Cavies 1982

[onfirepro]

Does anyone have any thoughts on why they feel the cavies scored so low in 1982? That was their "pines" show. I felt it was a really tight, solid, and entertaining show start to finish. I didn't hear anything in their brass that should have dropped them to dead last in that category. They certainly weren't up with the higher echelon corps, but last (really last)in brass? Their visual was really good that year too. It just seems that was a better show than several of the corps that placed above them. Why so low? Any opinions? Do some of you agree that they got robbed, or are their some who can point out why they deserved 11th? Just curious.

Edited September 12, 2013 by onfirepro

[Stu]

In the 1982 Championships The Cavaliers moved from overall 12th place on Friday to overall 11th on Saturday; so I do not see this as a scoring issue. However, the venue was such an echo chamber that the reverb from all the Friday corps shows was still bouncing around in the dome when the Cavaliers hit the field on Saturday; that might have caused a few performance issues.

[cixelsyd]

In the 1982 Championships The Cavaliers moved from overall 12th place on Friday to overall 11th on Saturday; so I do not see this as a scoring issue. However, the venue was such an echo chamber that the reverb from all the Friday corps shows was still bouncing around in the dome when the Cavaliers hit the field on Saturday; that might have caused a few performance issues. :alien:/>

Cute - but since prelims were in a different venue, the only previous performances in Olympic Stadium were those of Alliance and the Chatelaines.

[Stu]

Cute - but since prelims were in a different venue, the only previous performances in Olympic Stadium were those of Alliance and the Chatelaines.

If you have grand kids you'll understand this: Facts should never get in the way of turning things into a good story!!

Edited September 12, 2013 by Stu

[oldtimefan]

Does anyone have any thoughts on why they feel the cavies scored so low in 1982? That was their "pines" show. I felt it was a really tight, solid, and entertaining show start to finish. I didn't hear anything in their brass that should have dropped them to dead last in that category. They certainly weren't up with the higher echelon corps, but last (really last)in brass? Their visual was really good that year too. It just seems that was a better show than several of the corps that placed above them. Why so low? Any opinions? Do some of you agree that they got robbed, or are their some who can point out why they deserved 11th? Just curious.

My two cents after having watched these entire top twelve shows on my time off. This season was a good one, ( like we have bad ones), but that said, Pines was my favorite SECOND half of a show, great powerful, and listenable music, but their first half was lacking compared to that ending. Maybe it was the effect? Just an unaswerable question to answer your question? I have a friend that I have lost touch with ( time and distance apart ) Dave Huntley, you out there????, that marched that year in the snare line. If I run in to him again i will ask.

[Slingerland]

Very good visual execution corps (5th in M&M in prelims), good percussion and guard, pretty nasty hornline, and only 4 minutes of well-chosen music ("Pines") followed by 8 minutes of dreck.

Staff was a combination of one new guy in visual (Brubaker, writing his first drill for Cavaliers) and a couple of retreads on music (Spalding and Cliff Colnot, both of whom wrote for the corps in the 70s). After that year, Brubaker was the only one who was kept on.

Still, I think you can look at the opener and see the seeds of what eventually became the Cavaliers of the mid-80s through the 90s, so the season wasn't a total bust.

[onfirepro]

Very good visual execution corps (5th in M&M in prelims), good percussion and guard, pretty nasty hornline, and only 4 minutes of well-chosen music ("Pines") followed by 8 minutes of dreck.

You're right. When I listen straight through to all the corps in succession, with the three corps leading up to them (Bridgemen, Freelancers and Skyryders) the Cavies have a noticeable drop in brass quality. I hear some nastiness not just in the hornline, but phasing problems in the opener with the lower brass too, and an overall anemic brass sound in general. (with some intonation problems to boot). And either the Skyryders really came up a notch at championships, or the Cavaliers had a rough night, because the Cavies beat the Skyryders throughout the season in every single contest they were both in until championships.

Edited September 19, 2013 by onfirepro

[onfirepro]

Pines was my favorite SECOND half of a show, great powerful, and listenable music, but their first half was lacking compared to that ending.

Actually, 82 was the year they opened with pines, it was '83 and '84 that they closed with it.

[BeenThereDoneThat]

Very good visual execution corps (5th in M&M in prelims), good percussion and guard, pretty nasty hornline, and only 4 minutes of well-chosen music ("Pines") followed by 8 minutes of dreck.

Staff was a combination of one new guy in visual (Brubaker, writing his first drill for Cavaliers) and a couple of retreads on music (Spalding and Cliff Colnot, both of whom wrote for the corps in the 70s). After that year, Brubaker was the only one who was kept on.

Still, I think you can look at the opener and see the seeds of what eventually became the Cavaliers of the mid-80s through the 90s, so the season wasn't a total bust.

[BeenThereDoneThat]

Minor correction: 1982 Visual Staff consisted of Steve Brubaker and Jeff Fiedler, who hired former Crossmen drum major Mark Metz (now Dr. Metz) and myself from outside the organization. Dr. Metz and myself were assigned the task of coordinating the marching basics and fundamentals program during the winter, and developing a distinctive style and technique. One which, in the words of a member from that time, former staff member, and current marching band judge, "was good enough for twenty-five years." The "one new guy" for '81 in visual, the late Steve Brubaker, whom we all loved and respected, and Jeff Fiedler, who evoked the same emotions, are members of the D.C.I Hall of Fame. Look at the Cavalier's winter guard '81- '83, for example. Thanks to Steve and staff: W.G.I.champions! The summer guards were always better than good!

Messrs. Brubaker, Fiedler, and I were there, along with some new faces in '83. (That year a real injustice was done in Miami regarding the visual program. [italics mine.])

Members trained by Dr. Metz and myself later became staff. The legacy continued.

Dr. Metz went on to became a D.C.I. judge. I later instructed the second of the two top five D.C.I. corps in which I had marched: Bobby Hoffman '75 Blue Stars (5th - 2nd in M&M), and Norman Wheeler, '77 Phantom Regiment (2nd - 2nd in M&M), a future D.C.I. judge. I later worked under Norman Wheeler, esq., and the late John Brazale, a D.C.I Hall of Famer, while on the Phantom staff. All good people. I will always speak up and support and defend their legacies and memories. They earned it, and deserve it.

To have the opportunity to march for, work with, and work for such luminaries in the field, genuine, quality individuals, is something I will always cherish. I continue to respect, appreciate, think about, and miss them all.

If you believe the Wikipedia articles, regarding the Cavaliers and Phantom Regiment:

The Cavaliers (staff 1982-1983) - "During the early 1980s, the judges were looking for "cutting edge" performances, and they were not getting them from the Cavaliers. However, the Cavies' winter guard was providing that cutting edge under the leadership of Steve Brubaker, winning the Winter Guard International championship in 1981-83. In 1982, Brubaker, who had also been working with the Cavalier Cadets corps since '78, was named head drill designer for the Cavaliers. This brought about a change in attitude and, along with the music selections becoming more and more classically oriented, eventually saw the Cavaliers rise to the top half of DCI Finalists. . . . It took some time, though. 1982's Pines of Rome started the season with near-disastrous results, and the corps felt that it was luck as much as talent that earned the corps an eleventh place finish at DCI in Montreal." (It was unrecognized and unappreciated effort and talent. They deserved better. [italics mine.]) As Slingerland stated above: "Still, I think you can look at the opener and see the seeds of what eventually became the Cavaliers of the mid-80s through the 90s, so the season wasn't a total bust." That's what we hoped to achieve, and liked to think so, too. Thank you.

The Phantom Regiment (staff 1985-1987) - "The corps that is recognized today began in 1987.

After a difficult 10th-place finish in 1986, the corps took a fresh new approach. The corps made a dramatic change inspired by Michael Cesario, with new all-white uniforms more closely resembling costumes. This new look and approach led to three years of dramatic improvement, culminating in 1989 with a second-place finish and the second highest score ever, at the time, 98.4."

To be there, involved in setting the cornerstone for building the foundation of two great D.C.I. success stories is priceless. Thank you to David Kampschroer, Bobby Hoffman, Colin Kloss; Bob Lendman, Norman Wheeler, Bob Grier; Don Warren, Adolph DeGrauwe, Steve Brubaker, Jeff Fiedler; John Brazale, Norman Wheeler, Mark Glascoe, and all the D.C.I. judges who mentored, educated, and guided me, especially those from the C.S.J.A.. I owed it all to you.

I'll reserve any further comments about the Cavaliers' respective placings in '82 and '83. (We were better than that.)

Edited September 25, 2013 by BeenThereDoneThat