fair practice. As far as the corps I'm involved with, we do hit Cavalcade and TOB shows just about every week, but there are many each week. TOB has 13 shows this coming Saturday, alone. And we did get in a local USBANDS show yesterday. TOB doesn't allow ANY recruiting tables at ACCs and that's fine. Last year Surf had their trailer out in the parking lot in Harrisburg with a flag flying and that was it. USBANDS doesn't allow any recruiting at Championships except Cadets and C2. I don't like it. I don't think I'm alone in that opinion either. And I think I'm allowed to have that opinion, last time I checked. Not disagreeing with you nor your thoughts, actually. The thing is, USBANDS is YEA!'s sandbox to play in and they can do what they please with it, regardless of how any of us perceive what is or isn't fair. They perhaps over-aggressively promote their brand, and it can be a real two edged sword as a result. I think part of the frustration you have may be the "perceived value" issue by a parent like you, and it's extremely legit for a Mom or Dad to ask why the membership tuition/fees/dues in total are significantly higher in C2 than with anyone else in DCA that I'm aware of. With no one else there to compare with at another recruiting stand... those kinds of hard questions don't get asked. And from my experience, when I have asked those questions, they wiggle a lot in an uneasy way and I really don't get answers. I get evaded. But-- I'd think a smart parent would look into that sort of thing and discuss it with their kids. At least I'd hope so. It's why I ended up where I did, cost and distance were significant factors in my case. I still came out ahead in the long run. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bossop Posted September 17, 2013 Share Posted September 17, 2013 For the past 7 years Minnesota Brass through great financial expense and member time used has traveled eastward mid-season to perform and compete against corps that we used to not see until finals. The results of that are a rather mixed bag. On one hand, that mid-season show often isn't the best product we can give due to various travel related factors, but on the other hand it's hard to argue the fact that our placements have remained fairly high since we started the consistent early season trips in 2007 (no trip in 2008). I know we have some financial genius' as part of our administration who are able to wrangle 3 (if you include Racine) significant trips out of our budget every single summer and still are able to keep our dues and member expenses to a reasonable level, but surely some other corps can do the same. Will a Eastern corps ever come this direction? My Crusaders Sr. Corps, an alumni non-competitive corps, traveled to White Water twice in the earlier years of our existence. Most of our members are older now and long trips aren't preferable to long naps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Matczak Posted September 17, 2013 Share Posted September 17, 2013 No other corps in DCA has direct ties to High School marching band competitions, that I know of, well, in that sense.............no other drum corps since the beginning of the world has the position George does,.............. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kamarag Posted September 17, 2013 Share Posted September 17, 2013 (edited) TOB doesn't allow ANY recruiting tables at ACCs and that's fine. Last year Surf had their trailer out in the parking lot in Harrisburg with a flag flying and that was it. USBANDS doesn't allow any recruiting at Championships except Cadets and C2. I don't like it. I don't think I'm alone in that opinion either. And I think I'm allowed to have that opinion, last time I checked. Since when? I know in 2011 Cabs had a fantastic table (manned by Mike Ryan) for both days, as they had in the years previous. So did Surf. I don't recall if they did last year, though I'd be shocked if they both didn't. Edited September 17, 2013 by Kamarag 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted September 17, 2013 Share Posted September 17, 2013 Not sure how you think it "restricts" C2, when their parent organization is doing the restricting. No other corps in DCA has direct ties to High School marching band competitions, that I know of, and most schools in other competing organizations, and the sanctioning bodies(TOB, Cavalcade, etc) do not allow one corps to recruit, while discouraging, or flat out blocking others. Bucs seem to be involved with Cavalcade. Cabs and Surf have participated in ventures like the All Star Band with TOB. ties, ties, everywhere are ties. and yes, TOB has refused YEA participation at their events. Well refused is a harsh word...lets say ignored the requests. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted September 17, 2013 Share Posted September 17, 2013 (edited) And I do understand this. With all the talk about "the good of the activity", I, personally, think it's not a fair practice. As far as the corps I'm involved with, we do hit Cavalcade and TOB shows just about every week, but there are many each week. TOB has 13 shows this coming Saturday, alone. And we did get in a local USBANDS show yesterday. TOB doesn't allow ANY recruiting tables at ACCs and that's fine. Last year Surf had their trailer out in the parking lot in Harrisburg with a flag flying and that was it. USBANDS doesn't allow any recruiting at Championships except Cadets and C2. I don't like it. I don't think I'm alone in that opinion either. And I think I'm allowed to have that opinion, last time I checked. incorrect again. The last several years, since the move to Hershey, the following units has recruiting tables at ACC's: Jersey Surf Hawthorne Caballeros Bushwackers Chesapeake Percussion and I know I am missing someone. Now not everyone went to A class championships, but there were many at Hershey. Does TOB charge a fee? yes, and that irritates some folks, but hey, we gotta pay for the facility and the space used. at Wildwood for indoor championships, Bush has consistently been the one corps there every year. love ya man, but please so not speak inaccurately about what TOB does or does not do. As a member of the administration team on a local level, judge and guy doing a lot of the website updating, I'm very qualified to say your above statement is 100% inaccurate Edited September 17, 2013 by Jeff Ream 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted September 17, 2013 Share Posted September 17, 2013 Not disagreeing with you nor your thoughts, actually. The thing is, USBANDS is YEA!'s sandbox to play in and they can do what they please with it, regardless of how any of us perceive what is or isn't fair. They perhaps over-aggressively promote their brand, and it can be a real two edged sword as a result. I think part of the frustration you have may be the "perceived value" issue by a parent like you, and it's extremely legit for a Mom or Dad to ask why the membership tuition/fees/dues in total are significantly higher in C2 than with anyone else in DCA that I'm aware of. With no one else there to compare with at another recruiting stand... those kinds of hard questions don't get asked. And from my experience, when I have asked those questions, they wiggle a lot in an uneasy way and I really don't get answers. I get evaded. But-- I'd think a smart parent would look into that sort of thing and discuss it with their kids. At least I'd hope so. It's why I ended up where I did, cost and distance were significant factors in my case. I still came out ahead in the long run. exactly. YEA is paying for the stadium at the shows they sponsor, so they can do with the space as they like. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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